jbone09 Posted August 17, 2016 Author Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) I'm glad this topic inspired a debate. My whole issue is the artificial inflation. Just because I'm willing to pay up to X, doesn't mean that's what the item should sell for. My issue is the person bidding with 0 feedback, bidding 15 straight times, who bids 100% exclusively on a specific seller's items. That's what brought up this post in the first place. I actually called out the seller on his BS. I knew he was shill bidding on another account, and he tried to play coy and act like he was on my side. I told him, "If that's the case, remove the shill bids. You have the right as a seller to remove bids from an auction." Guess what? After doing everything but admitting his guilt, he removed the bids. Then the auction took a natural course, not the artificially inflated one. Edited August 17, 2016 by jbone09 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Just because I'm willing to pay up to X, doesn't mean that's what the item should sell for That's kind of how the whole economy works, you have an item idea whatever and before you put any effort into it you see how owmuch its.going to cost you and how much people are willing to pay for it so you can price it for both max profit and sales Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoshiChiri Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 LOL then why the hell bid so high???? You guys are killing me. If it is only worth $X to you then only bid $X, DUH! This is pretty much it, really- but with the addition of 'do your research'. When I'm hunting ebay for something for the first time, step 1 is check the current buy-it-nows. Step 2 is check recent sold listngs. Between the two, I can get an idea of what an item is actually selling for & if a bidding war will be in my favor. Are the auctions closing at $20 with BINS at $22? I'll pay the extra 2 bucks to avoid the trouble. If those auctions are $11? I'll try my luck with $12-15 bids (based on condition). Or better yet- look for Best Offer auctions. Sometimes if an item's been riding for awhile, you can talk a seller way down & snag a deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icemanxp300 Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I'm glad this topic inspired a debate. My whole issue is the artificial inflation. Just because I'm willing to pay up to X, doesn't mean that's what the item should sell for. I get what your saying but an item is worth what it is worth. Could the moon and the stars align so that nobody else out of the millions of people on ebay either don't see that item that you are bidding on or they decide nah I want to let this person get it cheaper than everyone else has to pay.... Your right that could happen. There is a simple fact here. The fact is items generally sell for what they are worth shill bidding or not. If seller doesn't shill bid you ARE still going to pay what other buyers feel it is worth. In the event you pay more that is because you put a max bid in that is higher than it should sell for and that is your fault. Stop bidding $20 for shit that sells for $11, problem solved..... I should start charging for these lessons My issue is the person bidding with 0 feedback, bidding 15 straight times, who bids 100% exclusively on a specific seller's items. Not that I shill bid, just because sometimes I feel like I'm the only person with half a brain. To all you shill bidders just bid ONE TIME! Bid $1000 and in 1 quick swoop you can see the max bid as you will be the highest bidder, retract and bid just under. Sorry I felt the need to get that out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thadsilverfox Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I wonder if what I do is as bad as a shill bidder. I don't do this on eBay but I do push prices up on the Goodwill auction site for items in my area. If I can't get the shit I want for cheap I won't let anyone else get the shit they want for cheap. Bwahahahaha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teh_lurv Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 There is a simple fact here. The fact is items generally sell for what they are worth shill bidding or not. If seller doesn't shill bid you ARE still going to pay what other buyers feel it is worth. In the event you pay more that is because you put a max bid in that is higher than it should sell for and that is your fault. Stop bidding $20 for shit that sells for $11, problem solved..... I should start charging for these lessons I think we need to get off this bidding more than an item is worth. It wasn't the point of the thread and is just serving as a distraction about shill bidding. I don't think anyone would disagree that if you bid over and above market rate and you win, its your fault. That said, no matter what the amount someone auto-maxs their bid on eBay with, the amount the winning bidder has to pay should be the result of legitimate bidders, not sellers shill bidding. I wonder if what I do is as bad as a shill bidder. I don't do this on eBay but I do push prices up on the Goodwill auction site for items in my area. If I can't get the shit I want for cheap I won't let anyone else get the shit they want for cheap. Bwahahahaha What you're doing isn't shill bidding, as you're not the seller and you conceivably could win with your bids. It's still kinda not cool bidding up auctions out of spite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Item is only worth $11 but I'm going to bid $20. What do you call that? That's like going into a store that sells a gallon of milk for $3 and saying I'll pay $6 in case someone wants this exact gallon of milk in my cart instead of going and getting another one that sells for $3. Yes. This thread is about people feeling bad because they bid too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I wonder if what I do is as bad as a shill bidder. I don't do this on eBay but I do push prices up on the Goodwill auction site for items in my area. If I can't get the shit I want for cheap I won't let anyone else get the shit they want for cheap. Bwahahahaha Pushing prices up is one (of many) ways to help increase the value of your own personal collection. It's fun to watch items you already own and see them go up in price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punishermark Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I wonder if what I do is as bad as a shill bidder. I don't do this on eBay but I do push prices up on the Goodwill auction site for items in my area. If I can't get the shit I want for cheap I won't let anyone else get the shit they want for cheap. Bwahahahaha This happens alot. I don't bother bidding anymore for games on GoodWill. People like you win but then don't pay. You know you are hurting people that are less fortunate than you that the great people at Goodwill help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icemanxp300 Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 You know you are hurting people that are less fortunate than you that the great people at Greedwill help. fixed. Fun fact. If you don't bid high early, you can't be shill bidded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 This happens alot. I don't bother bidding anymore for games on GoodWill. People like you win but then don't pay. You know you are hurting people that are less fortunate than you that the great people at Goodwill help. Sometimes it's necessary to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skippy B. Coyote Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Today actually marks the first time in the 12 years or so that I've been using eBay that I witnessed what was blatantly obvious shill bidding. Over the last day this eBay user Olde_English_800 listed 40 some items for sale, many of which are junk Game Boy / Color / Advance games that always sit on eBay for months with no bids, and every single game has at least one bid (usually a few) from the same couple of people. Check it out: Link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thadsilverfox Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 (edited) This happens alot. I don't bother bidding anymore for games on GoodWill. People like you win but then don't pay. You know you are hurting people that are less fortunate than you that the great people at Goodwill help. Wow! Accusing me of not paying for items. I always pay my bills if I accidentally win the items. Give me a break about hurting less fortunate. Its freakin resellers bidding most of those auctions up to insane prices. How do I know this? Because I talk to them when I pickup my items. Most of them own thrift stores or mom/pop shops around my area. You do realize if you don't pay for your items that you will get banned from the site indefinitely. Edited August 18, 2016 by thadsilverfox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrBlackCat Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 One item not yet mentioned in this thread... the possibility for a seller (or anyone with the knowledge to do so) to find out a bidders max bid amount entered on eBay. From that, the seller (or trolling random hacker) uses shill bid partners or alternate account(s) to place a bid (usually snipe) just a bit UNDER your maximum bid amount. This is done on big dollar items often like vehicles, construction equipment etc most of the time. This is a profit increasing business practice for some people on a large scale, but of course it does occur in every area of eBay... daily. This process isn't simple to do, and takes a minimum of six or seven minutes depending on system/machines used to find/decrypt the bid. Times of 20 minutes aren't uncommon, so if you are a late bidder, this isn't a consideration. The point is to use an auto-bidder (I use eSnipe daily) to avoid this possibility. Good luck with your MrBlackCat 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 When it comes to eBay, I'm 5-second sniper and Buy-It-Now guy. Any shenanigans that occur prior are irrelevant. When I bid I bid the max amount I am willing to be happy with. If I bid 15K on an item and it comes out at 14.9K I'm alright with that. If the seller has a shill operation going on, so frakking what, it's the price he wanted in the first place. It all comes down to the last seconds and if my bid is compatible with the price of the auction. I also don't play the offer counter-offer game. I may make a fair offer. If the seller doesn't accept, he/she is welcome to wait for another buyer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+LS650 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 Its freakin resellers bidding most of those auctions up to insane prices. How do I know this? Because I talk to them when I pickup my items. So because some, even many, are resellers, you think it's okay to cause inflation of the prices? Er, won't the resellers simply pass those higher prices on to their customers? So aren't you really screwing over all collectors when you engage in this sort of scheme? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skippy B. Coyote Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 (edited) When it comes to eBay, I'm 5-second sniper and Buy-It-Now guy. Any shenanigans that occur prior are irrelevant. When I bid I bid the max amount I am willing to be happy with. If I bid 15K on an item and it comes out at 14.9K I'm alright with that. If the seller has a shill operation going on, so frakking what, it's the price he wanted in the first place. It all comes down to the last seconds and if my bid is compatible with the price of the auction. I also don't play the offer counter-offer game. I may make a fair offer. If the seller doesn't accept, he/she is welcome to wait for another buyer. That is, word for word, exactly how I operate when buying on eBay as well. Except in my case drop the "K" from the end of $15 and $14.90. Edited August 18, 2016 by Jin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icemanxp300 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I have to chime in on this reseller thing. I am the first to admit I resell. I collect first and resell second. Whether I have an item or not if the price is good I will buy it. I see this in my area all the time and everywhere else. People get mad because a reseller paid more for something they wanted.... Let me state that again in case you missed it. a reseller paid more for something they wanted All I say to this is tough shit! If you are not willing to pay a higher price than a reseller will pay to make a profit, then that's your own fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlegamer Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 It's fair game to criticize collectards and the resellers who enable them regarding price inflation. All the more reason to keep buy/sell/trade activity to communities screened to keep out those types, whether by membership, or filtering transaction partners. This also keeps prices from being indexed by Reseller Charting, and therefore keeping the info away from collectards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icemanxp300 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 It's fair game to criticize collectards and the resellers who enable them regarding price inflation. All the more reason to keep buy/sell/trade activity to communities screened to keep out those types, whether by membership, or filtering transaction partners. This also keeps prices from being indexed by Reseller Charting, and therefore keeping the info away from collectards. I love when you guys use the term collectards as if it does NOT apply to YOU! If all you care about is playing the game then emulate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiddlepaddle Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 It's fair game to criticize collectards and the resellers who enable them regarding price inflation. All the more reason to keep buy/sell/trade activity to communities screened to keep out those types, whether by membership, or filtering transaction partners. This also keeps prices from being indexed by Reseller Charting, and therefore keeping the info away from collectards. Manipulating the market, as you're suggesting, doesn't work; it just adds extra hidden costs (eg., another middleman). A higher price is what directly slows down the extra demand. You are blaming sources of demand different than you ("collectards and resellers"), when you are actually an integral part of that extra demand. Check out what's happened to Venezuela in the last several months as their president has tried to control that economy with like-minded edicts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoshiChiri Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 All the more reason to keep buy/sell/trade activity to communities screened to keep out those types, whether by membership, or filtering transaction partners. This also keeps prices from being indexed by Reseller Charting, and therefore keeping the info away from collectards. What exactly do you mean by 'collectard', anyway? What distinguishes a 'collec-tor' from a 'collec-tard' in the first place? I'm assuming it's a reference to a hypothetical individual who sees AVGN review a game, and buys it immediately for the first price they see to put on a shelf instead of play. Here's the thing, though- it may irk those of us who play these games and tinker with the hardware & such, but we don't get to decide what is and isn't the right way to collect retro games. Just like there isn't a special group of trekkies who get to declare that "only the Original Series and TNG are acceptable- fans of Deep Space Nine are to be ignored and fans of the reboot must be shunned!" There is no Gatekeeper, Declarer Of What Is Fun. Yes, it sucks to see prices of games we'd like to own spike because some kids saw a guy with it on the internet and jumped all over it to be trendy. But that's not something we can control- it's not horrible shill bidders & resellers & stupid 'collectards' driving up prices to be dicks. It's a popularity spike, and it just happens sometimes. For us here- the "real collectors" (lacking a better term) who are in it for the joy of it, and not for any sort of value or bragging rights? We can wait it out. We'll buy our homebrews and systems that aren't hip & cool with the young'uns. Sooner or later, the trend moves on and we get the games they bought at a discount while they raise money for whatever the hell they need now. It comes down to what's been said over and over- pay what you're willing or don't buy it at all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+LS650 Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 Collectard? I resent that - I prefer the term gametard, thank you very much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icemanxp300 Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 I guess it works both ways! http://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_odkw=&_ssn=bridgettpriolettineal0&hash=item25c20e967f%3Ag%3AeaEAAOSwHoFXq%7EWb&item=162169525887&LH_Complete=1&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2046732.m570.l1313.TR12.TRC2.A0.H0.Xmicro.TRS0&_nkw=micro&_sacat=0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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