Marble Madness 2: Marble Man

[+x=usr(1536)]

On 8/1/2021 at 1:09 AM, prOk said:

Greedy little shits.  Something's better than nothing.

It's always good to see someone's true attitude come to the forefront.  Now there's one more forum where that's documented, which is nice.

 

For the casual reader: welcome to the cesspit that is the arcade game collecting community.  Yes, it really is - rather unfortunately - like this a lot of the time.

[+x=usr(1536)]

On 8/1/2021 at 8:16 AM, Tornadoboy said:

My god, imagine if a Bouncer ever turns up?

If that ever should come to pass, I truly hope that absolutely no announcement of it being found is made prior to its release.

 

There are just too many adult children in this hobby these days.

 

 

[SlappyHappy2000]

Hello, everyone! I'm new to this forum, and as a cool first impression I'd like to share some neat stuff I found about Marble Madness II; Marble Man. Specifically, 2 documents concerning stuff about the game.

Some people might already know about these, but I really don't care, as I'm doing this for the people who didn't know.

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20080724094017/http://www.atarigames.com/page5/files/page5_5.pdf

The first document appears to be a request to revise Marble Man. This is the fabled part where they decided for sure they wanted to ditch the trakballs for those cool new radical joysticks!!! Other changes are requested here as well, such as a change to remove most of those dumbass score flags that appeared everywhere (which they replaced with more dumbass trail lights, who needs trail lights in a game where you only have to progress downwards??), changes to game mechanics, and a change to completely remove Marble Man from the game (indicating which version on YouTube is older than the other!!), as well as changing the voices, cabinet artwork, etc. etc. blah blah blah read it yourself. It provides an insight on the reasons behind some of the decisions that would propel Marble Man forward... right into cancellation.

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20110914075932/http://www.atarigames.com/page5/files/page5_4.pdf

This is the second document, which appears to be an early instructions manual for operating the Marble Man arcade cabinet! (the earlier version, also with trakballs!) Extensive details about the inner tidbits of the machine are provided, which is really cool, but the thing that interested me the most were the pictures provided in the manual. Some isolated sprites allow you to see how some of the enemies looked up close, but there are also gameplay screenshots! Low quality, yes, but two of them are from stages that haven't been seen anywhere else online! In Marble Madness II, there appears to be another ice stage (I know it's not the Icebox race because of the snowman enemies in the picture, which did NOT appear in the Icebox race), and a weird stage with some plates and forks and shit.

 

Can't wait to die to a fork when the ROM definitely gets released... ?

[Supergun]

This is how much love Marble Madness 2 gets in Florida.

?

 

They haven’t even unpacked them yet. ?

[Supergun]

Picture Placeholder

Edited November 20, 2021 by Supergun

[Supergun]

Some more details on this.

 

So this picture was taken at the 2021 Freeplay Florida Show. Today was day 1 of the 3 day show. Nothing changed with those 2 machines. Someone parked them there at the start of the show. And I stayed until the very end and the 2 cabinets never moved from where they were.

 

There was also a third Marble Madness 2 cabinet at the show, and this one was unwrapped and set up near other machines.

 

The most interesting thing I observed was that those 2 cabinets actually had 3 very large trackball sized holes on their control panels. So it would appear that the game program code has now been modified to work with trackballs.

 

Anyhow, I will be there again tomorrow and I will report back with whatever I’m able to uncover.

[Supergun]

So here’s pretty much the final outcome of this entire saga.

 

The game was finally set up and plugged in for the show today. And here is a picture of the cabinet.

 

 

The game code on the board in this cabinet had been modified and tweaked for improved joystick play.

 

In another room, they had set up 2 more cabinets as part of a discussion panel which they gave.

 

This one had the control panel configured for trackballs.

 

This one had the control panel configured for joysticks.

 

Although still not completed, the games rom data is being modified to use trackballs and should be finished shortly.

 

They also had a table set up where they had print outs available of the marquee and side art.

 

Basically, the cabinets are going to be made available to operators and arcades so that the game will become accessible for as many people as possible to play.

 

So basically, Marble Madness 2 is coming soon to an arcade near you.

[BobTheOompaLoompa]

Appreciate everything you've done to cover this game Supergun! None of us would have been able to follow this story without your help, and for that I thank you. Looks like everything is finally coming to an end and we'll be able to experience MM2 someday once the game reaches us at our local arcades. I've definitely brought this up to mine and we've had interesting discussions regarding it. 

 

Even though there was some controversy and negative feelings towards the whole situation with this I still will be very happy to play it for myself. Feels like the end to a very long wait to something I've been following for over eight years now, and yes I know most people say it's not worth keeping your hopes up or the game doesn't play anywhere near the original. But it still will be exciting for me nonetheless. Here's to another piece of history that will finally, hopefully lol, be made public for all to see and enjoy.

[prOk]

Thanks billy for posting the pictures.  The two machines that stayed wrapped were for the panel discussion on what went into making the game never really intended to be on the game floor but the third was fully out there all weekend to be played.  Both games were plugged in and working during the panel.  Monday we just were missing the power pigtails to plug things in from the power company.

 

Everything on these games is produced from the original Atari CAD files.  The harnesses, cabinets, metal parts.. all custom made to those specs.  An intense amount of work went into getting the game code adapted to a board that is actually obtainable and made by Atari.  Bugs were fixed all over the place to make it the game it was meant to be.  Call it whatever you want, it's a labor of love for the games for me as I have and will make zero money for my part in all of it and I personally own nothing of the originals but I have absolutely enjoyed the experience of making it happen and I'm thankful I was able to be involved.

 

But, the fact remains, they are here and they will end up in arcades around the country and perhaps in other countries.  It was a very painstaking, time consuming and expensive endeavor to build these to the exact Atari specifications to give the game a chance to live again Atari's way.  I'm sorry it can't be done on what some people believe are the correct 'terms', but after all these years of speculation we actually did make it happen and we did it the way we wanted to by building real cabinets as close as humanly possible to how Atari wanted them built.  You will be able to play it and decide if it's a great game or just bleh on your own!  That's a cool thing!   If you want to spin that as a negative thing because you can't have it for mame that's on you, whatever your opinion is is fine with me but it just wasn't an option at this time.  Nobody knows how it will go in the future but for now, that is the wish and we're following it.  For me, preservation is more than just a rom file, it's the entire game.  Cabinet, art, monitor, all of it goes into what the game truly is and for me is the best way to preserve and share a game for the future.   Some folks insist on being negative constantly and that's fine if not completely predictable.  Either way, for those that want to just enjoy the game please do when you see one when the first ones get delivered in early 2022.

[Tempest]

So what was all fixed/changed from the original prototype?

[Crimefighter]

So there's a chance Galloping Ghost Arcade gets this game....

[Supergun]

I think the somewhat recent “Nintendo Sky Skipper” arcade cabinet story may have been one of the “motivators” or “inspirations” for handling Atari’s Marble Madness 2 in this unique way. And I personally don’t have a problem with it, but, nor do I have a preference either. While I can both understand and appreciate the concept of “preservation” when it comes to video games, I don’t necessarily feel as compelled to do so when it comes to unreleased video games. But again, this is merely my personal preference or opinion if you will. It doesn’t mean your wrong and I’m right. To each his own. After all, nobody can truly fault whatever the owners of these unreleased games decide to do (or not do) with them.

 

Regardless however, when it comes to this game, at the end of the day we will all be able to see and play and even own it, as we choose. And that’s a great thing, no doubt. But for me, the only “real” component here is the actual game itself. (the Jamma board itself, specifically, if you will) For me, that is all that matters (mattered). As a recent example, Midway’s Power Up Baseball or “MLB JAM” as it is better known, has its place on my shelves alongside all of my other arcade boards. And that’s all I ever need whenever I play it. Space is a premium and fully dressed arcade cabinets just take up too much room.

 

And for the record, Atari would surely have released conversion kits of this game, just as they did with Rampart, Off the Wall, Klax, Batman, Shuuz, etc. (all being similar circa late 80’s/early 90’s Atari arcade games) but not trying to split hairs, merely pointing that fact out. Besides, anyone who really wants it that badly, could simply buy an entire cabinet anyway and scrap it! So it’s a moot point.

 

But again, the game is available! And that’s a wonderful thing and truly all that matters. (mattered) And so we give big thanks for that.

[schuwalker]

On 12/5/2021 at 10:00 PM, Supergun said:

 

And for the record, Atari would surely have released conversion kits of this game, just as they did with Rampart, Off the Wall, Klax, Batman, Shuuz, etc. (all being similar circa late 80’s/early 90’s Atari arcade games) but not trying to split hairs, merely pointing that fact out. Besides, anyone who really wants it that badly, could simply buy an entire cabinet anyway and scrap it! So it’s a moot point.

 

 

What makes you think that though if the game tested poorly on location?

[Supergun]

27 minutes ago, schuwalker said:

What makes you think that though if the game tested poorly on location?

I was stating that within the context of HAD Atari released the game, it would surely have been available both as a dedicated cabinet and as a conversion kit.

 

(obviously they never released it at all in ANY way, shape, or form)

 

Look at Rampart as an example. It was available as a 3 player trackball version and as a 2 player joystick version. Just as this game had/has both joystick and trackball playability.

[Kinnijup]

Thanks Supergun!

[VGMaps]

Interesting that there's talk about this again lately.

 

This past Sunday, an anonymous source, who has access to the Marble Madness II ROM, contributed screenshot maps of all 17 mazes:
http://vgmaps.com/Atlas/Arcade/index.htm#MarbleMadnessII

 

Here's the "Practice" maze, but see that link above for all of them.

 

So you can at least see the mazes, pixel-perfectly as they are.  This is from the latest known version of Marble Madness II where "Marble Man" and all mentions of him have been removed.

 

There's some development notes and a few direct screenshots here, provided by the same anonymous source:

https://www.vgmaps.com/forums/index.php?topic=2109.msg22552#msg22552

 

And no, don't bother asking who it is; the anonymous source will not give anyone the ROM anyway.

[Tempest]

18 minutes ago, VGMaps said:

So you can at least see the mazes, pixel-perfectly as they are.  This is from the latest known version of Marble Madness II where "Marble Man" and all mentions of him have been removed.

I didn't know they scrubbed Marble Man from MM II before cancelling it.  Interesting.  Is there a history of the game posted somewhere?

[negative1]

20 minutes ago, VGMaps said:

Interesting that there's talk about this again lately.

 

This past Sunday, an anonymous source, who has access to the Marble Madness II ROM, contributed screenshot maps of all 17 mazes:
http://vgmaps.com/Atlas/Arcade/index.htm#MarbleMadnessII

 

Here's the "Practice" maze, but see that link above for all of them.

 

So you can at least see the mazes, pixel-perfectly as they are.  This is from the latest known version of Marble Madness II where "Marble Man" and all mentions of him have been removed.

 

There's some development notes and a few direct screenshots here, provided by the same anonymous source:

https://www.vgmaps.com/forums/index.php?topic=2109.msg22552#msg22552

 

And no, don't bother asking who it is; the anonymous source will not give anyone the ROM anyway.

Wow, thanks for posting that. That is so cool to see these after all these years.

 

feels like we're getting closer.

 

later

-1

[VGMaps]

2 hours ago, Tempest said:

I didn't know they scrubbed Marble Man from MM II before cancelling it.  Interesting.  Is there a history of the game posted somewhere?

I posted a link to the topic on the VGMaps.com forums, where some of it was discussed: https://www.vgmaps.com/forums/index.php?topic=2109.msg22552#msg22552

But regarding the changes, here is the document anyway:

 

As you can see, point A is about the control method, and point B is about "Marble Man" and his upcoming deletion.

Edited December 10, 2021 by VGMaps

[Tempest]

Neat.  Is there footage of the Marble Man version anywhere online?  I'm kind of curious about how dorky it looked now.

[Tempest]

I found a video of the beta Marble Man version and I have to agree with all the points made in those documents.  Marble Man was kind of pointless and stupid and those weird grunt and scream sounds were kind of off putting.

[Keatah]

On 12/5/2021 at 10:00 PM, Supergun said:

But again, the game is available! And that’s a wonderful thing and truly all that matters. (mattered) And so we give big thanks for that.

It is? Where can I get it?

[negative1]

On 12/10/2021 at 2:31 PM, Keatah said:

It is? Where can I get it?

there's information over at the KLOV forums:

"This will not be a 'kit' or an add on to anything else nor will it be a multiboard. Trackball support is a hope to do feature, but the boards right now play the original game. It's not trivial to add trackball back into the game as a few key aspects were made a certain way due to joysticks being the 'official' control method."

 

later

-1

[SlappyHappy2000]

Hey guys check this out
 

 

[Place Logo Here]

I cannot thank you enough for posting that longplay.

 

This is going to sound back-handed, but it isn't meant to: I am grateful because now I feel I didn't miss much by never getting to play the game.

 

The original Marble Madness may have the greatest disparity between how much I love a game compared to how bad I am at it.  I was, and still am, reeeeeeeally bad at Marble Madness.

 

I felt deep frustration almost the entire time I watched the playthrough, and that is just me watching somebody else play.  And while there is a lot of new content, very little of it seemed to translate into innovative gameplay. 

 

Really, the power-ups and the water level are the only thing that caught my attention--everything else was just window-dressing.  Whether one is crushed by the black marble, jackhammers, fists, bricks or trolls, is there really a difference?  I felt a strong twinge of nostalgia when we finally saw the deadly slinky tube creatures, because they still somehow had more personality and strangeness than anything new to this sequel.