Choosing the components for ClearPic 2002

[Timothy Kline]

Good morning, everyone,

 

I'm finally brushed up on my soldering and desoldering (practicing off an obsolete 1027 mainboard), and am gathering the components I'll need to incorporate the ClearPic 2002 mod in my new family of 1200XLs. However, I'm already stumped and am hoping for assistance.

 

For the resistors (1, 47, 75, 130, and 1k ohms) it appears that wattage plays a role in choice, yet that seems to be the most elusive bit of information for me after searching the forum as well as Google. I'm seeing anything from 1/4w up to 10w choices, but nothing at what I thought is the wattage of the 1200XL mainboard: 5v.

 

Am I just looking for the wrong thing entirely?

 

Thank you, in advance!

Tim

[BillC]

You are confusing voltage with wattage, wattage(power) is voltage drop * current. A 1/4W resistor can have a voltage drop of 5V across it as long as the current through it doesn't exceed .05A

[Mclaneinc]

Just get 1% tolerance 1/4w metal film resistors..dead common and perfect for the job...on this sort of job there no actual load on them..

[+Larry]

Before you buy parts and go to a fair amount of work, it is likely that only doing a small part of that mod will yield 90%+ of the results. At least it did for me.

 

I want to verify the procedure with Bob Woolley (to make sure that I wrote it down correctly some years ago). You also might want to wait and get an "Ultimate Atari Video" module when it is sold in the AA store. (See the UAV threads here.) The results are even better than virtually all other mods! And it is very easy to install.

 

When I've confirmed the "quick and easy" mod, I'll post it here.

 

-Larry

[Timothy Kline]

You are confusing voltage with wattage, wattage(power) is voltage drop * current. A 1/4W resistor can have a voltage drop of 5V across it as long as the current through it doesn't exceed .05A

 

I could be, Bill, except that when I went shopping on Amazon, the resistors were always listed according to 1/4w and up, and not volts; thus my confusion and subsequent post. O.o

[Gunstar]

They are always listed in watts and not volts, because as FJC said, wattage is voltage drop * current and it is common practice to assume you know this, as it's electronics 101. It is simple math to figure out the volts on your own, and saves huge amounts of time in not giving every single specification separately when listing thousands of components. Doing mods is not just about knowing how to solder properly, you should have a basic understanding of electronics and the math involved before you try altering electronics. In school, they don't put a soldering iron in your hand the first day and say "make this circuit." you have to take basic math and electronics lessons and hands-on stuff is reserved for at least a few weeks or months until you have the theoretical basics down.

 

I'm not trying to be condescending here, so please don't take it that way. I'm just explaining why components don't give redundant information.

[Bryan]

There's lots of good YouTube videos on electronics. It's pretty amazing, really.

[Timothy Kline]

They are always listed in watts and not volts, because as FJC said, wattage is voltage drop * current and it is common practice to assume you know this, as it's electronics 101. It is simple math to figure out the volts on your own, and saves huge amounts of time in not giving every single specification separately when listing thousands of components. Doing mods is not just about knowing how to solder properly, you should have a basic understanding of electronics and the math involved before you try altering electronics. In school, they don't put a soldering iron in your hand the first day and say "make this circuit." you have to take basic math and electronics lessons and hands-on stuff is reserved for at least a few weeks or months until you have the theoretical basics down.

 

I'm not trying to be condescending here, so please don't take it that way. I'm just explaining why components don't give redundant information.

 

No worries, Gunstar. Especially since you are completely seeing my current situation as it is. I also am painfully aware of the fact that I'm really trying to put the cart ahead of the horse here, and that little voice in the back of my mind keeps telling me that I'll pick things up as I jump in with both feet and "learn by doing," as I try to catch up on 15-17 years without having had an actual Atari system in my hands (and the extent of my experience was installing Rambo 256k's). So many things I want to try out that I would never have been able to that long ago, and my mind is racing with possibilities--and I haven't even laid down the foundation yet. * sigh *

 

In my defense, I have been watching and taking notes upon notes from what seems a fantastic series of videos on basic electronic 101, and they are doing a great job of explaining what you and FJC and BillC have all pointed out. I'm just not clear how to carry any of it over to an Atari system, I guess. I'm great at following instructions like those given in the ClearPic 2002 mod (remove this, replace that); I just don't understand how or why each step is needed-- not to mention understanding how to find/get the parts. Too... far too many years of PCs and their plug a card in until a newer, faster card comes out and then replace it with the newer one until the next newer, faster card comes out. PCs have dumbed me down to the level of a village idiot, where I just go all "Here, take my money please" without any more thought than how to type in credit numbers in a store ordering form. *sigh *

 

Humbly,

Tim

Edited May 22, 2016 by Timothy Kline

[Mclaneinc]

To be honest small kits or pre-made PCB related stuff is pretty much in the join the dots league, with soldering being the main skill and knowing which way electrolytic capacitors go around, other things like a dot on a chip at the top left leg show that is pin one and the u shpaed indent is showing you that is the top of the chip.

 

The rest on stuff like that is easy and of course never be afraid to ask before diving in head first...

 

Paul...

Edited May 22, 2016 by Mclaneinc

[Timothy Kline]

To be honest small kits or pre-made PCB related stuff is pretty much in the join the dots league, with soldering being the main skill and knowing which way electrolytic capacitors go around, other things like a dot on a chip at the top left leg show that is pin one and the u shpaed indent is showing you that is the top of the chip.

 

The rest on stuff like that is easy and of course never be afraid to ask before diving in head first...

 

Paul...

 

Then I am definitely in the join-the-dots league, lol. Maybe someday I might even be president.

[Mclaneinc]

 

Then I am definitely in the join-the-dots league, lol. Maybe someday I might even be president.

 

Be warned, there's always someone planning to over throw El Presidenti

[ACML]

Resistors: 1/4 watt, 1% tolerance

Capacitors: 16v no higher, 5% tolerance

Wire for missing chroma line: Doesn't have to be shielded, but not too high a gauge.

Edited May 22, 2016 by ACML

[Mclaneinc]

I normally used Wire Wrapping wire, nice and thin for neat small installations and shielded in case but standard electronics link wire is fine as you say..

Edited May 22, 2016 by Mclaneinc

[ACML]

Also on capacitors, don't use electrolytic (metal), use ceramic. I bought the components for the 1200XL I sold you from Digi Key.

 

CF14JT1KOOCT-ND 1K ohm, 1/4 Watt. 5%, carbon film

CF14JT75R0CT-ND 75 ohm, 1/4 Watt, 5%, carbon film

CF14JT130RCT-ND, 130 ohm, 1/4 Watt, 5%, carbon film

445-4738-ND, 1000 pf, 5%, 50V radial

445-4724-ND, 68pf, 5%, 50V radial

0.0QBK-ND, 0 ohm, 1/4W, jump axial

CF14JT47R0CT-ND, 47 ohm, 1/4W, 5%, carbon film

 

Digi Key is very reasonable. Just Google search on the whole line part number and description above.

Edited May 22, 2016 by ACML

[Timothy Kline]

Also on capacitors, don't use electrolytic (metal), use ceramic. I bought the components for the 1200XL I sold you from Digi Key.

 

CF14JT1KOOCT-ND 1K ohm, 1/4 Watt. 5%, carbon film

CF14JT75R0CT-ND 75 ohm, 1/4 Watt, 5%, carbon film

CF14JT130RCT-ND, 130 ohm, 1/4 Watt, 5%, carbon film

445-4738-ND, 1000 pf, 5%, 50V radial

445-4724-ND, 68pf, 5%, 50V radial

0.0QBK-ND, 0 ohm, 1/4W, jump axial

CF14JT47R0CT-ND, 47 ohm, 1/4W, 5%, carbon film

 

Digi Key is very reasonable. Just Google search on the whole line part number and description above.

 

I haven't had the heart to take that 1200XL apart to have a look inside, but I'm curious why you recommend ceramic over metal...?

 

--Tim

[ACML]

 

I haven't had the heart to take that 1200XL apart to have a look inside, but I'm curious why you recommend ceramic over metal...?

 

--Tim

Electrolytic caps can dry out over time, ceramics don't. If you prefer electrolytic, try tantalum caps. They act like electrolytic but are also dry like ceramics.

Edited May 22, 2016 by ACML

[+Larry]

Attached is the text file that I mentioned. Bob1200xl says that he normally doesn't remove C60, so you might try it with/without by lifting one end.

 

So instead of a bunch of components, you need a couple of low-watt, 1-ohm resistors. Hopefully it will give you satisfactory results without a bunch of work. Let us know how it works for you.

Quick and Easy Video Fix for the 1200XL.txt

[Gunstar]

 

No worries, Gunstar. Especially since you are completely seeing my current situation as it is. I also am painfully aware of the fact that I'm really trying to put the cart ahead of the horse here, and that little voice in the back of my mind keeps telling me that I'll pick things up as I jump in with both feet and "learn by doing," as I try to catch up on 15-17 years without having had an actual Atari system in my hands (and the extent of my experience was installing Rambo 256k's). So many things I want to try out that I would never have been able to that long ago, and my mind is racing with possibilities--and I haven't even laid down the foundation yet. * sigh *

 

In my defense, I have been watching and taking notes upon notes from what seems a fantastic series of videos on basic electronic 101, and they are doing a great job of explaining what you and FJC and BillC have all pointed out. I'm just not clear how to carry any of it over to an Atari system, I guess. I'm great at following instructions like those given in the ClearPic 2002 mod (remove this, replace that); I just don't understand how or why each step is needed-- not to mention understanding how to find/get the parts. Too... far too many years of PCs and their plug a card in until a newer, faster card comes out and then replace it with the newer one until the next newer, faster card comes out. PCs have dumbed me down to the level of a village idiot, where I just go all "Here, take my money please" without any more thought than how to type in credit numbers in a store ordering form. *sigh *

 

Humbly,

Tim

It's todays mentality of replace instead of repair where everything is considered "disposable", so even PC repair shops never touch a soldering iron and replace that one fried resister, capacitor or chip and instead just replace the entire board instead, and charge the customer an arm and a leg for a repair that could have taken 20 mins. and 20 cents worth of parts. I like to buy up broken cards for dirt cheap, actually replace the fried component and then use or resell the item for a nice profit. I do this with vintage consoles and computers too, and of course love to upgrade my Atari 8-bits and ST's, etc.

 

Just last week I was walking my dog and saw this brand-new looking 32" LED TV sitting on the side of the road next to a garbage can. They were even nice enough to leave the remote sitting on it's stand too. I decided to grab it and take it home. I plugged it in, and sure enough, it wouldn't turn on, and I heard a high-pitched sound coming from the back, from experience I figured it was the PSU board inside, and after some investigation, figured out it was a blown capacitor on the PSU board, a common 25v 470uf one that I have a few of on hand, and presto, I now have a nearly brand new condition working 32" LED TV that I am now using as my PC monitor, replacing my old 17" Dell LCD monitor I was using! The fact is that most issues with "broken" electronics are something simple.

 

I'm no electronics engineer myself, the truth is I barely got past electronics 101 at a tech school I attended after I graduated from a liberal arts college with a bachelor's degree in the fine arts. I only took electronics so I could repair my own stuff, upgrade my own computers (nearly always using others work, not my own designs) and that has evolved into doing a hobby of repairing stuff over the last couple decades. I only went for a year at the tech school and learned "enough" for myself. Of course I've continued to learn and teach myself over the years and now have at least the equivalent knowledge of an associates degree, just no diploma to back it up, but then I don't need one, hell, I've never even used my bachelor's degree for any job in the real world anyway, I own a landscaping company, again, self-taught.

 

By the way, I know everyone raves about the Clearpic 2002 mod, but for the 1200XL specifically, I prefer the Supervideo 2.1 mod as I like the richer color saturation it gives using the 1200XL's special color-boosting circuitry. Of course it's a bit more work than the Clearpic mod. But I find it to be a perfectly clear and sharp picture for text as well. Most will say Clearpic is better, but for the 1200XL, I'll piss against the prevailing winds. I find that like art, the best video output is totally subjective and I like the color output of S-V 2.1 best myself. Just an alternative, and I only suggest it as one for the 1200XL.

http://ftp.pigwa.net/stuff/collections/nir_dary_cds/Hardware%20Projects/Super%20Video%202.1XL/supervid5.html

 

You'll get there, and it won't take long. But you won't ever find components listing every single spec and you'll have to do some basic math to get all the details.

Edited May 23, 2016 by Gunstar

[+Larry]

Yes, YMMV. What I've seen in doing many video upgrades is that what works great in one machine may or may not work equally well in another. A lot of folks have had great results from the Super Video mods, but I'm less enthusiastic from my experiences -- especially the 130XE. The exception (IMO) is Bryan's Ultimate Atari Video board. Looks great in almost everything I tried -- and so easy. Hope that Al does carry it in the AA store.

 

-Larry

[Gunstar]

That's exactly why I only recommend S-V 2.1 for the 1200XL. Clearpic seems the better choice (not counting this new board) for everything else. I'm sure Bryan's new board is the bees-knees, but if you can handle a soldering iron, these other mods are pennies on the dollar in comparison and deliver fantastic results for the price.

Edited May 24, 2016 by Gunstar