Which 8-bit should I upgrade?

[leech]

So.. I have seen all the fun toys that Lotharek sells. And for some weird reason I feel the need to keep the spice flowing... er I mean I like keeping him busy.

 

I am looking for some advice on a few things. I'll do a summary of questions, then more in depth..

 

1) Do I have him do the upgrades?

2) Which system should I get upgraded?

3) Which upgrades should I get?

 

With the first one, I am just sort of starting out with soldering things, but if he's cheap enough, I'll just send a system to him to have it upgraded. Granted that also depends on 2 and 3.

 

Second question. I currently have from oldest to newest; 800, 600XL, 800XL, 130XE, XEGS. I was attempting to get a second 130XE off of eBay to do this job myself, but I'm hesitant if it's a harder/easier thing to work on than say an XEGS or 800 would be.

 

3rd question. I was thinking VBXE, Rapidus and Ultimate 1MB. Anything missing there? Maybe a SIDE (Though I already have an SIO2PC). I think that leaves out some sort of Ethernet, but not sure if I really need networking on my 8-Bit. Hell, I have an 850 that I bought many moons ago, but have yet to be able to use it (it was right before I got DSL! So using a modem with it was pointless. Though I also still have my XM301).

 

Are there any other mods I could do? I was thinking RGB out from the VBXE would rock, though I definitely need some screen with SCART, not just that one, but one for my Jaguar, Amiga, Falcon, etc.

 

Thoughts? How much software has been made to take advantage of those three? I've seen a few games and demos running on the VBXE, but with both Rapidus and VBXE? and I'm hoping the Rapidus is very compatible as well.

[gilsaluki]

I used to mod like nobody's business. Then it occurred to me one day; WHY? VERY few programs actually take advantage of the extra memory, I mean VERY few. Usually, it involves soldering (which I can do ok) on VERY thin pad (dangerzones). The ROI is very minimal. As for video, yeah there are improvements, but not enough to make THAT big a difference to me. Heck, I don't sit in front of my Atari for 8 hours straight like I do at work. So, little improved video upgrades are of little use to. I have vowed from now on, if it is not truly plug and play, I will not modify my pristine Ataris. Not worth the effort. Why does anyone really need a 4 Meg 8-bit? Answer: There are a lot folks with spare money and time.

[ApolloBoy]

The Rapidus and VBXE are kinda overkill IMO, but the Ultimate 1MB is pretty nice since it's not that hard to install and it's the gold standard of A8 RAM upgrades these days. But I think it boils down to which of your systems you use the most and what you do with it.

[Gunstar]

Why? Because you can. For many of us it's not about how much use the upgrades will get or how much there is to use with them. Modifying vintage computers is a hobby for many of us and we have just as much fun, if not more, actually doing the upgrades than using the upgrades. It's about the journey itself, not the destination. As is life.

[+Bikerbob]

U1mb is the great one to get.. VERY easy to install.. 800xl socketed is the best to MOD.. why?? most compatible.. and best board to be soldering to.

 

James

[Marius]

I used to mod like nobody's business. Then it occurred to me one day; WHY? VERY few programs actually take advantage of the extra memory, I mean VERY few. Usually, it involves soldering (which I can do ok) on VERY thin pad (dangerzones). The ROI is very minimal. As for video, yeah there are improvements, but not enough to make THAT big a difference to me. Heck, I don't sit in front of my Atari for 8 hours straight like I do at work. So, little improved video upgrades are of little use to. I have vowed from now on, if it is not truly plug and play, I will not modify my pristine Ataris. Not worth the effort. Why does anyone really need a 4 Meg 8-bit? Answer: There are a lot folks with spare money and time.

 

I couldn't have said this better. Today I tried (in vain) to install one of the Lotharek U1MB boards in a -known good and stable- socketed atari 800xl. What a disappointment. Have been busy for hours (and yes I'm rather experienced when it comes to modding, solder-jobs and installing upgrades) to finally give up.

 

I must say: I love extra memory, and I have some serious use for it, but my fabulous Turbo Freezer 2011 gives me XE compatible 576KB XL computer. That is plug and play. It just works! I also love my IDE+ harddisk, and my blackbox...

 

I know my good friend FlashJazzCat creates the best software ever for atari 8bit, and he did an amazing job on a replacement BIOS, PBI driver and SIDE2 loader for Ultimate 1MB... I have been testing and using it for a while on another atari 800xl where the U1MB worked very well. But I have decided to give up on U1MB. It can't be true that it works well in one atari, and fails completely in another.

 

So my advice: concentrate on external solutions, and enjoy your atari in it's original form. You don't need any upgrade to have a powerful system.

 

My original atari computers have the following, using only external solutions

 

1. Turbo Freezer 2011

2. 576KB XE compatible (512K battery backupped!) RAM

3. SpartaDos X with a FREE cartridge port, so you can have Mac/65, Assembler Editor, or whatever language you want to use in combination with SDX. Yes the SDX is inside the Turbo Freezer 2011.

4. PBI harddisk, compatible with a stock Rev. XL/XE OS.

5. A realtime clock -> the IDE+ harddisk interface gives real time clock

6. High Speed SIO alway available on D1: - D4: thanks to IDE+

7. External custom OS if needed using TF_HH wonderful Sys-Check II ... providing external OS's, and even 512KB Xe compatible ram if needed.

 

I can imagine you want to do something with the video output. Not all atari's come with a very crisp video output. But that's all.

[Mechanicjay]

rThis is a tough one for me as I'm a purist -- I still prefer my 810 drive as my primary mass storage device.. I also had the conundrum that after having an 800, 800XL and 130XE over the years, I really enjoy the look and feel of the 800 the most.

The issue, of course, is that some of the best 8-bit software out there requires an XL or XE class machine. I was lucky enough to get in on 3rd Incognito run...I sold my 800XL and 130XE to help finance it.

Don't get me wrong, I was conflicted about modifying the original 800, but after using now for a few weeks, I really couldn't be happier, it's gives me the best qualities of all the different 8-bits all rolled into one.

Now, when it comes to things like the VBXE, I'm similarly torn -- the only thing I'd really be interesting in that for is the nice 80 COL support -- but honestly, using S-Video through a VGA up converter, even software 80 cols is pretty reasonable. I'm not a huge gamer, I really like productivity software and programming, so there's just not a lot of win there for me.

 

I suggest, you figure out what your end-goal is -- do you want to build a system for extreme 8-bit gaming? Writing your own crazy games? Never need a physical disk drive again? etc etc. Then take stock of the mods out there and figure out which machine makes the best base to suits your goal.

[Mechanicjay]

Oh right, some further thoughts:

 

I think the XEGS makes a really intriguing platform for modding and customization. Should I happen to find lots of extra time and money, I'd start there and go nuts.

[Mclaneinc]

As said a few times, 800XL and U1MB, anything else is pure eye / ear candy...

 

The one upgrade I'd LOVE to have seen really exploited was the VBXE but sadly its been a bit under used....

 

Oh, possibly a video output quality upgrade, we all like a nicer picture..

[ultrasteve]

I'm also in the 'leave it alone' camp I think, at least of late. I'm not averse to doing a bit of soldering, but with my Ultimate Cart I don't think I really have the need for a RAM upgrade, and the SCART output I have from my 800XL and 65XE to my 14" CRT is good enough for the time being I think. I wouldn't rule a video mod out completely, as I think RGB on a bigger flat screen could be good in the future, but for now, the little free time I have to enjoy my machines, I want to spend actually playing the games I love from my youth.

[leech]

I'm a purist as well, which is why I was thinking I'd have one single machine upgraded all the way, then keep the others original.

 

Unfortunately I found out last night that my one singular power brick that I have (I lost the others in a move) has started to go to that special place where old Atari equipment goes...

 

So I guess I'll be putting in a long overdue order to Best and hope that the three machines I tried last night didn't get fried (800xl, XEGS, 130XE). To be honest, I'm not sure if the XEGS was ever even tested. I picked it up for about $5 from the Deseret Industries many moons ago. For a while there, people were just dumping their old computers there, so I found those. All I see there now are crappy intel boxes.

[ApolloBoy]

Unfortunately I found out last night that my one singular power brick that I have (I lost the others in a move) has started to go to that special place where old Atari equipment goes...

You can replace that by grafting the cord onto a decent 5V PSU. In fact if you build the proper cable (and use a good charger) you can even power an A8 off of USB. This only applies to the 600/800XL and the XEs though. Edited November 11, 2016 by ApolloBoy

[fujidude]

I'm a purist as well, which is why I was thinking I'd have one single machine upgraded all the way, then keep the others original.

 

Unfortunately I found out last night that my one singular power brick that I have (I lost the others in a move) has started to go to that special place where old Atari equipment goes...

 

So I guess I'll be putting in a long overdue order to Best and hope that the three machines I tried last night didn't get fried (800xl, XEGS, 130XE). To be honest, I'm not sure if the XEGS was ever even tested. I picked it up for about $5 from the Deseret Industries many moons ago. For a while there, people were just dumping their old computers there, so I found those. All I see there now are crappy intel boxes.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would get a quality, UL listed (or similar cert) 5VDC power supply that has ample current reserves. I would probably buy something like this. Then I would "graft" the Atari power plug onto the output cable. Or, perhaps I might convert the cable with the Atari plug to have a the barrel style jack on the other end. And, at 5 amps capable, it should easily power even the most upgraded A8.

 

The benefit of going this route is that you get quality that will deliver the proper voltage, won't burn you house down, and will last longer than the average to low end Chinese special.

 

PS: And you'll notice the price is actually very competitive with your average run of the mill mass market e-tailer offerings. Granted you would need to add a IEC power cord, but then doesn't everyone have plenty of extras they have collected over the years?

Edited November 11, 2016 by fujidude

[leech]

I am about to order 2 of the newer (rebuildable) PSUs from Best Electronics, plus one for the 800. Keep it real, keep it Atari...

 

Though it would be interesting to see a USB to DIN connector to power up an A8 through USB. Just stay away from USB-C adapters, you never know if they'll make your device light on fire

[ApolloBoy]

Though it would be interesting to see a USB to DIN connector to power up an A8 through USB.

I built one recently, it works great but you have to remember to use a proper charger otherwise you'll get interference. I wouldn't recommend connecting it to a computer since you'll only get 500 mA of current, not enough to power an A8.

 

Just stay away from USB-C adapters, you never know if they'll make your device light on fire

Uhhh that wasn't really the issue with the Note 7, if that's what you're referring to. There's absolutely nothing wrong with USB-C from a safety standpoint and you could power an A8 just fine if you spliced a 7-pin DIN on a USB-C cable.