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keepdreamin

Framemeister production drawing to a close.

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If you were on the fence about getting one, now is probably the time. One of the main ICs is being discontinued by the manufacturer in Feb 2017. There's actually a shortage right now which is why the ebay prices are going up. Micomsoft is doing one final order to sell stock through the year. How long this lasts depends on demand I guess. I'm guessing there will be a follow up device at some point (4K maybe?), but given time for R&D ..no idea when it will materialize. There's been no official announcement either of a Framemeister 2.

 

http://www.micomsoft.co.jp/micomsoft_news3.htm

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Wow, I wonder if they're working on a new model as we speak. They've got a long history of updating the xrgb products so I'm sure we won't see the end of the xrgb line.

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Hmm... So there'll either be a new device that they'll have to make just to have something to sell and not lose this market to somebody else, or speculators and picture enthusiasts are about to drive the prices of these sky high. Well, if these do cease to be made at least there's still HD-CRT sets that have HDMI inputs.

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. Well, if these do cease to be made at least there's still HD-CRT sets that have HDMI inputs.

 

I don't understand what this has to do with anything :? . The framemeister takes analog inputs and upscales to a digital HDMI out, especially for use with modern flat panels.... Please explain how owning an HD crt equates to the non availability of an upscaler box, cause I don't see the connection here.

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Dang, and I'd just settled on getting one, but don't have the scratch right now.

 

Looks like this will be one that got away for me. Maybe I'll find a cheap secondhand one, maybe the FrameMeister 2 will be more my speed anyway. We'll see.

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With that announcement and the fact Solaris won't have stock until the end of January, I doubt secondhand units will be "cheap."

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So without me looking , how much is it to buy one from the site and not from ebay ? It used to be around 320.00 They will just starting making an upgraded one so no worries .

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With that announcement and the fact Solaris won't have stock until the end of January, I doubt secondhand units will be "cheap."

 

Not right away, no. But depending on what happens to demand, the price could drop a lot 2-3 years out. I'm playing the long game on this one... getting one now isn't an option, so might as well see what a potential replacement unit does to the market. It might be like an original Wii, where you can't give them away... or like a Gamecube Component cable, where you have to hawk kidneys for it.

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I guess it depends just how niche this product is. Seems like they'd make a follow on with similar parts. This announcement makes me want one even though it's not a problem I feel I have.

 

Bing translation of the link:

 

12/1/2016

Microcomputer software co., Ltd.

 

Always thank continued vising microcomputer software products.

Discontinued products "FRAMEMEISTER" major IC that has been announced. Last order is 2/2017. Is going to buy during more than a year continued as an adequate stock of additional purchases, since February. That inventory is gone as soon as they end. In order to reliably deliver all travel plans 2/2017 the our distributors or answer please.

To our customers, understanding and please help thank you. Our products patronage continued to appreciate again.

 

* As previously reported, the IC delay, temporarily out of stock. 2/2017 is back in stock after a being planned to ship the produce as normal.

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I don't understand what this has to do with anything :? . The framemeister takes analog inputs and upscales to a digital HDMI out, especially for use with modern flat panels.... Please explain how owning an HD crt equates to the non availability of an upscaler box, cause I don't see the connection here.

An HD CRT that has the HDMI inputs can remove the need for an upscaler if the upscaler is used to enhance the image on an LCD set. Also works wonders if you have an HDMI-modded console. It's the best of both worlds, and if the Framemeisters do become unavailable or drastically escalate in price there'll be renewed interest in just using an HDMI CRT set.

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An HD CRT that has the HDMI inputs can remove the need for an upscaler if the upscaler is used to enhance the image on an LCD set. Also works wonders if you have an HDMI-modded console. It's the best of both worlds, and if the Framemeisters do become unavailable or drastically escalate in price there'll be renewed interest in just using an HDMI CRT set.

 

uh..... what?

 

This makes absolutely no sense. :ponder: The whole point of the framemeister is to give SD consoles an HDMI output for use on modern displays. If I want to hook my genesis up to a new 4K samsung, purchasing a HD- crt doesn't remedy that. How are you going to enhance the image (whatever that means) over HDMI if you don't have an upscaler to give you an HDMI signal in the first place? Also, if you're going to bother with a CRT, why wouldn't you just buy a standard definition set to begin with?.... :?

 

Are there actually people HDMI modding NES units only to turn around and use them on a HD crt? That's just bonkers.

 

People buy the Framemeister because they're looking to game on their new tv and not a crt.

 

You're basically saying the solution to gaming on your new tv and not needing crt... is to not game on your new tv and you do need a crt... :dunce:

Edited by keepdreamin

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The need for devices like this will only grow, so something better and cheaper will come along the path soon. We're about far enough out of the age of SD CRT's where these should cease being a niche product like they've been, at least where classic gaming enthusiast, laserdiscs collectors, and so on are concerned.

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An HD CRT that has the HDMI inputs can remove the need for an upscaler if the upscaler is used to enhance the image on an LCD set. Also works wonders if you have an HDMI-modded console. It's the best of both worlds, and if the Framemeisters do become unavailable or drastically escalate in price there'll be renewed interest in just using an HDMI CRT set.

 

I highly doubt it. For one, HD CRTs are huge. Few want these large, hulking devices in their homes anymore. Second, getting consoles HDMI modded is ridiculously expensive (if even an available option, not all have HDMI mods). It's cheaper to buy a quality upscaler and get RGB cables for the consoles that do it out of the box. No retro console does HDMI out of the box.

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In spite of the price, my Framemeister remains the best and most versatile upscaler I own.

 

The OSSC was a promising alternative but it doesn't have a framebuffer; so it can't do things like converting 50hz to 60hz. Still it'sould worth mentioning as a choice if you can live with its limitations. More here:

http://retrogaming.hazard-city.de/ossc.html

Edited by Newsdee
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In spite of the price, my Framemeister remains the best and most versatile upscaler I own.

 

The OSSC was a promising alternative but it doesn't have a framebuffer; so it can't do things like converting 50hz to 60hz. Still it'sould worth mentioning as a choice if you can live with its limitations. More here:

http://retrogaming.hazard-city.de/ossc.html

 

for the average retro gamer who just wants to plug in a mess of consoles and be off and running, the OSSC isn't really the best choice. my life in gaming did a great review on it.

 

OSSC coverage starts at 18:20

Edited by keepdreamin
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for the average retro gamer who just wants to plug in a mess of consoles and be off and running, the OSSC isn't really the best choice

Yes, atually I forgot that it also doesn't handle audio and is very rough around the edges compared to the XRGB.

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I did a comparison with a cheap scaler vs the framemeister playing an nes. I don't remember which cheap scaler it was but the picture looked horrible compared to the framemeister. Some people probably just get a cheap scaler and think it's good enough and don't even know what they are missing.

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This video best explains HD CRTs

 

 

HD CRTs do offer the best of both worlds, the smoothness of a CRT with high definition modes. But they only have componet inputs so you'll need a HDMI converter.

 

And as much as I would love to have one in my bedroom, I am not lugging that big heavy thing up the steps. :P

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Damn I go off grid for a couple of months and this happens. Funny I saw a Framemeister at the pawn shop while I was on connectivity sabbatical. Maybe I will go back and try to get it. I still use one of those cheapo converters though which suffices for my needs for now but new TV's are losing the Component inputs strictly for HDMI only and I would like to get a newer TV at some point.

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An HD CRT that has the HDMI inputs can remove the need for an upscaler if the upscaler is used to enhance the image on an LCD set. Also works wonders if you have an HDMI-modded console. It's the best of both worlds, and if the Framemeisters do become unavailable or drastically escalate in price there'll be renewed interest in just using an HDMI CRT set.

If you prefer, and have the space for, a CRT then go for a standard definition one: If you can mod the console for s-video or RGB, you'll have the best picture possible, support for lightguns and no lag.

 

The point of an upscaler like the framemeister is to being able to use a modern TVs while bypassing the scalers built-into them or overcome the lack of standard def inputs on some models.

Upscalers built-in the TV, and most of the cheap external ones, have filters designed with movies and tv-shows in mind, which increase lag over what's strictly necessary to buffer and upscale the image and generally degrade the picture from an old console (and sometimes don't deal correctly with the non-standard non-interlaced signal).

Modifying the console for High Def output (which I guess still requires a frame buffer and so introduces at least a minimal lag and breaks compatibility with lightguns) to use it with a CRT doesn't make sense.

 

 

BTW, I'm one of those who keeps CRTs around for the sole purpose of using them for retrocomputers and consoles. When/if the last of my CRT will stop working I'll switch to emulation as the compromises determined by using real hardware with a digital TV are not acceptable to me. I'm not interested at all in high def video out on old consoles, being it the result of a video mod, a new FPGA recreation of old hardware or an upscaler like the framemeister. But I do understand the reasons why others have different opinion and I'm confident that as long as there will be interest in old consoles, devices like the framemeister will continue to be designed and produced.

 

Edited by alex_79

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