RAM Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 2 minutes ago, ivop said: Can you explain why you think it is stupid? It's a fact that Hubbard copied a lot of (parts of) compositions from others. He was commisioned to write whatever the devs wanted, they'd tell him they wanted some Pink Floyd or Jimi Hendrix and he'd program it for them. As fro IK being plagiarised, it bears a moderate similarity to that song posted to start off with, but yeah, Rob Hubbard's "version" is twice as long and changes tempo half way through - didn't hear any of that in that Sakamoto song... Inspiration is NOT plagiarism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivop Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, RAM said: He was commisioned to write whatever the devs wanted, they'd tell him they wanted some Pink Floyd or Jimi Hendrix and he'd program it for them. As fro IK being plagiarised, it bears a moderate similarity to that song posted to start off with, but yeah, Rob Hubbard's "version" is twice as long and changes tempo half way through - didn't hear any of that in that Sakamoto song... Inspiration is NOT plagiarism. Yeah, well, without credits, it is not inspiration IMHO. I stopped after twelve songs: International Karate: Furyo by Ryuichi Sakamoto Delta: Koyaanisqatsi by Phiip Glass Rasputin: Kalinka by Ivan Larionov, Csárdás by Vittoria Monti, Katyusha by Blankter and Isakovsky The Master of Magic: Shibolet by Synergy Monty On The Run: The Devil’s Galop by Charles Williams & Orchestra Wiz: Impressioni Di Settembre by Premiata Forneria Marconi Warhawk: The Unknown Planet by John Keating, Space Agent by John Keating I-Ball: I Want You by Cabaret Voltaire, Whip Blow by Cabaret Voltaire Delta (in game): Pruit Igoe by Phillip Glass ZoÏds: Acestors by Synergy Pandora: Main Title by Toto Sanxion: Dance of the Knights by Sergei Prokofiev Nobody was every credited for that. And there's more, but I'm bored. Always give credit were credit is due. And don't make any money of other peoples work. Edited October 27, 2021 by ivop 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAM Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 ?♂️ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderDude Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 (edited) 27 minutes ago, RAM said: Bloody hell, that is almost as good as the original version, probably 1% difference between them - never would have thought this would be possible on pokey! I'm glad you liked our conversion (osc view of it btw) More on Rob's composing, yes, even Monty on the Run was inspired by someone else's track. In this case, it was inspired by "Devil's Gallop" by Dick Barton But there are PLENTY examples of this happening throughout the music industry. For example, take this song from Phineas and Ferb: This sounds very similar to Bathtime in Clerkenwell: I haven't seen any pages where Danny Jacob mentions his inspiration for the song, yet nothing happened to him. As you can see, yes, it's very common to have songs this close to their inspiration. There's nothing inherently wrong with that though, is there? Edited October 27, 2021 by EnderDude 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivop Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 (edited) Sigh. I'm not saying I don't like Rob Hubbard. But IMHO he is overrated, exactly because a lot of his songs are "inspired" by other people's work, and without crediting them. But the sound of his player and his style was great! Quote As fro IK being plagiarised, it bears a moderate similarity to that song posted to start off with, but yeah, Rob Hubbard's "version" is twice as long and changes tempo half way through - didn't hear any of that in that Sakamoto song... Inspiration is NOT plagiarism. Come on, the first half of IK is an exact copy, chord for chord and note for note, of the chord progression and melody of Ryuichi Sakamoto. That he added something in the second half doesn't make it "inspiration". I cannot release a song which is Let It Be as the first half, and my own composition as the second half. Edited October 27, 2021 by ivop 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 (edited) 22 minutes ago, ivop said: But IMHO he is overrated the topic is complex and I wouldn't be able to comment on it, but it would be equally interesting to know if there is a very similar or even the same theme in the game, is it plagiarism? An example would be any "shooter" in space... Are there credits from Space Invaders authors? ps. Hydrofool b Hubbard also has great music - where did he get his "inspiration" from? - I ask because it can be even better in original --- I would also suggest not to forget that Hubbard was the first to introduce a more complex player for music, some of whose concepts can still be found in modern players Edited October 27, 2021 by xxl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 27, 2021 Author Share Posted October 27, 2021 1 hour ago, ivop said: Yeah, Tel did a lot of great songs, too! As for Hubbard, his player is cool. His composing skills not so much IMHO. Here's International Karate Plain plagiarism. And he did more. Delta is Koyaanisqatsi. Without any credit to Phillip Glass. This was mentioned so many times before 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 27, 2021 Author Share Posted October 27, 2021 1 hour ago, xxl said: I would also suggest not to forget that Hubbard was the first to introduce a more complex player for music, some of whose concepts can still be found in modern players But Hubbard p..sed and sh..tet on the POKEY. Just because he was not able to put more out of the Atari. The SID offered a simple interface... You might know, a tuned instrument could produce tuned sounds by everyone... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivop Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 3 hours ago, xxl said: the topic is complex and I wouldn't be able to comment on it, but it would be equally interesting to know if there is a very similar or even the same theme in the game, is it plagiarism? An example would be any "shooter" in space... Are there credits from Space Invaders authors? Good question. Similar to how TV stations copy each other's formats. Dancing on ice, Cooking with stars, or whatever. 3 hours ago, xxl said: ps. Hydrofool b Hubbard also has great music - where did he get his "inspiration" from? - I ask because it can be even better in original Wikipedia says [quotation needed] that it's based on Abe Holzmann's "Blaze Away!". There are some similarities, but IMHO this is pretty far fetched. It's an AY-only song BTW. And it is very out of tune Which is a pity, because the AY is way easier to keep in tune than, say, Pokey https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4cqJSphwSc 3 hours ago, xxl said: I would also suggest not to forget that Hubbard was the first to introduce a more complex player for music, some of whose concepts can still be found in modern players Exactly! His player and instrument design was very distinct. His percussion was phenomenal and characteristic for his sound. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivop Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 2 hours ago, emkay said: But Hubbard p..sed and sh..tet on the POKEY. Just because he was not able to put more out of the Atari. The SID offered a simple interface... You might know, a tuned instrument could produce tuned sounds by everyone... LOL. Cute dog It reminded me of this, which is, not surprisingly, found on YouTube: (geschiedenis means history, it's that old ) I cut to the chase, but before that the girl says the dog always howls when Koos Alberts is played. The proof follows after that 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 4 hours ago, ivop said: Sigh. I'm not saying I don't like Rob Hubbard. But IMHO he is overrated, exactly because a lot of his songs are "inspired" by other people's work, and without crediting them. But the sound of his player and his style was great! I had no idea... I always thought that RH was the guy who magically lined up hit after hit. I guess he didn't plan for the internet to happen. Seems like he did remixes which is still great and sometimes a remix can be better than the original but yeah you'd call it a "remix" instead of naming it something completely different. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 On 10/27/2021 at 7:32 PM, EnderDude said: I'm glad you liked our conversion (osc view of it btw) if anyone needs inspiration in converting to Atari, feel free: 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinsCool Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 4 hours ago, xxl said: if anyone needs inspiration in converting to Atari, feel free: That's one I wanted to do for a long time personally, but never commited to it yet lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irgendwer Posted October 30, 2021 Share Posted October 30, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, xxl said: if anyone needs inspiration Speaking of inspiration: Edited October 30, 2021 by Irgendwer 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 30, 2021 Author Share Posted October 30, 2021 To me the biggest challenge is still to make calm pokey music , without getting boring Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irgendwer Posted October 30, 2021 Share Posted October 30, 2021 15 minutes ago, emkay said: To me the biggest challenge Yes, it's obvious that you are challenged... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 30, 2021 Author Share Posted October 30, 2021 22 minutes ago, Irgendwer said: Yes, it's obvious that you are challenged... ? Do you have something to contribute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 30, 2021 Author Share Posted October 30, 2021 Actually, I'm satisfied that the ambient of the original shines through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 30, 2021 Author Share Posted October 30, 2021 On 10/27/2021 at 7:28 PM, ivop said: Yeah, well, without credits, it is not inspiration IMHO. I stopped after twelve songs: Nobody was every credited for that. And there's more, but I'm bored. Always give credit were credit is due. And don't make any money of other peoples work. The only spot where Hubbard did shine: He was luckily at a point where someone had to do the "new" music on 8 bit homecomputers at the right time. So some pioneer honor is truely given to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderDude Posted October 30, 2021 Share Posted October 30, 2021 9 hours ago, emkay said: To me the biggest challenge is still to make calm pokey music , without getting boring I do recall liking to listen to your driller conversion. Maybe we could revisit that and spruce it up a bit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 30, 2021 Author Share Posted October 30, 2021 6 minutes ago, EnderDude said: I do recall liking to listen to your driller conversion. Maybe we could revisit that and spruce it up a bit? hm.... I did some conversions over the time. Do you have a timestamp of the version you liked? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderDude Posted October 30, 2021 Share Posted October 30, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, emkay said: hm.... I did some conversions over the time. Do you have a timestamp of the version you liked? August 13, 2009. For convenience, I pulled the .rmt out of the .sap for those who want to take a look at it: Driller.rmt Edited October 30, 2021 by EnderDude 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 30, 2021 Author Share Posted October 30, 2021 How about this one? dril3f.rmt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderDude Posted October 30, 2021 Share Posted October 30, 2021 Is it me, or does the 16-bit pure sound a bit off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 30, 2021 Author Share Posted October 30, 2021 Just now, EnderDude said: Is it me, or does the 16-bit pure sound a bit off? As RMT usually didn't support 16 bit, it was hard to play the correct frequencies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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