Are Classic Mini controllers OEM to Nintendo controllers made 30 years ago?

[icemanxp300]

Lets have a civil response.

 

It is being argued that the classic mini controllers made today in 2016 are OEM to the Original NES controllers manufactured 30 years ago.

 

Argument A. They are OEM because both controllers were authorized by Nintendo, Therefore the classic mini controllers are OEM to the originals.

 

Argument B. They are NOT OEM because they are different, made 30 years later, and made for an entirely different system, and most likely manufactured by a completely different company.

[Andromeda Stardust]

I voted "no" (are we even allowed to disclose our opinion at the polling place?). I predict one token vote from Maxim for yes, and an overwhelming majority no votes.

[dgdgagdae]

I'm not sure that the question makes sense. Can something be "OEM" to a company? It's either OEM or not, isn't it?

[godslabrat]

Let's just not go there.

[icemanxp300]

I'm not sure that the question makes sense. Can something be "OEM" to a company? It's either OEM or not, isn't it?

 

LOL this is the argument. OEM means "original equipment manufacturer".

 

The argument is whether something made 30 years later that's looks like the original can be considered OEM just because the Title company in this case "Nintendo" has branded their name on both products.

[Skippy B. Coyote]

I guess the best way to answer the question from my perspective is to figure out whether or not the new NES Mini controllers feel identical to the originals and are made from the same materials as the originals. Same plastic types for the shell and buttons, same dimensions, same button contacts, etc. I haven't tried one yet so I can't contribute an opinion on the subject, but I would be interested in finding out.

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

LOL this is the argument. OEM means "original equipment manufacturer".

 

The argument is whether something made 30 years later that's looks like the original can be considered OEM just because the Title company in this case "Nintendo" has branded their name on both products.

Yeah, you wouldn't expect 2016 Dodge Charger parts to fit on a '69 General Lee. Same applies here. Both cables have five wires but the similarities end there.

 

 

I guess the best way to answer the question from my perspective is to figure out whether or not the new NES Mini controllers feel identical to the originals and are made from the same materials as the originals. Same plastic types for the shell and buttons, same dimensions, same button contacts, etc. I haven't tried one yet so I can't contribute an opinion on the subject, but I would be interested in finding out.

Physically there are minute differences under the hood. Even the membranes are not an exact fit. My recommendation is to use aftermarket membranes (if a good cleaning isn't enough) to refurbish your vintage controllers.

[MaximRecoil]

Lets have a civil response.

 

It is being argued that the classic mini controllers made today in 2016 are OEM to the Original NES controllers manufactured 30 years ago.

 

Argument A. They are OEM because both controllers were authorized by Nintendo, Therefore the classic mini controllers are OEM to the originals.

 

Argument B. They are NOT OEM because they are different, made 30 years later, and made for an entirely different system, and most likely manufactured by a completely different company.

 

No, I haven't argued that "the classic mini controllers made today in 2016 are OEM to the Original NES controllers manufactured 30 years ago." I've pointed out more than once that there's no such thing as "OEM to (insert product here)". You're conflating the term "OEM" with the term "original". It is valid to say that something is original to something, but it makes no sense to say that something is OEM to something. NES Mini controller parts are obviously not original to NES controllers, but that doesn't change the fact that they are OEM parts.

 

Strictly speaking, the term "OEM" refers to a manufacturer, e.g., "Company A is an OEM for Company B". In vernacular we also refer to certain parts as "OEM", meaning they were manufactured by an OEM. An OEM part is always an OEM part, regardless of what you use it for. It is an OEM part when sitting on the shelf, it is an OEM part if jury-rigged to work with a product from an unrelated manufacturer, and so on. If it was manufactured by an OEM it is an OEM part forever.

Edited November 14, 2016 by MaximRecoil

[MaximRecoil]

Yeah, you wouldn't expect 2016 Dodge Charger parts to fit on a '69 General Lee. Same applies here. Both cables have five wires but the similarities end there.

 

The fact that you can successfully do a board swap, as proven by the video that you graciously linked to, proves that the similarities don't end there. Also, the fact that a NES and NES Mini controller are visually ~indistinguishable aside from [presumably] the markings on the back, the cord length, and style of plug, proves that the similarities don't end there.

 

You might not expect hood hinges from a 1970s (and some 1980s) Dodge fullsize pickup to fit on a '69 Charger either, but they do. And of course, this has nothing to do with whether or not a given part is OEM. OEM status is determined by who manufactured it, not by what some random person eventually uses it for or what it's compatible with.

 

 

Physically there are minute differences under the hood. Even the membranes are not an exact fit. My recommendation is to use aftermarket membranes (if a good cleaning isn't enough) to refurbish your vintage controllers.

 

Or, you can just do a board swap and end up with a Nintendo-brand controller which works with an NES, that's all brand new aside from the PCB and cord.

Edited November 14, 2016 by MaximRecoil

[HoshiChiri]

An OEM NES controller would be a Nintendo manufactured controller from the 80s/early 90s.

 

An OEM Classic Mini controller are the units available from Nintendo today for the NES Classic Mini system.

 

Just because many/all of the parts can be interchanged does not make them one and the same. Even if Nintendo started making replacement NES controllers now by slapping the old connector on the classic mini units, it wouldn't be the same thing. Vintage does matter to some people.

 

For example: voice actor Vic Mignogna has a Captain Kirk costume. He bought it from the gentleman that inherited the leftover fabric and patterns from the filming of season 3. So, all the materials are authentic, but it didn't exist until decades after filming ended. Is it a 'vintage original series costume'? I would say no- super authentic replica, yes, but the idiosyncrasies of the manufacture process & the quirks that come with age are distinctly missing. Fabrics pull, pill, and fade. Controllers get worn down button pads & break connections/traces. Things you just won't deal with on modern pieces. In short- a replica by the original guy is still a replica.

[Retro-Z]

It is my opinion that your definition of OEM may be a bit too broad.

 

For instance, the AM radios used in 1967 and 1968 Mustangs are 100% interchangeable. However, there are a few minor differences, such as the radio station preset buttons being different (chromed on the 67 versions and black on the 68 units) and the both having different parts numbers. Both are "OEM" Ford radios. However, a 1968 radio is NOT an OEM 1967 Mustang part. Anyone selling a 1968 Mustang AM radio as an OEM 1967 Mustang radio is mistaken. In the end, it is a 1968 Mustang radio that just happens to also be compatible with the 1967 model year cars.

 

You are right... an OEM part is an OEM part. However, an OEM part for one thing is NOT an OEM "Original Equipment" part for something different.

 

Consequently, a 2016 Nintendo NES Classic controller is NOT an OEM 1980s NES controller. The internal component differences should reinforce this fact. However, the 2016 controller IS compatible with the PCB/cord of the 1980s controller.

 

In your definition, any company that has ever made parts for any other company is an OEM, even if the parts themselves are different for different applications. Looking at another extreme, if I shove a 1970s Pioneer stereo into a Scion car, is it still an OEM radio (since Scion vehicles are equipped with Pioneer stereos as original equipment, and consequently, Pioneer is an "Original Equipment Manufacturer")?

 

It would seem you are focusing too much on the "Manufacturer" part of the term "OEM", and not enough on the "Original" part...

 

"OEM" is an often misused term, so it's easy to see how people interpret it differently.

Edited November 15, 2016 by Retro-Z

[icemanxp300]

 

No, I haven't argued that "the classic mini controllers made today in 2016 are OEM to the Original NES controllers manufactured 30 years ago

 

These post clearly say otherwise.

 

 

...

[MaximRecoil]

It is my opinion that your definition of OEM may be a bit too broad.

 

For instance, the AM radios used in 1967 and 1968 Mustangs are 100% interchangeable. However, there are a few minor differences, such as the radio station preset buttons being different (chromed on the 67 versions and black on the 68 units) and the both having different parts numbers. Both are "OEM" Ford radios. However, a 1968 radio is NOT an OEM 1967 Mustang part. Anyone selling a 1968 Mustang AM radio as an OEM 1967 Mustang radio is mistaken. In the end, it is a 1968 Mustang radio that just happens to also be compatible with the 1967 model year cars.

 

You are right... an OEM part is an OEM part. However, an OEM part for one thing is NOT an OEM "Original Equipment" part for something different.

 

Consequently, a 2016 Nintendo NES Classic controller is NOT an OEM 1980s NES controller. The internal component differences should reinforce this fact. However, the 2016 controller IS compatible with the PCB/cord of the 1980s controller.

 

In your definition, any company that has ever made parts for any other company is an OEM, even if the parts themselves are different for different applications. Looking at another extreme, if I shove a 1970s Pioneer stereo into a Scion car, is it still an OEM radio (since Scion vehicles are equipped with Pioneer stereos as original equipment, and consequently, Pioneer is an "Original Equipment Manufacturer")?

 

It would seem you are focusing too much on the "Manufacturer" part of the term "OEM", and not enough on the "Original" part...

 

"OEM" is an often misused term, so it's easy to see how people interpret it differently.

 

You're also conflating the term "OEM" with "original", and yes, it is an often misused term, misused in exactly the way you are misusing it. "OEM part" simply means a part manufactured by an OEM, and a part manufactured by an OEM is always an OEM part regardless of what you do with it. Again, "OEM" actually refers to the manufacturer.

 

All original parts on a particular product are OEM, but not all OEM parts are original. To further complicate matters, there are two degrees of what people consider to be "original":

 

1. The specific part that was installed at the factory on your product.

2. An identical part from the same manufacturer, often taken from a different example of the same make and model product.

 

With regard to parts that have serial numbers, people are less likely to use/accept the number 2 sense of the word "original", which is where the concept of "numbers matching" comes into play.

 

But either way, OEM is not synonymous with "original".

[Flojomojo]

I vote for option C, "who the f$ck cares?"

 

It's ELMO time.

 

Everybody

Let's

Move

On

 

[Hyperboy]

 

Sent from my non beer holding hand.

[MaximRecoil]

 

These post clearly say otherwise.

 

MR 3.jpg

 

...

 

My post says no such thing. I never argued "that the classic mini controllers made today in 2016 are OEM to the Original NES controllers manufactured 30 years ago," because such an argument is nonsense, i.e., "OEM to the Original NES controllers" doesn't mean anything in the English language. I said that they are OEM, period, and they are. Again, the term "OEM" is not interchangeable with the term "original". Your poll is a straw man.

[dgdgagdae]

More importantly, why doesn't ignoring someone in the web version of the forum carry over to Tapatalk? I have to manually scroll past the dickery!

[icemanxp300]

 

My post says no such thing. I never argued "that the classic mini controllers made today in 2016 are OEM to the Original NES controllers manufactured 30 years ago," because such an argument is nonsense, i.e., "OEM to the Original NES controllers" doesn't mean anything in the English language. I said that they are OEM, period, and they are. Again, the term "OEM" is not interchangeable with the term "original". Your poll is a straw man.

 

Dude your whole argument was based off the fact you stated wanting to use the new classic mini controllers for replacement parts for the nes controllers.

 

I said I see no reason why to use the new ones (over aftermarket replacement membranes) and you replied because they are not OEM. That right there implies you are saying new classic mini controllers components are OEM to nes controllers.

 

You are now trying to change your entire argument from the last thread. Maybe what you meant and what you wrote are 2 different things.... I would fully believe that coming from you.

 

 

...

[Dashopepper]

On IGNs Nintendo podcast they said something about Nintendo using the old dies. Not sure is this is confirmed.

[MaximRecoil]

 

Dude your whole argument was based off the fact you stated wanting to use the new classic mini controllers for replacement parts for the nes controllers.

 

So? What else would I use them for?

 

I said I see no reason why to use the new ones and you replied because they are not OEM. That right there implies you are saying new classic mini controllers components are OEM to nes controllers.

 

It implies no such thing, especially since "OEM to nes controllers" is pure jibberish. Since you seem to think that "OEM" is an alternate spelling of "original", I'll assume you meant "original to nes controllers", and in that case, NES Mini controller parts are obviously not original parts for NES controllers; that goes without saying. I want OEM because in my experience, OEM is the safest bet in terms of quality (which I've already pointed out in the other thread), because they are built to the design and specifications of the original manufacturer. The alternative is parts made in a random Chinese factory with no input or authorization whatsoever from the original manufacturer. Me wanting OEM parts has nothing to do with originality.

 

You are now trying to change your entire argument from the last thread. Maybe what you meant and what you wrote are 2 different things.... I would fully believe that coming from you.

 

MR 1a.jpg

 

I haven't changed anything. You can't quote me saying anything even remotely similar to what you've claimed my argument was, because I never said any such thing. I said they were OEM, full stop, which they, in fact, are. The issue here is that OEM doesn't mean what you think it means, which I pointed out to you immediately in that other thread, and reiterated several times. Your poll question is a straw man. It also doesn't mean anything in the English language.

Edited November 15, 2016 by MaximRecoil

[exo]

Lets have a civil response.

 

 

 

Well, there goes that.

[MaximRecoil]

Lets have a civil response.

 

 

*Proceeds to construct a straw man*

 

 

 

Well, there goes that.

 

Fixed. There is nothing civil about constructing a straw man. On the other hand, I haven't said anything uncivil in this thread.

Edited November 15, 2016 by MaximRecoil

[Retro-Z]

 

You're also conflating the term "OEM" with "original", and yes, it is an often misused term, misused in exactly the way you are misusing it. "OEM part" simply means a part manufactured by an OEM, and a part manufactured by an OEM is always an OEM part regardless of what you do with it. Again, "OEM" actually refers to the manufacturer.

 

All original parts on a particular product are OEM, but not all OEM parts are original. To further complicate matters, there are two degrees of what people consider to be "original":

 

1. The specific part that was installed at the factory on your product.

2. An identical part from the same manufacturer, often taken from a different example of the same make and model product.

 

With regard to parts that have serial numbers, people are less likely to use/accept the number 2 sense of the word "original", which is where the concept of "numbers matching" comes into play.

 

But either way, OEM is not synonymous with "original".

 

Hmm... I guess I just prefer to distinguish between what's original for one thing and what's original for another. However, I regularly deal in lots of little original parts for random and sometimes obscure products, and I've found that most people expect the term "OEM" to signify some degree of originality to the respective end product.

 

Otherwise, it's easy to mis-represent items, like selling an original 1980s NES controller PCB installed into NES Classic controller housing as "LIKE-NEW Genuine Nintendo NES controller restored with 100% genuine OEM Nintendo parts". While that statement may be 100% accurate, I think it's important that a prospective buyer should know that the housing came from a recently made product and the internal electronics from something made 30 years ago.

 

The distributor installed in my car is an aftermarket item that was made by a manufacturer that never directly sold distributors to the company that made my vehicle. However, that parts manufacturer likely makes parts that are original equipment for OTHER brands of vehicles, so the part manufacturer is most certainly an "OEM". However, that does not make the distributor I installed an OEM part, as it was never "Original Equipment" for my vehicle. It would be completely dishonest for me, when selling this car, to say "ya, I just installed an OEM distributor about 10,000 miles ago". However, using your definition, it is most CERTAINLY an OEM part, as it was a part manufactured by an OEM, even if that company NEVER made parts that are original equipment for that particular brand of vehicle.

 

Besides, "OEM" isn't necessarily a good thing. I've seen many different products that have flawed OEM parts that are fixed by using higher quality aftermarket parts. For instance, Atari controllers have LOTS of upgrade kits available to correct the flaws present in lower quality parts made by Atari or their OEMs.

Edited November 15, 2016 by Retro-Z

[Andromeda Stardust]

On IGNs Nintendo podcast they said something about Nintendo using the old dies. Not sure is this is confirmed.

They are different parts. I linked a teardown video in the other thread with vintage NES versus Classic Mini controllers.

[icemanxp300]

The alternative is parts made in a random Chinese factory with no input or authorization whatsoever from the original manufacturer.

 

LOL first off where exactly are Nintendo products made?

 

2nd your problem the entire time through both threads is you mistakenly calling Nintendo a manufacturer. Nintendo is NOT a Manufacturer. Nintendo is a Company name.

 

Let me use real life experience for you. I worked at a Manufacturing plant called Pactiv we made lots of Styrofoam products. We made Styrofoam plates and such for many COMPANIES such as Great Value, however the parent company associated w/the manufacturing plant of Pactiv was Reynolds. This means the Company Reynolds such as for Reynolds wrap has their products made by the Manufacturer Pactiv, just as Great Value, and Hefty, and so on.

 

Nintendo does NOT manufacture anything they pay Manufacturing plants "IN CHINA might I ad" to make them their products for them. Manufacturing is a chain of plants.

 

Nintendo will say what they want and check and make sure the product is made to their specifications but that is all they do.

 

So to sum up what you want to say properly is as follow.

 

You would rather use a classic mini controller for parts for an original NES controller because it has Nintendo's approval of quality from whatever OEM facility they chose which is NOT Nintendo because Nintendo is NOT a manufacturer. You would rather use these Nintendo approved OEM classic mini components that replicate the original NES controller but are not made for the original Nes controller instead of using aftermarket components designed specifically for the NES controller. Go right ahead.