New to Amiga

[nd2003grad]

Hi, I'm kind of getting a feel for the waters of several systems. I'm wondering where to start game-wise on the Amiga (1200 and 500). I would like to get an idea of what's going on with these systems as I was generally too young the first time around!

 

I'm most interested in the Amiga above everything else.

[Tonyvdb]

Depends on how much you want to spend, Amiga systems have seen a real hike in prices as of late. The A500 would be your lowest cost but the A1200 being fairly hard to come by run upwards of $500 for a basic unit and for an A4000 your looking at around $700. Do you want AGA or will the standard graphics suffice for you?

Games are a little bit harder to come by as many of the games still have active copy writes going so downloads for some are not free.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Tonyvdb

[nd2003grad]

Well, you and I are both everywhere aren't we! I'm not sure what AGA is. I've noticed these getting to be very, very expensive as of late. I noticed the games also seem expensive and difficult to obtain. I just can't believe I didn't have one of these as a kid, and had a 286 instead!!!!

[Bill Loguidice]

The ultimate is probably to get an Amiga 1200 with combined accelerator and memory expansion, then just add a pre-loaded compact flash card (4 or 8GB). That will allow you to play almost all Amiga games, both AGA and ECS/OCS, as well as CDTV and CD32 stuff. As was stated, that's not necessarily a cheap investment, but it's my preferred Amiga (and I own them all and then some, save for a 4000).

 

You can instead get an Amiga 500 with at least 1MB of RAM and just play games from disk, or, preferably, replace the disk drive with an HcX or Gotek. You'll be limited to ECS/OCS software, though, which, admittedly, is most of the good stuff, or at least most of the good stuff classically associated with the Amiga.

 

Either way, you'll need a compatible RGB monitor (usually the 1084 series). You can get away with a SCART or some other adapter, but the quality won't be nearly as good as it will be over RGB on that type of monitor. Unfortunately, like most of its contemporaries, the Amiga is not an easy/casual system to get into.

[nd2003grad]

Bill, kind of what I've been gathering regarding the 1200. I'm just not sure how much additional advantage is gained with the 1200, but if I am to do it I'd like to do it right. It's a long-term thing for me as it's so expensive I'd have to save up! And, after my Astrocade debachle...I'm in the club I think. I guess learning some of these AGA, ECS, OCS, etc will help me as I have no idea what all that means!

[Bill Loguidice]

Bill, kind of what I've been gathering regarding the 1200. I'm just not sure how much additional advantage is gained with the 1200, but if I am to do it I'd like to do it right. It's a long-term thing for me as it's so expensive I'd have to save up! And, after my Astrocade debachle...I'm in the club I think. I guess learning some of these AGA, ECS, OCS, etc will help me as I have no idea what all that means!

 

To simplify it, what you get with an Amiga 500 or 2000 (as well as the original 1000 and later 600) is a graphics mode that generally caps out at 32 colors for all practical purposes. With the 1200, you get a graphics mode that generally caps out at 256 colors. While the 1200 can run software from the older models, the 500/2000/600 can't run software designed for the 1200 or 4000.

 

There used to be some backwards compatibility issues with the 1200 running older Amiga software, but that's largely been addressed by WHDLoad, which is what allows that wonderful compact flash compilation to work so well. So again, with a properly equipped 1200, you can run all software from all eras of the Amiga, including the CDTV and CD32, while with the 500 or 2000, you're limited to pre-Amiga 1200/4000 software (plus neither the 500 or 1200 have compact flash support, although the 600 does, but again, if you're going to bother with a 600, you may as well just save for the more versatile 1200 that has the additional graphical modes). That shouldn't necessarily be a deal breaker since most of the iconic games were made prior to the 1200/4000, but still, an investment is an investment.

[carlsson]

I think OCS is a backronym that reads out as Original Chipset. With the Amiga 500+, Amiga 600 and Amiga 3000 came the Enhanced Chipset, ECS which to most part is the same as OCS but with higher horizontal resolution and generally a bigger memory to hold graphics data. The major upgrade came with the AGA chipset as mentioned, but it came a bit late and only a limited number of games really require AGA graphics.

 

If you're getting an Amiga 600 or even better a 1200 and want to setup your own solution to use a PCMCIA to CF adapter, in my experience just about any adapter from China will work. I've bought three or four of those over the last decade, and they all worked right out of the box for $2 each or so. At the same time, some "professional" Amiga resellers will sell you the exact same adapters for ten times as much money, or bundle with a CF card for even more money. Since it is common elsewhere that only particular models of an adapter or interface will work with a given application, it is easy to assume it is the case here as well but unless you get a good deal with a CF card bundle, you can save yourself a bit of cash by ordering both adapter and possibly also memory card from Far-East Asia, since the resellers don't add any value to the product.

 

The same goes for the internal 2.5" IDE to CF adapters, which can be held cheap from China or for non-trivial money from a reseller. I wouldn't mind going through resellers if those were special products or some custom work had been done to the hardware, but alas they're just marked up.

Edited March 17, 2016 by carlsson

[Tonyvdb]

Bill has mostly covered what I would have said, I will add that if you go with an a1200 or the A2000 you can buy an Indivision graphics adapter that snaps direcly on the video socket of the Amiga (costs $100 aprox) and you can use any LCD monitor on it See here for the 1200 version: http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1148

and here for the 2000 version: http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=918

[Bill Loguidice]

The same goes for the internal 2.5" IDE to CF adapters, which can be held cheap from China or for non-trivial money from a reseller. I wouldn't mind going through resellers if those were special products or some custom work had been done to the hardware, but alas they're just marked up.

 

While you can certainly roll your own, I'd rather pay the $40 - $60 inclusive for a 4GB - 8GB pre-configured compact flash adapter and CF card. In fact, that's what I've done a few times. It was definitely worth the savings in hassle. I also much prefer the easy internal option on the 1200 to the PCMCIA route, although that works well too.

[carlsson]

I use the internal IDE to CF for permanent storage, to replace a hard drive, while I use the external PCMCIA to CF for transfer purposes, to move files from/to a PC. Also note that the internal CF card will be formatted with an Amiga file system that is mostly incompatible with a PC except for if you mount it in WinUAE, while the external CF card will be formatted as FAT32 and used with a custom file system handler on the Amiga, so the two options not necessarily will replace eachother.

[nd2003grad]

Well, can you guys still tell me what games make this system happen for you? Desert island list?

[Tonyvdb]

Turrican II is a must have, I really like Deluxe Galaga and Deluxe Pacman, Tetrix, Pinball dreams, Lemmings, Morph and the list goes on

[Nebulon]

If you just want to play games then you're best getting an Amiga 500 and a 1084 monitor.

 

The A1200 has more colors, but the vast majority of the games are the on 500.

 

If you're really pick about having more colors and want more of an "enhanced SNES" type of experience, then go for the 1200. I personally don't think it's necessary though.

[+remowilliams]

You can instead get an Amiga 500 with at least 1MB of RAM and just play games from disk, or, preferably, replace the disk drive with an HcX or Gotek. You'll be limited to ECS/OCS software, though, which, admittedly, is most of the good stuff, or at least most of the good stuff classically associated with the Amiga.

 

 

As someone who has a few Amigas (including a decked out 1200 and even minimig/FPGarcade-Replay), I'd strongly suggest that route above if you're just starting to look in the Amiga direction and gauge your interest. A 500 with a Cortex Gotek (or HxC Gotek) will get you playing the vast majority of the library fairly easily. Then you can decide how much you'd be willing to sink into making it easier/faster/better, as you can spend a lot of money going high end.

[amiman99]

I have ALL the Amigas in my house, so speaking from experience the A1200 is best to have if you can get your hands on one. You got 2MB RAM minimum, HD, CF card, AV out. Out of the box you can do stuff with it.(Once you have everything setup).

You can transfer files between PC and Amiga with ease using PCMCIA to CF adapter. Use WHDLoad to play your classic games from HD. More colors, but less compatibility (most are solved by using WHDLoad)

 

A500 is great if you want the ultimate 80s experience using the floppies (that includes the Gotek USB floppy converter, no speed gain with that one), for one or two disk games it's OK, but if you have more then that, you will sit there and swap disks.

Soon there will be new accelerator for the A500 called Vampire, that will add speed, ram and SD card, then this will be a beast, so there is potential.

 

The choice is yours.

[Seob]

Still recommend the a500 with 1mb. Plays almost all amiga games.

[Bill Loguidice]

Still recommend the a500 with 1mb. Plays almost all amiga games.

 

That's not exactly true. It will play a lot of Amiga games, but certainly nowhere near everything. For everything, you really want an expanded Amiga 1200 with a combination accelerator and extra RAM, and a good pre-configured CF card. You can then play all eras of Amiga games, including of course all of the AGA stuff, as well as CDTV and CD32 stuff. It does cost quite a bit more than a 500 with an HCX, but either way the Amiga is not a casual investment since you really need a proper monitor (mostly typically a 1084 series model) to get the correct visual fidelity.

 

I too have nearly every Amiga and Amiga-centric console, save for a 3000 and 4000, and pretty much only use one of my two 1200s since it's configured in the way I described above. There's no real reason to use anything else.

[+save2600]

Of *all* the Amiga machines I've owned (and have had all but a CDTV unit), believe it or not... have found the CD32 with a Paravision expansion interface and hard drive (IDE to CF card in this case) to be the absolute *most* compatible across the widest ranges of games and software yet. Not exactly the cheapest Amiga setup or investment, just saying. Shit_just_works! Not as many goofy or random WHDLoad errors I'm finding. Wish I had jumped on the SX-1, etc. bandwagon a loooooong time ago and when it was cheaper.

[Seob]

With plays almost all amiga gamea i mean the classic ocs games. These are the games most people think of when talking about amiga games. The 1200 never had a great impact, most people by that time started to switch to pc. So very few exclusive games are available.

I play most of the games on my cdtv since that is what i have setup. Just a plain cdtv, modded to accept normal atari style joysticks, and a switch to disable the cdrom bios to free up a little extra memory.

I sometimes use my cd32 with a disk full of a500 games and a hacked a500 keyboard.

I have a few 500's but i almost never use them. My 1200 sadly is broken.

[Nebulon]

 

That's not exactly true. It will play a lot of Amiga games, but certainly nowhere near everything. For everything, you really want an expanded Amiga 1200 with a combination accelerator and extra RAM, and a good pre-configured CF card. You can then play all eras of Amiga games, including of course all of the AGA stuff, as well as CDTV and CD32 stuff. It does cost quite a bit more than a 500 with an HCX, but either way the Amiga is not a casual investment since you really need a proper monitor (mostly typically a 1084 series model) to get the correct visual fidelity.

 

I too have nearly every Amiga and Amiga-centric console, save for a 3000 and 4000, and pretty much only use one of my two 1200s since it's configured in the way I described above. There's no real reason to use anything else.

There are quite a few OCS games that don't run on the Amiga 1200.

[Bill Loguidice]

There are quite a few OCS games that don't run on the Amiga 1200.

 

Like what? Everything I've tried via a loaded WHDLoad CF card seems to work fine, although I will admit I haven't done an exhaustive survey. Pretty sure Amiga software compatibility is 99%+ at this point with that type of setup, but again, I haven't verified myself beyond what I've used.

 

For reference, my primary 1200 (a UK model, I also have a secondary US model that isn't quite as fancy, but does similar things) is spec'd as follows: 8GB CF, ACA-1231/42 MHz CPU 68030 with MMU and 64MB RAM and RTC, KS 3.1

[carlsson]

I think WHDLoad:ed games generally are patched so they run on newer OS versions and graphic chipsets than the original disk versions did. Previously the EAGER site would tell which configurations each game would run on, but it no longer exists. I'm sure the information is out there elsewhere though.

[Bill Loguidice]

I think WHDLoad:ed games generally are patched so they run on newer OS versions and graphic chipsets than the original disk versions did. Previously the EAGER site would tell which configurations each game would run on, but it no longer exists. I'm sure the information is out there elsewhere though.

 

That was my assumption as well. That was also my point with recommending a 1200 as an ultimate Amiga (and again, acknowledging the higher cost). The 500 is great (it was my only Amiga back in the day and I still have it), but I think the WHDLoad converted stuff has changed things in terms of what's most useful today.

[Nebulon]

 

Like what? Everything I've tried via a loaded WHDLoad CF card seems to work fine, although I will admit I haven't done an exhaustive survey. Pretty sure Amiga software compatibility is 99%+ at this point with that type of setup, but again, I haven't verified myself beyond what I've used.

 

For reference, my primary 1200 (a UK model, I also have a secondary US model that isn't quite as fancy, but does similar things) is spec'd as follows: 8GB CF, ACA-1231/42 MHz CPU 68030 with MMU and 64MB RAM and RTC, KS 3.1

You're likely getting better results since your machine has more than 2MB of RAM and you're running WHDLoad. Someone who is new to this needs to know what they're getting into if they want to improve the A1200's OCS game compatibility. I'm still of the opinion that the easiest and most cost-effective way of getting into Amiga stuff is to start with an Amiga 500 (and then decide whether or not to go down the AGA road if they really like the platform -- as remowilliams mentioned). Much simpler and a lot less frustration for a new Amiga user.

[Bill Loguidice]

You're likely getting better results since your machine has more than 2MB of RAM and you're running WHDLoad. Someone who is new to this needs to know what they're getting into if they want to improve the A1200's OCS game compatibility. I'm still of the opinion that the easiest and most cost-effective way of getting into Amiga stuff is to start with an Amiga 500 (and then decide whether or not to go down the AGA road if they really like the platform -- as remowilliams mentioned). Much simpler and a lot less frustration for a new Amiga user.

 

I agree on a basic level, although again, the Amiga is not really a casual investment. If you get an Amiga 500 that's expanded to at least 1MB (otherwise, it's not that usable), you still need to worry about getting a monitor. Obviously, it better have its mouse and you'll also want a second disk drive. You can replace the internal drive (and not bother with the second disk drive) with an HCX, which is relatively easy, but still requires some work, and you're still dealing in the floppy disk way of doing things.

 

On the 1200, you can buy a stock 1200 (again, make sure it has a mouse or you'll need to buy an adapter for a mouse if you can't find an original), buy an accelerator and RAM combo card that plugs into the bottom of the unit, and then buy a preconfigured 8GB CF card that easily plugs inside. You'll also need the same type of monitor you'll need for the 500, or get the 1200-specific DVI video card that was referenced earlier. The cost will be quite a bit higher, but once the 1200 is set up like that, you're done once and for all, and again, can play every Amiga computer and console game ever.

 

One thing I will note to the OP, nd2003grad, is that if you want to experiment with the Amiga "safely" and inexpensively (sorry if this has already been mentioned), then you should check out Amiga Forever: https://www.amigaforever.com/ It'slegal and almost completely plug and play. That will give you a great sense of working with an Amiga for minimal risk.