Atari "Video Chess" 400/800 Cartridge?

[electronizer]

I haven't had much time to investigate this since my last post. I did send an email to Larry Wagner, who co-authored Video Chess for the 2600 along with Bob Whitehead. Larry got back to me and said he'd be willing to chat, but we haven't been able to set anything up yet. I haven't been able to find contact information for Bob Whitehead. I was also thinking someone like Joe Decuir might know something about this cartridge, since he probably had knowledge of early marketing efforts for the 400/800 computers. Anyone know the best way to get in touch with him?

 

This week, Scooter83 sent me a photo that shows there were other cartridges that stated the number of games (in this case, a Basketball cartridge that says "5 Computer Games"). Also similar to my cartridge, the part number is different (CXL4002 for this Basketball cartridge as compared to CXL4004 for the production cartridge). I wonder how many other games exist with this style of label?

 

[Atari8bitCarts]

This week, Scooter83 sent me a photo that shows there were other cartridges that stated the number of games (in this case, a Basketball cartridge that says "5 Computer Games"). Also similar to my cartridge, the part number is different (CXL4002 for this Basketball cartridge as compared to CXL4004 for the production cartridge). I wonder how many other games exist with this style of label?

 

The Atari numbering scheme was long before 1979 determined, and CXL4002 was slated for Basic.

The original press release shows LIFE, chess, and the other original cartridge releases.

Checkbook is different as the Atari number was assigned and given, for Personal Finance, but Atari decided to provide that as a disk based solution eventually.

Knowing the history behind these carts them would help decide further, but I guess that is still unknown, even after more have come to light?

 

I would call them project carts, possibly from an Atari employee. But they didn't use the typical PCB. And the label looks like an Atari distributor type (i.e. B&C and Best produced copies, etc.) Tempest knows more about prototypes, but I have seen enough pass by me

 

Or someone just making them and fu$#$'ing with us.

atari-400-800-launch-press-kit.pdf

[Scooter83]

Ive remember years ago which got me looking and finding the picture I sent over. was a BASIC cart with a CXL4006 number. I would guess mock carts ( for as the casing is concerned ) would be a good a correct statement. The board and eprom chips and program has me thinking probably a close to finish version of the game from what we see. Maybe it was a finished version before the name change ( which also explains the difference in code from a finished Computer Chess ). Just a thought there.

 

I still say this is a prototype and the label is most likely by Atari. Just like you said a mock label for a picture shoot. and they had a copy of the game made up most likely to be in the Atari 400 so they could power it on show a game in the shoot. Thats kinda where I sit on the subject.

 

His is a CXL4003 mock, the picture shows a CXL4002 mock and I recall a BASIC with a CXL4006 mock. I guess Atari just did these things randomly when coming up with the mock part number for the labels.

[+hunmanik]

(Somehow I missed this thread at the time.)

 

So where did that picture of CXL4001 BASIC and CXL4002 Basketball carts come from?

 

I went looking for it.  Instead I found another:

https://archive.org/details/Atari800OperatorsManualFirstVersion1979/page/n6/mode/1up 

 

I believe we learned from the Antic podcast interview with Liza Loop, who wrote that version of the 800 manual, that this pre-release version of the manual was made for the January 1979 CES.  So that could help put an apparent timeframe on the found "video chess" CXL4003 computer cartridge.  

 

I had forgotten, this version of the 800 manual stated that the 800 would come with the BASIC and Basketball carts.

 

It sure seems like the first three carts originally planned for the 400/800 were 1) BASIC, 2) Basketball, and 3) Chess, before plans changed and the numbering system was re-started.

 

Lastly, I found this thread seeking to verify the author of Computer Chess (400/800 version).  Some web sources credit Wagner and Whitehead, same as the 2600 cart.  Maybe?  

[Kr0tki]

A fellow Wikipedia editor revealed to me once that Whitehead has himself confirmed working on this cartridge when interviewed by Kevin Bunch for the latter's podcast; the interview is unfortunately behind a paywall.

[electronizer]

hunmanik, thanks for posting the link to the early version of the 800 manual—that styling definitely looks like the label on my cartridge.

 

I did end up talking to Larry Wagner—he graciously gave me some of his time and we had a good discussion about the early days of Atari. I was looking through my notes and these two points seem relevant:

 

- Larry recalls that someone else took the 2600 source code for Video Chess and modified it to work on the 400/800

 

- Larry was researching bank switching with EPROMs and has a prototype that looks like my cartridge (I’m assuming he meant the inside view, not the label)

 

 

Of course, this still doesn’t confirm anything about the origins or authenticity of my cartridge.

[+Stephen]

47 minutes ago, electronizer said:

hunmanik, thanks for posting the link to the early version of the 800 manual—that styling definitely looks like the label on my cartridge.

 

I did end up talking to Larry Wagner—he graciously gave me some of his time and we had a good discussion about the early days of Atari. I was looking through my notes and these two points seem relevant:

 

- Larry recalls that someone else took the 2600 source code for Video Chess and modified it to work on the 400/800

 

- Larry was researching bank switching with EPROMs and has a prototype that looks like my cartridge (I’m assuming he meant the inside view, not the label)

 

 

Of course, this still doesn’t confirm anything about the origins or authenticity of my cartridge.

Holy crap - you got to talk to Larry Wagner?  That's great.

[+hunmanik]

On 9/14/2020 at 4:18 PM, Kr0tki said:

A fellow Wikipedia editor revealed to me once that Whitehead has himself confirmed working on this cartridge when interviewed by Kevin Bunch for the latter's podcast; the interview is unfortunately behind a paywall.

Off track again for this thread, but for @Kr0tki and that Wiki discussion you were part of: two more very good sources supporting the point that Whitehead was not part of the 400/800 OS development team according to Al Miller in 1997:

 

https://archive.org/details/StellaAt20/Stella+at+20+-+tape+21+-+Discussion+at+Nolan+Bushnell's+estate+-+Activision.mp4 

at about 25:55

 

and especially

https://archive.org/details/StellaAt20/Stella+at+20+-+tape+08+-+David+Crane%2C+Al+Miller.mp4 

starting at about 4:20.  Here Miller goes on to say, several times if you keep listening, that Miller/Kaplan/Crane were assigned to work on the OS while Whitehead kept working on VCS carts.

 

Which seems to contradict the idea that Whitehead worked directly on the 400/800 chess cart.  Someone around here may have to pay to get to that Whitehead interview by Kevin Bunch...

 

 

 

[Kr0tki]

Thanks for researching the topic - we introduced the reference to that Tape 8 snippet already last year.

On 10/8/2020 at 4:28 AM, hunmanik said:

Which seems to contradict the idea that Whitehead worked directly on the 400/800 chess cart.  Someone around here may have to pay to get to that Whitehead interview by Kevin Bunch...

I have no reason not to trust Indrian - he is a well-respected, long-time Wikipedia editor with a proven track record.

Edited November 19, 2020 by Kr0tki