Atari Flashback Classics for the XB1/PS4

[Bill Loguidice]

I'll buy these. It'll be cool to have in my Xbox collection.

 

Bill, what does "retailer requirements" even mean? Why not sell it all in one package?

 

A few more questions...

 

Do both volumes come out on October 4th?

 

Will each volume on the XB1 have 1000 Achievement Points each?

 

I don't want to go into too much detail for obvious reasons, but basically it's what the retailers will agree to carry (and that's how most of our products are structured). For instance, while I was pushing for a single package of 100 games, the retailers didn't want that. They prefer cheaper and more volumes. The good news with that is that even if you don't like these first two volumes, us splitting it up like this means that future volumes are more likely (with a good precedent set for pricing, format, etc.). It's not ideal from a gamer standpoint necessarily having to manage multiple volumes, but at the same time, even if it's a bit clumsy being separate, you're still getting the same number of games for the same price you would have the other way. And while there are no plans to have a unified interface for all of the games at this time, never say never. Success and/or demand has a way of changing plans.

 

Achievements/trophies will be like full standard releases as it pertains to each volume, so expect the full complement of each.

Edited June 1, 2016 by Bill Loguidice

[cimerians]

Say what????

 

Nice to hear your kind of involved Bill....umm.....sheesh I'd like to support these but I just can't. I bought them already on Steam. My main issue is the split product into two volumes and the controls, I don't know, if they release digitally on consoles I may wait for a sale and get them (again). :-/

[Agent X]

 

I don't want to go into too much detail for obvious reasons, but basically it's what the retailers will agree to carry (and that's how most of our products are structured). For instance, while I was pushing for a single package of 100 games, the retailers didn't want that. They prefer cheaper and more volumes. The good news with that is that even if you don't like these first two volumes, us splitting it up like this means that future volumes are more likely (with a good precedent set for pricing, format, etc.). It's not ideal from a gamer standpoint necessarily having to manage multiple volumes, but at the same time, even if it's a bit clumsy being separate, you're still getting the same number of games for the same price you would have the other way. And while there are no plans to have a unified interface for all of the games at this time, never say never. Success and/or demand has a way of changing plans.

 

This really isn't the case, though. The $19.99 price for each 50-game pack on PS4 or Xbox One could nab you the whole 100-game pack on Steam, and 12 years ago could've gotten you an 87-game pack on PS2 or Xbox. Consumers really deserve more value for the money, not less.

 

If retailers are going to make stupid demands like "oh, let's split up the collection so that we can gouge the consumers even more", then screw 'em. Just go for a pure digital download release like on PC. Better to maintain high standards than to sell out to pacify a few brick-and-mortar dinosaurs that are stubbornly stuck in the ways of the past.

[Newsdee]

If they improve the online multiplayer (maybe with a way to find ppl easily) and make it work cross platform, then I think it's quite interesting.

 

My only niggle about the PC version is I would have wanted higher-res textures for the 3D cabs to see text and be able to map my arcade stick to a similar layout. But I can live with that

[Atariboy]

I hope a Midway compilation is next.

 

We were teased with the arcade pack for Lego Dimensions recently which also was handled by Code Mystics. But since I don't see Warner doing it themselves after Origins was a commercial failure on last-gen hardware, hopefully AtGames takes up the slack and we'll soon have classics like Root Beer Tapper and Roadblasters on the XB1/PS4 via a proper collection.

 

 

This really isn't the case, though. The $19.99 price for each 50-game pack on PS4 or Xbox One could nab you the whole 100-game pack on Steam, and 12 years ago could've gotten you an 87-game pack on PS2 or Xbox. Consumers really deserve more value for the money, not less.

 

I think that you misunderstood what he's saying. To me it sounds like he's saying that the options on the table were either a single $40 package or twin $20 packages, so you'd be paying $40 either way. I don't think he was saying that it matches the price of Atari Vault off Steam.

 

Remember that not only is this appearing on consoles where there's added publishing costs and two different platforms to program for, but that it's appearing via retail instead of being a digital exclusive like it was over on the PC. The numbers undoubtedly are significantly different than they are over on the PC.

 

Doubt that entirely justifies the doubled price point, but it at least partially does and hopefully the added padding also helps encourage some sequels that venture into fresh territory like Berzerk, a popular arcade classic from the golden age that is yet to appear in the past 20+ years of console arcade emulation.

 

 

If retailers are going to make stupid demands like "oh, let's split up the collection so that we can gouge the consumers even more", then screw 'em. Just go for a pure digital download release like on PC. Better to maintain high standards than to sell out to pacify a few brick-and-mortar dinosaurs that are stubbornly stuck in the ways of the past.

 

I think the retailers demand was for releases with a $20 MSRP rather than $40, which makes sense for classic compilations and matches your thinking that $40 is too much.

 

They're not thinking along the lines that customers will be spending $40 if they want the complete package, but that they have a $20 product that they feel they can move better than if it were $40. The battle is about getting these stocked at big retailers, remember.

 

It didn't sound like from Bill's post that they pushed AtGames away from selling 100 games for $20 into two 50 game packages at $20 each. It just sadly works out that way in order for the numbers to work out for AtGames, with $20 for all 100 games apparently not an option.

 

Was going to be $40 one way or another it appears.

 

 

If they improve the online multiplayer (maybe with a way to find ppl easily) and make it work cross platform, then I think it's quite interesting.

 

Too bad that PS4/XB1 cross-platform play isn't an option. Would really help a niche title like this since you'd up your chances of being paired with someone else. And it would be nice to be able to see everyone's scores at AtariAge, regardless of which platform they bought it for.

 

I'd love to play Combat online.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Atariboy

[Agent X]

I think that you misunderstood what he's saying. To me it sounds like he's saying that the options on the table were either a single $40 package or twin $20 packages, so you'd be paying $40 either way. I don't think he was saying that it matches the price of Atari Vault off Steam.

 

Remember that not only is this appearing on consoles where there's added publishing costs and two different platforms to program for, but that it's appearing via retail instead of being a digital exclusive like it was over on the PC. The numbers undoubtedly are significantly different than they are over on the PC.

 

Doubt that entirely justifies the doubled price point, but it at least partially does and hopefully the added padding also helps encourage some sequels that venture into fresh territory like Berzerk, a popular arcade classic from the golden age that is yet to appear in the past 20+ years of console arcade emulation.

 

 

I think the retailers demand was for releases with a $20 MSRP rather than $40, which makes sense for classic compilations and matches your thinking that $40 is too much.

 

They're not thinking along the lines that customers will be spending $40 if they want the complete package, but that they have a $20 product that they feel they can move better than if it were $40. The battle is about getting these stocked at big retailers, remember.

 

It didn't sound like from Bill's post that they pushed AtGames away from selling 100 games for $20 into two 50 game packages at $20 each. It just sadly works out that way in order for the numbers to work out for AtGames, with $20 for all 100 games apparently not an option.

 

Was going to be $40 one way or another it appears.

 

I do understand that there are differences in procedures and costs when it comes to publishing a physical disc on a video game console, as opposed to a digital-only release on PC. That said, the Atari of 12 years ago was still capable of delivering a singular "complete" anthology pack for $19.99 on the contemporary consoles of the day, on physical media and fully licensed. There is absolutely no reason why Atari couldn't do the same in today's market.

[Bilnick]

I will likely buy these. I would have liked to have both volumes in one package (or download) for $30, but I won't nitpick about $10.

[Austin]

sheesh I'd like to support these but I just can't. I bought them already on Steam. My main issue is the split product into two volumes and the controls, I don't know, if they release digitally on consoles I may wait for a sale and get them (again). :-/

 

I thought about it and I'd like to support it as well, but I think I am going to pass. Maybe not necessarily because the titles are split into two packages, but because I've been having issues with input lag between the various retro compilations, like Rare Replay and Mega Man Legacy Collection, and I'll pass for that reason alone. It's good to see they are available for more casual players though or people that want a taste of video game history.

[+eebuckeye]

This seems too pricey to me also... 100 should be in one volume for $30 if not $25.

[Mulletino]

As I have the Atari Anthology and Activision Anthology installed in the HDD of my PS2 Arcade Table i'll probably not bother with these.

 

Although I might crumble eventually as I also have the Midway Treasures games installed on it but still bought Midway Arcade Origins on the 360.

[Atariboy]

$30 would be more up my alley.

 

I imagine it won't be tough to make that happen, especially a few months after release. Online deals aren't hard to find even on brand new $60+ AAA games it seems.

 

There is absolutely no reason why Atari couldn't do the same in today's market.

 

It isn't Atari though, it's AtGames.

 

I'm not sure about the economics involved, but sadly, it appears that the compilation market has been a tough one since we entered the digital age judging by their near complete absence over the past decade. So right or wrong, perhaps that's part of the reason why they're looking for $40 instead of $20 to protect themselves against what might be low sales (although that's rather a catch 22 in itself). Might be a bit of their plug and play business model influencing them too.

 

Hopefully it works out for them and they'll succeed since this is hopefully just the start. While this one is pretty conventional besides the online multiplayer, their next product might be one that just might be worth the asking price to you.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Atariboy

[toiletunes]

I'd be all over this for the 360, there's some games I have never tried or don't remember. 360 is my newest console, and I have no incentive to upgrade to ps4 yet.

[Atariboy]

I'd be all over this for the 360, there's some games I have never tried or don't remember. 360 is my newest console, and I have no incentive to upgrade to ps4 yet.

 

Do you own Atari Anthology for the original Xbox?

 

The online leaderboards are shuttered thanks to the closure of Xbox Live for that platform and it of course always lacked a few of the accouterments here like online multiplayer and achievements, but it runs beautifully on the Xbox 360 unlike most backwards compatible titles. It even was one of the few HD enabled original Xbox games which translates to razor sharp lines in the vector arcade classics.

 

And you'd still have Battlezone in its arcade and 2600 forms.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Atariboy

[Austin]

Yeah, Atari Anthology for the original XBOX is great and is $10 - $15 CIB on the used market currently. Snag that and play it on your 360.

[Bill Loguidice]

I'd be all over this for the 360, there's some games I have never tried or don't remember. 360 is my newest console, and I have no incentive to upgrade to ps4 yet.

 

We were originally also targeting PS3 and Xbox 360, but by the time this comes out later in the year, those markets will be even further in the doldrums. It makes sense to support the two newest consoles, especially since their install bases are so strong. Obviously, if the NX does well, that will also be a target for future volumes.

[Bill Loguidice]

Atariboy's assumptions are correct. Look, if I were on the other side, I may very well be frustrated too, but it was have two volumes for $20 each or nothing. The one volume for $30 or $40 was rejected, period. Because of the economics involved and the type of title it is, if the retailers won't carry it, then it wouldn't be viable to produce. Also, while it's built on the foundation of Atari Vault, it's not an exact duplicate, so the UI and other elements are different. Those elements are expected to carry over to future volumes. I can't go into details (broken record there), but there are future plans to explore Atari's past like never before in these types of products, as well as of course do these compilations for many other types of companies/publishers/properties. I don't expect anyone to appreciate these as anything more than what they are (or will be upon their release later this year), but do appreciate that there is a bigger picture here and one that hopefully will be enticing to you (multiple future 50 game compilations).

 

In any case, as always, I'll note any constructive concerns and make sure AtGames and the other parties involved are made aware of them.

[cimerians]

Someone somewhere out there needs to make and sell an adapter to plug in some paddles (and joysticks).

 

Ben!!!!!!

[Agent X]

Look, if I were on the other side, I may very well be frustrated too, but it was have two volumes for $20 each or nothing. The one volume for $30 or $40 was rejected, period. Because of the economics involved and the type of title it is, if the retailers won't carry it, then it wouldn't be viable to produce.

 

I'd reject one volume for $30 or $40, also. No argument from me there.

 

One point that you are ignoring is that there is already a precedent. Atari already was capable of selling a "complete" disc-based compilation for video game consoles OVER TWELVE FRIGGIN' YEARS AGO.

 

There is no good reason in this day and age why a compilation that was previously sold "whole" for the last 12 years (and two console generations prior) has to be split into two parts for newer machines that boast the ability to use 50 GB Blu-ray discs. This is regression, plain and simple.

 

Also, since when are retailers anxious to stock multiple SKUs of what is already considered a niche product? Instead of one Atari Flashback console with 90 games (or whatever number it's up to now), why don't they sell two separate Atari Flashback consoles with 45 games, or three consoles with 30 games? Whatever logic they apply to self-contained game consoles can also be applied to disc-based software.

 

We should be going forward, not backward. This is not a good value proposition, and in light of what was the norm and market feasible over a decade ago, is shaping up to be an outright atrocity.

[Flojomojo]

Look, if I were on the other side, I may very well be frustrated too, but it was have two volumes for $20 each or nothing.

 

... Those elements are expected to carry over to future volumes.

 

...there are future plans to explore Atari's past like never before in these types of products, as well as of course do these compilations for many other types of companies/publishers/properties.

 

Is this another case of "support this, even if you don't love it, because if it does well, there will be more?" Most of us have been on that particular pony ride many times already.

 

The competition for this product isn't "nothing," it's piracy. Piracy gives you ALL the ROMs, sorted however you like, on a single volume, on the device of your choice, in all territories, for the grand total of zero dollars/pounds/rupees/yen/euro etc.

 

We should be going forward, not backward. This is not a good value proposition, and in light of what was the norm and market feasible over a decade ago, is shaping up to be an outright atrocity.

 

 

Well that's certainly a lot of verbal drama for a collection of old video games.

[Bill Loguidice]

 

We should be going forward, not backward. This is not a good value proposition, and in light of what was the norm and market feasible over a decade ago, is shaping up to be an outright atrocity.

 

Atrocity? Well, that's not good. Hopefully for future volumes we'll inspire feelings closer to a minor infraction in you than an outright atrocity.

[+eebuckeye]

I preordered both for $15.00 each on Amazon using prime. Still with they were combined for convenience.. oh well..

[Bill Loguidice]

 

Is this another case of "support this, even if you don't love it, because if it does well, there will be more?" Most of us have been on that particular pony ride many times already.

 

The competition for this product isn't "nothing," it's piracy. Piracy gives you ALL the ROMs, sorted however you like, on a single volume, on the device of your choice, in all territories, for the grand total of zero dollars/pounds/rupees/yen/euro etc.

 

Not necessarily. There are of course minimum sales goals, but I'd never ask anyone to support something that doesn't inspire them. Again, I can understand not being inspired by a rehash of the same stuff, but it's a process, a series of steps, of which this first one is important. And yes, piracy is the alternative for just about anything that's sold these days.

 

It is hard though to release these products mainstream when the vocal minority uses words like "atrocity," etc., but that comes with the territory. You're never going to win over a certain segment of our community no matter what.

[Bill Loguidice]

I preordered both for $15.00 each on Amazon using prime. Still with they were combined for convenience.. oh well..

 

I agree about being combined in a single interface. At this time, that's just not practical because of the idea of volumes and the fact that it's not digital only. The concept is not permanently tabled, though. We'll see how things go. In the best of all worlds, we'd have a single interface for ALL volumes, so you'd have hundreds of games across multiple volumes from one interface, but right now that's not happening. The best way to think of the first two volumes is that they're coincidentally related, like if one volume were a ColecoVision collection and another volume were a Midway collection. Instead, we happen to have two Atari collections that consist of Atari 2600 and arcade games (because that's the easiest to start with).

[jhd]

As I have the Atari Anthology and Activision Anthology installed in the HDD of my PS2 Arcade Table i'll probably not bother with these.

 

I don't have a PS 4 (or Xbox One) so I am obviously not going to buy this collection at any price, but I do have to wonder how large a segment of the potential audience has not already purchased this compilation in a different form.

 

Personally, I already have the PC and the PS 2 Atari Anthology collections on disk (as well as the Android collection on my phone and even the Atari arcade compilations for the PSX)! I assume that many other collectors feel likewise -- there is insufficient "new" content here to justify the purchase (even if I had the appropriate hardware).

[cimerians]

 

Is this another case of "support this, even if you don't love it, because if it does well, there will be more?" Most of us have been on that particular pony ride many times already.

 

A lot of times.