Coleco Chameleon .... hardware speculations?

[thevnaguy]

We know that thenavguy here on the forums is friend with Mike and his further silence likely attests that even him at this point has no way to dispell the allegations (no blame on his friendship, that has nothing to do with the point I'd like to make), do we know if anyone here on the forums is friend with Woita just to see if they can get his opinion, point of view?

 

I believe Pipercub admires/knows Phil Adams, any chance to get Phil reactions on what is going on?

 

It'll be interesting to know PikoInteractive impressions of what he saw and what we think he was exposed to instead (I believe it to be a SNES mini).

He had a SNES game PCB with him and that cannot be coincidence, I wonder if that's what Mike promised (the CC will play your SNES games natively) or he mentioned that the current "proto" had a SNES cart connector but that would change so it was just a chance to try out if the game even works.

Just sitting on the sidelines phoenixdownita, drinking my absente, working on some vids and editing podcasts and making notes to record the Channel F Files with Pipercub soon

[galax]

I vaguely remember in ye olde tymes of yore (last autumn, lol) some kind of discussion from Mike and his cronies that they would develop adapters for carts from classic systems for the RVGS. Though i cannot remember if it was really official or sideline speculation.

That was from the RVGS team, when they were basically brainstorming in public and just adding whatever features people suggested; they were up to about 4 or 5 different video output connectors too at one point.

[rjchamp3]

I would also like to hear from others involved besides mike himself. I'm told Steve Woita sometimes frequents AA and the facebook group. I'd like someone to do an interview with people on the team who aren't Mike Kennedy. I'd like to see a niche console added to the market and I'd love to see indie devs able to put their game on a new platform. I'm amazed that we're this far in and still we get smoke and mirrors. I want to believe. This "team" makes it insanely difficult to believe anything without suffering from a massive stroke.

 

I don't think most of us are on a witch hunt. I don't think most of us are out to defraud Mike or his team. Besides the fake CC twitter account, I haven't seen anyone go out of their way to lie about the Chameleon. All bad press has been because of Mike making promises he can't keep and or blaming former team members for things.

 

I guess we get to wait until the 26th to see what is under the jaguar curtain. I fully expect just more poorly done 3D renders and a bunch of poorly edited videos at this point. Maybe a couple more excuses that money is needed to fund the dream.

 

I'm tired of sitting on the fence. I'm tired of looking at the burnt bridge. Either put the horse in a race or bury it already.

Good Luck tried SAME garbage no responses and these people are on my FB lol

[PlaysWithWolves]

With the RVGS, MK officially announced* the cartridge adapter -- which actually generated some interest -- then IGG came around a couple or so weeks later and they'd been dropped.

 

 

*Well, I guess it depends on what your definition of "officially" officially is.

[jaybird3rd]

I have been accused of spreading conspiracy theories on Facebook for asking a simple question. Posing a simple solution to the crap storm that Mike and company have caused for themselves.

 

https://www.facebook.com/Scenic7PR/posts/10207477997284688

 

I have received reports from show attendees and it was obviously not all roses and cherry coke in the Chameleon booth.

From the looks of the comment thread, in response to your follow-up questions, it seems that everyone is claiming that they can't say anything because they're all under an NDA, and that we should all "just hang in there until the Kickstarter campaign, because all our questions will be answered and we'll all change our minds because it will be totally awesome." We've heard the same reassurances so many times from so many people that it makes me think they're all reading from the same script.

 

I'd love to hear the attendees' reports from Toy Fair.

[Shawn]

 

 

As an example, Shawn has a listing on eBay with a dope ass fucking 5200 system on there. If I said his custom controller didn't work, he wouldn't pull the guts out of that shit and show it works? Of course he would. I don't ever believe for a second if I told Kevtris his FPGA can't run Pick-Axe Pete and dozens/hundreds were behind me he wouldn't be like, "bitch, I can run that shit!" and show off the details.

 

 

 

ALL DAY!

[retroillucid]

From the looks of the comment thread, in response to your follow-up questions, it seems that everyone is claiming that they can't say anything because they're all under an NDA, and that we should all "just hang in there until the Kickstarter campaign, because all our questions will be answered and we'll all change our minds because it will be totally awesome." We've heard that so many times from so many people that it makes me think they're all reading from the same script.

 

I'd love to hear the attendees' reports from Toy Fair.

 

https://pikointeractive.com/blog/back-from-the-ny-toy-fair-2016-coleco-chameleon-edition/

[galax]

Did this get posted yet? https://pikointeractive.com/blog/back-from-the-ny-toy-fair-2016-coleco-chameleon-edition/ [edit: oh yes while I was typing... ]

 

 

Back from the NY Toy Fair 2016 – Coleco Chameleon Edition.

[...]

I was hoping to see the intestines of the console, however I was not able to see the insides to confirm or deny the console rumors flowing on the internet the very first day of the show. I tried as much as possible to gather information about the insides of the console. My overall impression of the team was that Mike Kennedy has put all his 110% trust on his hardware guy; I knew from the beginning that Mike was not a hardware engineer and had just basic knowledge of how the console was going to be working and what things were going to do what. So I requested to have a call with the person responsible of all the techno talk (I will keep anonymous until the day of the Kickstarter; although I only got a very common shortname from him). I asked him to debunk the rumors and he assured me that the console was not a SNES mini inside a Jag shell. At this moment I am putting 100% of my trust Coleco Chameleon’s Hardware developer and hope to see the final specs and PCB reveal (as everybody else) the date of the Kickstarter; at the end of the day, I believe that he is the one that should have all the weight on his shoulders and be responsible on what Mike or the CCH team say and show when it comes to the system/proto. I requested a couple of times to see the Proto board of the console, if they wanted my confirmation or statement on record regarding the rumors, but I was told that the proto was put together by hand and even using scrap parts to get something working for the show, so it was not safe to open the case as we could break something (I witnessed the console acting up several times actually).

 

The Hardware developer then revealed what it seemed to be spec details on the console which I will keep undisclosed until the KS is launched out of pure honor, ethics, respect, whatever you call it. These details, if correct and part of the final and commercial version of the console, would make a heck of a good system! If what we were playing on at the Toy Show was indeed a FGPA powered system, then we are coming into exciting times on the retro gaming scene as well as the game developers/hobbyist scene (he told me other details that involve developers, and If what understood was correct, the console will be sooooo coooool!).

[...]

This whole put together by hand from scrap parts thing doesn't make much sense to me. If it really was built from perfboard, scrap parts, and wires, would it fit nicely into that shell?

Edited February 15, 2016 by galax

[+Random Terrain]

 

ALL DAY!

I bet if you went nutty and sliced open a clown from nips to nightstick, the stuff that falls out would look very much like that.

[rjchamp3]

Maybe If Mike got back to people he wouldn't have this issue

[rjchamp3]

With the RVGS, MK officially announced* the cartridge adapter -- which actually generated some interest -- then IGG came around a couple or so weeks later and they'd been dropped.

 

 

*Well, I guess it depends on what your definition of "officially" officially is.

old news

[bunnyboy]

Regarding that ... it's been told many times over that the purchase of the molds saved literally 500K$ ... I'd be interested if in these days and age it is even true anymore.

 

 

It cost me ~$30k (friend rate) for a few concepts and the solidworks model for my AVS, ~$7k in 3d prints and CNC versions for fitting, and ~$45k for the tooling including controller ports and cart slot. If he would be copying something like Jaguar anyways then the first 2 aren't needed. The Jaguar tooling is designed for a million parts instead of tens of thousands so it would be more expensive, but that isn't important at the quantities he will actually sell.

 

My prototype looks better than his too! https://www.facebook.com/retroUSB/photos/a.1027304100682326.1073741827.1027068990705837/1060350117377724/?type=3&theater

[rjchamp3]

Dumb Quotes :

 

As long as you have the cart you have the game

 

We are gonna make solid durable carts

 

UM yeah carts usually don't go and you will always have the game

 

Play yesterday again???

[triverse]

 

 

It cost me ~$30k (friend rate) for a few concepts and the solidworks model for my AVS, ~$7k in 3d prints and CNC versions for fitting, and ~$45k for the tooling including controller ports and cart slot. If he would be copying something like Jaguar anyways then the first 2 aren't needed. The Jaguar tooling is designed for a million parts instead of tens of thousands so it would be more expensive, but that isn't important at the quantities he will actually sell.

 

My prototype looks better than his too! https://www.facebook.com/retroUSB/photos/a.1027304100682326.1073741827.1027068990705837/1060350117377724/?type=3&theater

There are a few companies that are coming out with single platform retro consoles that will support HDMI out and other features that we all probably wish for any such console. This area is getting hot fast and it is going to pass the Chameleon by rather quickly.

[Keatah]

From the PikoInteractive website:

 

"I was happy to see that the Coleco brand owners are actually interested in this project and have very cool Ideas for future releases on the console (like a 16bit remake of Coleco classics; did I just leaked something? wups!)"

 

16-bit Zaxxon? 16-bit Cosmic Avenger? very cool indeed!

 

 

"The Hardware developer then revealed what it seemed to be spec details on the console which I will keep undisclosed until the KS is launched out of pure honor, ethics, respect, whatever you call it. These details, if correct and part of the final and commercial version of the console, would make a heck of a good system! If what we were playing on at the Toy Show was indeed a FGPA powered system, then we are coming into exciting times on the retro gaming scene as well as the game developers/hobbyist scene (he told me other details that involve developers, and If what understood was correct, the console will be sooooo coooool!)."

 

Sounds like it'll be a hot product. With a killer console, mike doesn't need to answer questions or waste time putting out fires in this thread. The console will stand on its own and speak for itself.

 

 

"I asked him to debunk the rumors and he assured me that the console was not a SNES mini inside a Jag shell."

 

Well that is certainly good. If true, and why wouldn't it be if PikoInteractive says so? Someone is going to come away from this looking like an asshole. Either the RetroVGS guys and supporters will OR the naysayers on Atari Age. Who will it be?

[TheClassyGamer]

There are a few companies that are coming out with single platform retro consoles that will support HDMI out and other features that we all probably wish for any such console. This area is getting hot fast and it is going to pass the Chameleon by rather quickly.

 

Those would be something that I would have quite a bit of interest in hearing about. If you get any more information on that please pass it on.

[Reaperman]

Suddenly I realized that the 'socal mike' shyster on various forums and 'parrothead' were the same person. Thanks to recent links.

Any residual respect is gone.

 

I (sadly) was stationed in socal for many years, and this is the very person who lives there. Fake is normal for them. Real people are morons to be used. Middle school mentality is all they know. Suddenly this all makes some sense.

Edited February 15, 2016 by Reaperman

[triverse]

 

Those would be something that I would have quite a bit of interest in hearing about. If you get any more information on that please pass it on.

I definitely will but I will make sure it is posted in the correct forums (if you don't mind, I will PM you, if I remember, when more info is made publicly available).

 

I am being called a hater by some key people I used to respect in this fiasco. Rather a shame. The lines are quickly being drawn and people that I thought were friends are showing me that I can either join in supporting the Coleco Chameleon, based on their promises that it is real, or well I should just go away. lol Not doing either folks. Not doing either.

[phoenixdownita]

Well, if Mike hired the only VHDL/Verilog dev in the world that has a fully working FPGA core for the SNES with HDMI video support, that alone is a hell of a score.

At the same time a new FPGA based fully compatible SNES motherboard with HDMI video that can fit existing SNES cases would be able to sell for the same (if not more) than the 150US$ of the CC [check kevtris HDMI NES here http://www.game-tech.us/hi-def-modded-nes-console-sales-info/for comparison].

 

Somehow something does not add up, again!

Edited February 15, 2016 by phoenixdownita

[mickcris]

Well if the hardware guy says so it must be true. Why would he lie.

 

I guess there is a chance that Mike did not know it was an SNES mini and the hardware guy is lying. Their excuse as to why they couldn't open it sounds like bs though. There is so much pointing to it being an SNES mini and really nothing to disprove it except for the word of the rvgs team.

[jaybird3rd]

I requested a couple of times to see the Proto board of the console, if they wanted my confirmation or statement on record regarding the rumors, but I was told that the proto was put together by hand and even using scrap parts to get something working for the show, so it was not safe to open the case as we could break something (I witnessed the console acting up several times actually).

Sounds like a fragile prototype. I wonder how it made it all the way to the show without breaking. If it was really that fragile, one would think they'd have a hardware guy on standby at the show to patch it back together again in case it broke (and to wire up the power LED while he was there). But since it was robust enough to survive the trip, it seems like it should have been robust enough to survive a lift of the lid for a few quick pics.

[InnovaX5]

Seriously, at this point mike is going to tell it he assembled it at the show all by himself. Why was a black jag shell used for this? We all know he has a ton of clear ones. Let me guess, because someone might steal his amazing board and beat him to the punch? Patent is still pending? Come on...

[phoenixdownita]

Just sitting on the sidelines phoenixdownita, drinking my absente, working on some vids and editing podcasts and making notes to record the Channel F Files with Pipercub soon

I have to make a joke out of it, nothing personal against you, I can't resist.

 

Coleco Chameleon Absente Edition : the only edition we would care about but was not there

 

PS: I know, after the big KS reveal I will have to apologize but for now it's fun making up CC special editions names.

Edited February 15, 2016 by phoenixdownita

[elmer]

Sounds like a fragile prototype. I wonder how it made it all the way to the show without breaking. If it was really that fragile, one would think they'd have a hardware guy on standby at the show to patch it back together again in case it broke (and to wire up the power LED while he was there). But since it was robust enough to survive the trip, it seems like it should have been robust enough to survive a lift of the lid for a few quick pics.

 

Even simpler ... did the hardware guy really not take any pictures of the board/assembly before he sent-it/gave-it to Mike, either for insurance, historical-record. or cover-my-ass reasons?

 

The whole excuse is just BS.

 

You're not going to design a cobbled-together-with-spit-and-duct-tape system that uses a salvaged SNES-Jr back-half when there's plenty of FPGA prototype boards that you can buy off-the-shelf that will let you demo your wonderful new SNES FPGA core ... if you actually have one.

 

There's plenty of circuit-diagrams for adding an MSX cartridge adapter board to an off-the-shelf Altera DE1/DE2/DE2-115 board ... you can't tell me that IF they really wanted to prototype an FPGA core with a SNES cartridge port, that they couldn't have done the same.

Edited February 15, 2016 by elmer

[atm94404]

From the PikoInteractive website:

 

Mike was not a hardware engineer and had just basic knowledge of how the console was going to be working and what things were going to do what. So I requested to have a call with the person responsible of all the techno talk (I will keep anonymous until the day of the Kickstarter; although I only got a very common shortname from him). I asked him to debunk the rumors and he assured me that the console was not a SNES mini inside a Jag shell. At this moment I am putting 100% of my trust Coleco Chameleon’s Hardware developer and hope to see the final specs and PCB reveal (as everybody else) the date of the Kickstarter; at the end of the day, I believe that he is the one that should have all the weight on his shoulders and be responsible on what Mike or the CCH team say and show when it comes to the system/proto.

 

And here comes Mike's plausible deniability. "I'm not a hardware guy. He told me it was an FPGA running an SNES core. I've been duped just like you guys." This anonymous HW guy is being set up as essentially John 2.0: The Next Scapegoat

 

 

 

I requested a couple of times to see the Proto board of the console, if they wanted my confirmation or statement on record regarding the rumors, but I was told that the proto was put together by hand and even using scrap parts to get something working for the show,

 

They were so pressed for time, yet on their FPGA dev board, they went to the trouble to implement an SNES edge connector, the proprietary SNES video out, the SNES controller port (instead of using the USB port of the dev board) and the SNES power connector. And for extra points they put them in the exact same positions and spacing as an SNES Jr. You'd think if they made this from scratch they would use all that extra space in the front of the Jag shell rather than having those ports protrude out the back and have to be covered by black tape.

 

Look, their new HW guy might be attempting to make an FPGA board, but what was shown at the fair is an SNES Jr. in a Jag shell. Maybe their new HW guy is waiting for the next episode of Ben Heck's series on how to make an FPGA kit before he knows how to finish the CC.