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sanny

130XE with non-functional consol keys

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Hi,

 

I've got a 130XE where all of the consol keys (start, select, option, reset) don't work

 

The other keys work fine, just tested in BASIC typing in every key.

 

How can I repair the contol keys?

 

regards,

chris

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How exactly did you test it in BASIC. I would assume you'd know just by not being how to navigate within they system diag

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Hello guys

 

Usually, wiggling the "flat cable" connecting the keyboard with the motherboard solves the problem. Try this while wiggling:

 

10 ? PEEK(53279):GOTO 10

RUN

 

The output should change if you press Select, Start and/or Option and will vary from 0 to 7.

 

(I've done this so often, I know the address by heart)

 

A more permanent solution would be to order a new keyboard sheet (mylar) from Best Electronics. Not cheap ($22) , but it will solve your problems, in case the "flat cable" is damaged enough. Otherwise "wiggling" will be more than enough. There are two types of keyboard mylar, which are NOT interchangeable!

 

Sincerely

 

Mathy

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reseat the whole cable. Also a good wipe down of the Mylar with alcohol might be helpful. Also these keys have a separate leg on the bottom. If this is broken off, the key may not be hitting the Mylar in the right position. Also if your KB has the rubberized domes that make contact with the Mylar, they might be dirty or cracked.

Good Luck !!

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If not, keep in mind that GTIA reads the CONSOL keys, while PoKey reads the keyboard.

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try re-seating the ribbon cable. I just had one act up a couple days ago and re-seating the cable fixed it. Note that the first time i re-seated it there were other keys that stopped working, so I re-seated again and then everything worked.

 

if that doesn't work you can determine which trace on the flex circuit is open, and also pinpoint the exact location (or multiple locations ) using a multimeter, and then carefully bridge those opens using rear-window defrost repair kit.

 

also look for areas of the flex cable that might be shorting against something in the system that it shouldn't be touching, and then protect those areas with some tape.

 

I have had good luck with that on both a 130XE and an 800XL.

 

the other alternative is to buy the replacement "mylar" flex circuit from best electronics for $25.

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When in doubt, just run the built-in keyboard test. It may not be the best, but it does do a good job of letting you know if the console keys work. No need to be writing test programs for that, unless you just feel like it.

 

- Michael

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Hold down Start and Option to see if it will go into cassette loading mode,or turn on the system with no keys held and test with the keyboard test,it should go into test mode..Make sure you don't have anything connected to it first like cassette or disk drive.I have the same problem with my 800XL some of the keys don't work like O,K,G.

Edited by Spanner

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I re-seated the ribbon cable. Still no good :(

 

For people asking questions about how I tested it: I either just turned it on with "Option" pressed, but didn't arrive at the self test. Or I inserted a game cart and pressed "Start" -> no game start....

Edited by sanny

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Usually, wiggling the "flat cable" connecting the keyboard with the motherboard solves the problem. Try this while wiggling:

 

10 ? PEEK(53279):GOTO 10

RUN

 

The output should change if you press Select, Start and/or Option and will vary from 0 to 7.

 

Hmm, tried this. I'm always getting "7", regardless what key I press.

 

Which pins of the "flat cable" are connected to the consol keys? Or, better asked, which pins do I need to check for bypass when I press a consol key?

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Hmm, tried this. I'm always getting "7", regardless what key I press.

 

Which pins of the "flat cable" are connected to the consol keys? Or, better asked, which pins do I need to check for bypass when I press a consol key?

 

Did you try switching out the GTIA with a known good one? Or, if you have another A8, try that GTIA in a different A8.

Edited by russg
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Did you try switching out the GTIA with a known good one? Or, if you have another A8, try that GTIA in a different A8.

 

No, I don't have a spare GTIA or computer. In fact, I have, but they're PAL while the problem machine is NTSC.

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I've cleaned the ribbon cable connector on the keyboard with alcohol -- still no change.

 

I "beeped" it with a multi-meter: If I'm correct a pressed "Option" key should short lines 3 and 23 of the cable connector. This didn't happen.

 

Next step: open the keyboard an look inside...

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No, I don't have a spare GTIA or computer. In fact, I have, but they're PAL while the problem machine is NTSC.

 

sanny,

I remember trying to make a PAL compatible NTSC by swapping PAL Antic and GTIA chips into NTSC machine.

I don't remember the results, but I suspect the results were BAD.

I can't find those PAL chips anywhere amoungst my volumous A8 stuff, which makes me believe the PAL chips are gone.

I don't remember exactly, but it seems I believe I got a black and white display.

But the chips must have failed, as I can't find them anywhere.

I swapped NTSC chips for PAL ones with a guy in England, if I remember.

So, bottom line. I was thinking put a PAL GTIA in your NTSC, but now I don't recommend that.

You have a European 800XL NTSC, which maybe not, as Europe doesn't have any NTSC 120 volt

without some special power converter.

So, probably don't.

A little more.

The NTSC GTIA is a 14805. The PAL GTIA is a 14889. Look, see what your GTIA is in the bad NTSC.

Edited by russg

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Just picked up a 130XE that exhibits the same problem - none of the function keys work :( Swapped it out with a brand new old stock XEGS keyboard and that worked fine. Looks like I'm in for a new mylar but shipping from Best to the UK is so expensive :(

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Remember you can always change the resistors going to those keys... the mylar is more than likely just more resistive not broken.. just change the corresponding resistors on the Atari itself... I will work for an eternity after that....

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I had to re-paint the mylar with conductive paint on my heavily used XE. That completely fixed all the keys. The traces get worn over time with use and will eventually fail. Look at the mylar and you may see lots of traces that look as though the conductive stuff has worn off. Re-paint them all, especially in your case follow the traces where the function keys go and make sure they're all 100%.

 

edit: this includes the round circle contact points under each key. Doesn't hurt to repaint them. If you accidentally connect two lines... I used a razor blade to cut the line several times in/near the same spot where there should be no cross connect (some lines are very close and it is difficult).

Edited by Sugarland

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Remember you can always change the resistors going to those keys... the mylar is more than likely just more resistive not broken.. just change the corresponding resistors on the Atari itself... I will work for an eternity after that....

I saw you mention that in another thread - it's a shame no online resource exists to show exactly which resistors to change, and what value to replace them with, especially for us novices!

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my 130XE had similar problems, reseating the connector only helped a short while. In the end i disconnected the keyboard fromthe motherboard, and diligently cleaned the connector. It looked dark grey in the beginning, but after the cleaning it was bright silver again. I used cleaning fluid (that stuff that removes corrosion) for electronics, and completely washed away the leftovers with alcohol afterwards. since then everything stayed OK.

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Here's a link to an extremely helpful post by _The Doctor__ that details exactly how to fix the resistor problem. There's also a way to fix it by replacing the resistors with transistors.

 

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/190500-130-xe-keyboard-membrains/?fromsearch=1

Thanks for the heads up - I've just posted there to ask if anyone could make a photo available that shows the fix in-situ to make it clearer for the less techy (me included) among us.

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My memory was already beginning to fade when I posted that 5 years ago!... I am very happy to see it dug up.... I have 4 to 5 more XE's acquired in need of the fix... It's time to perform the mods on some thrift store XE's again.... hopefully It will come back to me fully, if successful I might even remember to post a photo or two... :)

 

Post your XE keyboard mod photos!

Mylars are worth it when they are around $10.00 but not so much when it's $25.00 plus shipping.

 

If I made a mistake it'll be my big chance to correct it :)

Edited by _The Doctor__

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On 1/23/2017 at 8:34 AM, ultrasteve said:

I saw you mention that in another thread - it's a shame no online resource exists to show exactly which resistors to change, and what value to replace them with, especially for us novices!

Well, today I found this in the mail with some other goodies I haven't seen archived yet.  I will post a scan later, but here is a quick pic for now.

 

 

A71AFE0D-200D-484F-B4FA-9AC58EF4617E.jpeg

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