Sega Genesis with a discreet 3438...yeap...it is pretty awesome!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Did this audio mod the other night on my va3 HDG Genesis model 1. Basically you use a discreet yamaha 3438 synth and piggy back it off the original 2612 synth to get the benefits of the improved 3438. The benefits are a true 8-bit DAC so many of the sound samples are cleaned up and not as scratchy as they were always known to be (Or in some cases, they sound worse because the original programmers were hoping you couldn't tell anyway?!). There are some instruments changes and the PCM rhythms are especially enhanced doing this Mod. There are some drawbacks and I've listed this in much more detail in my blog entry here:

 

http://atariage.com/forums/blog/668/entry-13629-a-genesis-va3-model-1-with-proper-dac-possible-yesyes-it-is-but/

 

But this is what the Genesis can do with a proper synth added into it and using the excellent mixing and audio amp circuit that exists in the model 1 HDG Genesis versions:

 

Toejam and Earl 2 : Panic on Funkotron main theme:

 

 

ResQ - Level 5 music (Too bad this game never saw official commercial release?!)

 

Chuck Rock : Main Theme (an example of how some samples are improved, and others sound worse because they are being played back more clear).

 

 

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

Impressive stuff!

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

Is there a rom available for that ResQ game?

Edited January 27, 2017 by OldSchoolRetroGamer

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Is there a rom available for that ResQ game?

 

Sure is, just do the usual google searches for it. It isn't your typical video game and more like a platformer in game play. But I quite like it!

[crtfreak]

Dig the tunes. Would of loved for it to show both audio's in the video so you could really tell the difference.

 

Im going need to dig out one of my old Gen HD to try this out

[Emehr]

Wow! This is the first I've heard about this. I'm not much for modifying my original hardware but this is very tempting. I'd love to hear how the music from Golden Axe sounds.

[SoundGammon]

Any info on how to do this mod?

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Dig the tunes. Would of loved for it to show both audio's in the video so you could really tell the difference.

 

Im going need to dig out one of my old Gen HD to try this out

 

I did think about this, but as I'm not an expert on audio recording, it takes me far longer than most to get those done. Now, having said that, I am getting another HDG Genesis that I will mod in a similar fashion. I will add the RCA outputs for the audio on it directly from the sony amp chip to bybass the other circuit filtering as I did on this Genesis. I will take some music from that when I can and hopefully add that in as a before/after type comparison. I do plan to mod it with a discrete 3438 as well.

 

There are many on the Sega-16 forums however, that really find this mod lacking. I won't lie in that some games do sound off a bit from what I'm used to hearing. After Burner II is a good example. It used the original 2612's DAC defects to take advantage of making a decent Cymbal crash sound from them. However, on the 3438 it sounds wrong. That is just one example. I also noticed that a song in Streets of Rage 2 didn't sound right. Funny thing with that song, is that I've never heard the actual track played in game? So I didn't know about it until I pulled up the sound menu and started listening to the tracks. It is literally the second song in the test. On the original 2612 both the first and second songs essentially sound the same, but with the 3438, the second one has timing issues that are noticeable. But honestly for most of the games I play on the Genesis, it has been really awesome to play these games and hear them in this slightly enhanced way.

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Wow! This is the first I've heard about this. I'm not much for modifying my original hardware but this is very tempting. I'd love to hear how the music from Golden Axe sounds.

 

Hadn't thought about Golden Axe, I will have to give it a listen and can record some tracks to try and upload if you would like? Any specific tracks? And I have to check if there is a sound menu. I think I only have the first GA as part of the 3 game cart that came with Sonic, Shinobi, and GA. I have to look.

[+-^CrossBow^-]

If you are more familiar with this game, here is a small compilation of tracks directly from my Genesis's RCA jacks from one of my favorite games on the Genesis. This is raw audio straight to my computer with no additional filtering or edits other than the audio fades at the end. I originally recorded all of these tracks in raw 96khz 24bit audio. Youtube of course hoses this original high resolution audio, but you still get a great sense of what this mod sounds like in actuality. Enjoy one of Matt Furniss's best works on the Genesis with the game Wiz 'n' Liz for the Genesis though a 3438.

 

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Any info on how to do this mod?

 

I can't take the credit for it as I more or less discovered it by accident about a year ago on youtube. This isn't a new Mod as again, I've seen mention of it on the Sega-16 forums. However, they loathe this mod with a passion it would seem.

 

Anyway I'm not totally sure who found out about the exact process, but I credit Brandon MacEachern from YT with initially showing the details and audio examples of how it was done. Here is a link to his YT video. He doesn't describe exactly what he did, but in the video descriptions he lists the link for his schematic to do it. It isn't that hard, but I would advise that you get a decent dual wipe 24-pin socket to put everything into. This way if you decide you don't really like it, you can easily remove the piggy back 3438 and just restore the 2612 back to normal.

 

[Emehr]

 

Hadn't thought about Golden Axe, I will have to give it a listen and can record some tracks to try and upload if you would like? Any specific tracks? And I have to check if there is a sound menu. I think I only have the first GA as part of the 3 game cart that came with Sonic, Shinobi, and GA. I have to look.

 

 

That would be really great, thanks! There is a sound menu and any of the first four tracks would be cool to hear: (Wilderness, Turtle Village 1, Turtle Village 2, and Fiend's Path). The title music (I think it's called 'The Battle'), Battle Field, and Old Map are nice tunes as well.

[crtfreak]

If you are more familiar with this game, here is a small compilation of tracks directly from my Genesis's RCA jacks from one of my favorite games on the Genesis. This is raw audio straight to my computer with no additional filtering or edits other than the audio fades at the end. I originally recorded all of these tracks in raw 96khz 24bit audio. Youtube of course hoses this original high resolution audio, but you still get a great sense of what this mod sounds like in actuality. Enjoy one of Matt Furniss's best works on the Genesis with the game Wiz 'n' Liz for the Genesis though a 3438.

 

 

Man thats a great game. I spent more hours then I should playing it. Now Im definitely going to try this mod out

[SoundGammon]

 

I can't take the credit for it as I more or less discovered it by accident about a year ago on youtube. This isn't a new Mod as again, I've seen mention of it on the Sega-16 forums. However, they loathe this mod with a passion it would seem.

 

Anyway I'm not totally sure who found out about the exact process, but I credit Brandon MacEachern from YT with initially showing the details and audio examples of how it was done. Here is a link to his YT video. He doesn't describe exactly what he did, but in the video descriptions he lists the link for his schematic to do it. It isn't that hard, but I would advise that you get a decent dual wipe 24-pin socket to put everything into. This way if you decide you don't really like it, you can easily remove the piggy back 3438 and just restore the 2612 back to normal.

 

Thanks!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

I did record Golden Axe as requested but haven't compiled that together yet. I did however have these tracks previously recorded and upped them just a bit ago.

 

https://youtu.be/y6HmwFnljyE

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Unable to edit the previous post I made, but I had a few people ask me to include the last two tracks to Outrun, so I did so. Here is a new video containing all 5 tracks for Outrun through my 3438 on my Genesis HDG.

 

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Wow! This is the first I've heard about this. I'm not much for modifying my original hardware but this is very tempting. I'd love to hear how the music from Golden Axe sounds.

 

I have added Golden Axe. I will admit, this game was originally composed in mono only audio on the Genesis so to be honest, I can't hear much of a difference between the 3438 and the 2612 in regards to these songs and this game. Still, you might hear differences all the same. I did modify the audio on this one but only to normalize all the audio since again, this game is composed with a really low initial volume as compared to most other genesis games. You can even hear the line level noise of the electronics from the Genesis in these recordings because of this.

 

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Not requested but still another of my favorite games on the Genesis and it has an amazing sound track as well. Here is Gunstar Heroes from my modified Genesis. Only audio editing was just adding the fade outs at the end of each song. This is straight from the RCA jacks off my Genny... Enjoy!

 

[Emehr]

 

I have added Golden Axe. I will admit, this game was originally composed in mono only audio on the Genesis so to be honest, I can't hear much of a difference between the 3438 and the 2612 in regards to these songs and this game. Still, you might hear differences all the same. I did modify the audio on this one but only to normalize all the audio since again, this game is composed with a really low initial volume as compared to most other genesis games. You can even hear the line level noise of the electronics from the Genesis in these recordings because of this.

 

 

It sounds really good! A lot clearer than my stock set-up. Thanks for recording!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

This is the last of these compilations I will do for a while. Although I did record a few tracks from Bloodlines...but here is the original Yuzo Koshiro classic... Streets of Rage! This game thus far really seems like it was designed with the 3438 in mind all along. The first time i popped this in to play it again in the game room, I was blown away by the increased clarity, bass and instrumentation. I will have to look at possibly doing recordings for SOR2 in the future...

 

[+-^CrossBow^-]

I've got extra 3438s on hand now and can mod about 3 or 4 if anyone is interested...just FYI. PM for more details. Wouldn't be that expensive.

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Just finished up a quick comparison video between the 2612 and added in discrete 3438. I purposely chose songs that were very similar so that most people will hear that the songs sound essentially the same, just with enhanced instruments and percussion the way the songs were originally meant to be.

 

[phoenixdownita]

What about the megaamp:

http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?26568-Introducing-the-Mega-Amp-The-universal-Genesis-audio-circuit

 

I heard that it actually fixes all the mess Sega did on the outside circuitry and that at that point the integrated chips aren't bad at all.

 

 

EDIT: there's a v2 now

 

http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?31989-Take-your-Genesis-audio-to-the-next-level-The-Mega-Amp-2-0-is-here!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

What about the megaamp:

http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?26568-Introducing-the-Mega-Amp-The-universal-Genesis-audio-circuit

 

I heard that it actually fixes all the mess Sega did on the outside circuitry and that at that point the integrated chips aren't bad at all.

 

 

EDIT: there's a v2 now

 

http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?31989-Take-your-Genesis-audio-to-the-next-level-The-Mega-Amp-2-0-is-here!

 

Yes I looked into those, but they aren't really needed unless you have a va7 Model 1 or genesis model 2 system. Additionally a discrete 3438 isn't needed on the model 2 units because they already incorporate the 3438 synth design into the custom Sega ASIC. The discrete 3438 I've added to my genesis is to work with the 2612 doing all the logic while the 3438 produces the actual sound timbres. So yes it is a valid point that the mod I've done and talked about here is only for model 1 genesis systems that have the integrated YM2612 in them.

[phoenixdownita]

 

Yes I looked into those, but they aren't really needed unless you have a va7 Model 1 or genesis model 2 system. Additionally a discrete 3438 isn't needed on the model 2 units because they already incorporate the 3438 synth design into the custom Sega ASIC. The discrete 3438 I've added to my genesis is to work with the 2612 doing all the logic while the 3438 produces the actual sound timbres. So yes it is a valid point that the mod I've done and talked about here is only for model 1 genesis systems that have the integrated YM2612 in them.

But those boards can be used everywhere and it seems they actually bring out the very best sound on many/all the motherboard revisions.

My question then is why one would switch to the 3438 if the 2612 is doing its job and thru the MegaAmp the sound is not distorted/cut/muffled/etc...