baktra Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 After long time of silence, new version of cassette-oriented utility named Turgen System is available. Download from: https://sourceforge.net/projects/turgen/ and try with your RAMBIT upgraded data recorder. Support for Rambit turbo systemNew Rambit plugin allows you to convert monolithic and segmented binary files to the Rambit system from UK. The new plugin comes with two sets of loaders - original and modern. The modern loaders were updated to increase probability of successful loading of segmented binary files with INIT segments while sacrificing the fancy screen effect of the original loaders. With modern loaders, you can load modern games like Ridiculous Reality. Rambit experience is not limited to data recorders with Rambit upgrade. Owners of data recorders with Czechoslovak Turbo 2000, Polish Turbo 2000F, Turbo ROM, Atari Super Turbo (and clones), or Lower Silesian Turbo can try RAMBIT too if they connect DATA IN and INTERRUPT pins in their SIO connector. Source code of the modernized loaders was released in the updated loaders package (now 1.12) This plugin is brand-new. Please report bugs using the Tickets section. Tape Image ExtractorSelection of non-extractible chunks does not prevent extraction of a boot file. This increases convenience when extracting boot files 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 So I've given this a try seeing as I own a data recorder with the Rambit mod installed. The only files that Turgen likes are XEX files. I have recorded about 5 or 6 onto tapes and tried to load into real Atari. All seems to go well but nothing happens at the end of the loading sequence. It either just hangs or gives a boot error. Is this an issue with the Turgen system or is it just that some XEX (if any) will work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) So I've given this a try seeing as I own a data recorder with the Rambit mod installed. The only files that Turgen likes are XEX files. I have recorded about 5 or 6 onto tapes and tried to load into real Atari. All seems to go well but nothing happens at the end of the loading sequence. It either just hangs or gives a boot error. Is this an issue with the Turgen system or is it just that some XEX (if any) will work? Hello djmat, thank you very much for the testing. 1. You are right, Turgen accepts only binary files (.xex). It doesn't accept (and never will) .atr files. 2. There can be some .xex files that will not work with RAMBIT, but this shouldn't happen often To determine what could be wrong, I would have to ask few questions and make few requests 0. Please re-download and re-install Turgen 8.4.14 1. What .xex files did you try. Can you attach them to your reply? 2. Does the slow (standard part) loads OK ? 3. Did you try modern or original loaders ? 4. Does the original loader display changing colorful GRAPHICS 2 characters on the screen? Does the modern loader display colorful stripes in the background? 5. Can you please try the attached monolithic binary file with original loader and try the "Monolithic binary..." conversion type to test bare minimum functionality? There is a video that display how the loading process (with original loader) should like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usEe7-Yd9dg 6. Are you able to load the same .xex file converted with the "Standard" plugin. Thank you very much River Raid (1983)(Activision)(US)a3.xex Edited February 23, 2016 by baktra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 OK. Tried the River Raid file you attached and won't work. Goes through the whole load procedure just fine but then just gives a boot error at the end. In response to your other questions.... 1. please see attached below some of the files I tried. 2. All parts seem to load as they should 3. Tried both loaders....no difference 4. Both loaders display the graphics or stripes as you described Mat 3-D Tic-Tac-Toe (1979)(Atari).xex Action Quest (1982)(JV).xex Alley Cat (1983)(Synapse).xex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 UPDATE!!! Tried River Raid again but this time I ticked "Invert polarity of pulses" in RAMBIT config and also ticked "use harmonic pulses" in audio generator. Tried original and modern loaders and both worked first time !!!! PROGRESS !!!! Going to try a few others now.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 UPDATE 2 ! Tried this file attached below....HUGE FILE in comparison. Converted as segmented using setting above with modern loader and worked perfectly !! You're a top man for getting the nice program. Finally a use for my Rambit! Master of the Lamps (1985)(Activision)cr Yogi.xex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 Thank you so much for your attempts. I am glad to hear that everything is working. I have two final notes: 1. Invert polarity of pulses - This indicates two things 1. RAMBIT is sensitive to the polarity of pulses 2.An element of your cassette recording chain is probably changing the polarity. It is harmless to music, but can be deadly for computer data. 2. Harmonic pulses - It appears that frequency range of your cassette recording chain is limited and rectangular pulses do not pass in a good shape (it is usually the cassette recorder, cassette, or MP3 compression). You can keep using harmonic pulses or you can try reducing ampltude of the signal. I added the two options to deal exactly with these two situations. It was a good idea after all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Couple of things.... When using the modern loader I've noticed that sometimes the coloured bars fill the screen and other times just the border. Is this normal? Personally I prefer just the border as its not so "in your face" so to speak. Also, are there any plans to make any alternative loaders? What would be great is if a screenshot could be added during the conversion stage so this picture loads at the beginning before the main data. May be asking a bit much but would look great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) There are in fact two modern loaders (and two original as well). One for monolithic binary files - this one fills just the border, and other one for segmented binary files that fills whole screen. The reason for the difference is lack of CPU time to spare (or slow speed of the Atari's CPU). In general, all turbo systems similar to RAMBIT are very CPU intensive - the signal is decoded without assistance of any hardware. The CPU time is very limited, therefore the turbo loaders are forced to take two steps: 1. Disable interrupts (except the one that they use for signal decoding - if they use interrupts. RAMBIT does.) 2. Disable DMA. Try some long delay loop in ATARI BASIC with POKE 559,0 and without it. There will be noticeable difference. Both original RAMBIT loaders disable all interrupts except one and use GRAPHICS 2 screen display (240 bytes - compare with 960 bytes of GRAPHICS 0), therefore the loaders manage to decode the signal on time. The modern loader for monolithic binary files uses GRAPHICS 0 screen display (960 bytes) and also manages to decode the signal on time (but just barely). On the other hand, the modern loader for segmented binary files (performs more complex calculations - it is processing segments of binary file) cannot use GRAPHICS 0. I've tried and it just failed. Therefore I was forced to disable DMA completely, hence the coloured bars on whole screen. Keeping GRAPHICS 2 is not a good idea, see below. The only thing I can do is to find some less "annoying" color scheme for the bars (two alternating, dimmer colors). Such color scheme is used by turbo systems popular in Poland and Czech Republic. See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-u_ahauMKM As for the loaders that display screen shots... the answer is no, but you deserve an explanation For monolithic binary files, it would be possible. However the screen display would be limited to about 960 bytes (for the reason stated above). This would allow some low-resolution and low-color pictures. Another question is how the title screen would be stored. Possibly in one extra high-speed block. I don't think it is worth the effort. For segmented binary files (most of the binary files available in internet game/program archives), it is out of question. A good universal loader of segmented binary files must refrain from any activities that can disrupt the loading process or the loaded program. Displaying pictures or text during the loading process is one of such activities (because you do not know if the loaded program uses the screen memory for something else, for example executable code). This also prevents any progress bars. It is also not good idea to switch graphics modes, because some programs presume that they are started in GRAPHICS 0. There is no guarantee that the screen shots would remain on the display. Segmented binary files can execute any code during the loading process (change display list for example). Yes I am talking about INIT segments. This is also why some program fail to load - they destroy the loader (for example by decompressing data to memory occupied by the loader's executable code). There are no CPU cycles to spare for displaying the screen shot. This is the main reason. Edited February 23, 2016 by baktra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Thanks for the great explanation. I think what you suggested about losing some of the colours of the flashing bars would look better - something similar to how the Spectrum loads (blue and yellow bars of something similar) if this is possible. But all this aside, you have still done a great job with this program and am going to try making some more tapes. Never really took advantage of the Rambit system as using the Atari to convert tapes was so time consuming and very hit and miss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted February 23, 2016 Author Share Posted February 23, 2016 Thanks for the great explanation. I think what you suggested about losing some of the colours of the flashing bars would look better - something similar to how the Spectrum loads (blue and yellow bars of something similar) if this is possible. But all this aside, you have still done a great job with this program and am going to try making some more tapes. Never really took advantage of the Rambit system as using the Atari to convert tapes was so time consuming and very hit and miss. I will most certainly try to change the color bars. Thank you again for testing TURGEN on real Rambit hardware and for your suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 24, 2016 Share Posted February 24, 2016 I will most certainly try to change the color bars. Thank you again for testing TURGEN on real Rambit hardware and for your suggestions. No Problem. If there's anything else I can help you with, testing wise, then please let me know......always glad to help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted February 28, 2016 Author Share Posted February 28, 2016 Hello again, I tried a different color scheme - dark and bright green (possibly a reminder of the fact that I am a mainframer). I think the new color scheme is not that annoying although it is not a visual art masterpiece. The CPU time is limited.... Also behavior of both monolithic and segmented binary loader was unified. The loaders display the program name for two seconds, then DMA is disabled and loading continues. Please try if you wish (this time just .jar file only). https://sourceforge.net/projects/turgen/files/experimental/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Hi Baktra Liking the colour change of the loading bars. Working well. Just tried 3 games and work fine. Just one thing (and sorry if it seems picky!) but is there a possiblily of putting more than 2 loading screen bar colour options into Turgen and allowing them to be selected during the wizard process or set manually? Just would be nice to have some more to choose from to make each conversion different. I.e. green, multicoloured (the current and previous colours) and maybe black/white, red/yellow (like Spectrum), etc etc. Mat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted February 29, 2016 Author Share Posted February 29, 2016 Hi Baktra Liking the colour change of the loading bars. Working well. Just tried 3 games and work fine. Just one thing (and sorry if it seems picky!) but is there a possiblily of putting more than 2 loading screen bar colour options into Turgen and allowing them to be selected during the wizard process or set manually? Just would be nice to have some more to choose from to make each conversion different. I.e. green, multicoloured (the current and previous colours) and maybe black/white, red/yellow (like Spectrum), etc etc. Mat Hi Mat, Too many different color variants would result in many versions of the loaders. This would be difficult to maintain. I will keep two colors (one for even byte values and one for odd byte values), but I will allow both colors to be freely selectable for each playlist item. This will provide enough color diversity for those who need them. Thanks again for testing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmat56 Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Cheers Baktra...that sounds great. Just out of interest....can a tape player with the Rambit mod such as mine be used for any of the other turbo loaders? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted February 29, 2016 Author Share Posted February 29, 2016 Cheers Baktra...that sounds great. Just out of interest....can a tape player with the Rambit mod such as mine be used for any of the other turbo loaders? Not without some changes. !!! DISCLAIMER !!! You do this at your own risk. There is nothing more dangerous than a programmer with a soldering iron or giving advice on electrical circuits. You can try to open your SIO connector and connect the INTERRUPT pin with the DATA IN pin using a short wire (no soldering needed). This shoud allow you to use all Czechoslovak/Czech turbo systems (Turbo 2000, Super Turbo, B-TAPE). If you try the Czech/Czechosloak ones, you must set the respective plugins to "Prepend universal turbo loader" (see the Preferences dialog). I am not sure if the trick with the wire will prevent you from loading standard tape records or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted March 6, 2016 Author Share Posted March 6, 2016 New experimental version is available. This time it allows to select the colors displayed by both modern loaders. Whether the colors are worth it I don't know, but learning how to use JColorChooser was fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted March 13, 2016 Author Share Posted March 13, 2016 All right, TURGEN 8.5.0 with all the RAMBIT-related enhancements (and some more) is officially out. See https://sourceforge.net/p/turgen/blog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baktra Posted March 16, 2016 Author Share Posted March 16, 2016 UPDATE!!! Tried River Raid again but this time I ticked "Invert polarity of pulses" in RAMBIT config and also ticked "use harmonic pulses" in audio generator. Tried original and modern loaders and both worked first time !!!! PROGRESS !!!! Going to try a few others now.... In light of this, Turgen System 8.5.1 allows to select a waveform. You were not the only one experiencing problems with the square waveform. Square waveforms do not go along with cassette recorders with limited bandwitdth. There are four waveforms to select from: 1. Square (rectangular pulses, as if the "use harmonic pulses" was not ticked). Good for MEGA-CD interface or a8cas-enhanced atari800 emulator, or cassette adapters. Worth a try with a good tape deck. 2. Quality tape (Approximation of rectangular pulses with Fourier series expansion, 7th harmonic). Good for HQ tapes, worth a try also with normal tapes. 3. Normal tape (Approximation of rectangular pulses with Fourier series expansion, 5th harmonic). This is the default now. Good for normal tapes. 4. Pure sine wave (as if the "use harmonic pulses" was ticked). For worst kind of equipment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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