Retroblox

[godslabrat]

I'm disappointed.

 

Though, a lot of people have drunk the cool aide on their forum. Was just reading two recent threads on the forum where the OPs raised legitimate concerns and other members immediately lept to the defence of Polymega.

 

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

I can't tell if it's true believers or shills. Way too many threads start with "Will the Polymega do x, y, and z?" Which is followed by "Of course! Read the FAQ!"

 

What perplexes me is, if they are true believers, upon WHAT do they base their trust in this project? Since the initial announcement, the polymega team has shown nothing of value. A case could be made that they've shown LESS than the Coleco Chameleon team. At least the Jaguar shells existed and had been proven to work!

 

Pre-orders are supposed to start in few weeks. Who in their right mind would drop any money on this with so little data?

[MagnaRyuu]

Okay has anyone seen this? http://comicbook.com/gaming/2017/09/19/interview-putting-together-retro-goodness-with-the-seedi-system

 

My observation is this can't be legal seeing as it would have to use the BIOS for the cd systems is claims to be able to play.

Also it seems to be selling open source emulators installed into it.

 

Here is the indiegogo https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/seedi-retro-gaming-system#/

Edited September 20, 2017 by MagnaRyuu

[NinjaWarrior]

Why do people still support crap like this?

 

There flooding the Market

[cybercylon]

There is just no end to this crap, is there?

 

Even if this system is real, did they give any thought to that name (Seedi)? Seedy shenanigans indeed....

[godslabrat]

Maybe it's time RetroArch themselves stepped in and started a formal process for using their software commercially. Right now, the logic seems to be that the emulators are free on the internet and the product itself is made in China, so derp derp derp who cares? If RA actually has a policy that says "We expect $x for every use of this product in a commercial sale." then they might be able to avoid some of the legal red tape.

 

I realize that goes against the spirit of the project, but so does crap like these Kickstarter boxes. It might be a fight worth having.

[androvsky]

Maybe it's time RetroArch themselves stepped in and started a formal process for using their software commercially. Right now, the logic seems to be that the emulators are free on the internet and the product itself is made in China, so derp derp derp who cares? If RA actually has a policy that says "We expect $x for every use of this product in a commercial sale." then they might be able to avoid some of the legal red tape.

 

I realize that goes against the spirit of the project, but so does crap like these Kickstarter boxes. It might be a fight worth having.

They kinda can't do that. The GPL3 license RetroArch uses is very strict in that everyone that receives the software has the same rights to the software. RA could ask for money for their project, but so could you or I, or Seedi. And by extension, anyone could give it away for free. Even if RA switched to a proprietary license, anyone could still use the last version that was GPL3 and the community could keep contributing to it (that's happened to many open-source projects). Granted, some of the emulation cores have different licenses, but most of them are GPL.

 

The interesting thing about GPL3 is it has an anti-Tivoization clause that requires device manufacturers to allow end users to modify the GPL3 code that's on the system, which tends to make it very awkward to use for most larger device makers that like to lock down their systems. One thing RA could do is license a proprietary version of RA that doesn't have that restriction, but it'd require every RA contributor to allow it, and anyone could still use the GPL3 version for free. But there's been a few GPL projects that have taken that route as well.

[Flojomojo]

That Seedi dingus looks incredibly cheaply made with paper thin plastic, if it even exists in the real world (photorealistic renders are everywhere nowadays). Their use of Retrode as their "cartridge adapter" is unimpressive, because why would I buy from them when I can just get that on my own?

 

To top it all off, that workmanlike writeup on the comicbook.com site is by Robert Workman, he of the illustrious ReadRetro site, the online companion to Mike Kennedy's RETRO Magazine. He wrote most of the game reviews, viewable here via wayback machine. https://web.archive.org/web/20160412172546/http://readretro.com:80/

 

I wonder if Eli is going to bring that back? Right now, it says

 

Sorry, we're doing some work on the site

Thank you for being patient. We are doing some work on the site and will be back shortly.

[godslabrat]

Come to think of it... there is a rainbow logo...

[MagnaRyuu]

 

That Seedi dingus looks incredibly cheaply made with paper thin plastic, if it even exists in the real world (photorealistic renders are everywhere nowadays). Their use of Retrode as their "cartridge adapter" is unimpressive, because why would I buy from them when I can just get that on my own?

 

To top it all off, that workmanlike writeup on the comicbook.com site is by Robert Workman, he of the illustrious ReadRetro site, the online companion to Mike Kennedy's RETRO Magazine. He wrote most of the game reviews, viewable here via wayback machine. https://web.archive.org/web/20160412172546/http://readretro.com:80/

 

I wonder if Eli is going to bring that back? Right now, it says

 

 

Apparently you can't get the cartridge adapter from retrode anymore you have to go through businesses who are licensed to make and sell them

[Flojomojo]

Apparently you can't get the cartridge adapter from retrode anymore you have to go through businesses who are licensed to make and sell them

Looks like we can buy all we care to eat from the German reseller linked from the Retrode page ... https://www.dragonbox.de/en/search?controller=search&orderby=position&orderway=desc&search_query=retrode&submit_search=

[cybercylon]

Looks like we can buy all we care to eat from the German reseller linked from the Retrode page ... https://www.dragonbox.de/en/search?controller=search&orderby=position&orderway=desc&search_query=retrode&submit_search=

 

That is where I got mine. They run out stock, including the adapters for the other systems, but they replenish from time to time.

[elmer]

My observation is this can't be legal seeing as it would have to use the BIOS for the cd systems is claims to be able to play.

They clearly (although in small print) state that they're not shipping the system with anyone's copyrighted CD BIOS, and that you've got to supply your own.

 

That's perfectly legal.

 

 

Also it seems to be selling open source emulators installed into it.

Again, not even slightly illegal, as long as they comply with the terms of the GPL and other Open Source licenses for the software that they're using, i.e. avoiding the specific emulators that forbid commercial-use.

 

They're even saying that they'll release the software to their changes and CD-enhancements, which, if true, means that they're complying with the GPL, and are being honest about this.

 

Unlike the PolyParrot, which looks to be completely locked-down system, and so would violate basic GPL requirements, these guys are claiming to ship an open system that you can modify.

 

 

It looks like it's running a regular laptop CD drive inside a slightly-modified external-laptop-CD case. So when the laptop CD drive breaks in a few months, you can probably just go out and buy a replacement.

 

Unlike the PolyParrot, which is using a slot-loading and claimed-customized CD drive.

 

 

From my POV, this is basically the honest-but-slighty-sad version of what the PolyParrot guys are trying to do.

 

It's just two guys that have got together to sell some pre-configured-and-easy-to-use cheap hardware and open-source software to stupid and lazy folks who can't be bother to read the instructions on how to set up their own box.

 

 

I wouldn't buy one, or recommend that anyone buy one, but I don't see why there's a rush to pile on and hate it.

 

It's just yet-another sign of our sad times in that most consumers/fans are tech-illiterate these days and that they'd rather have someone else do all of the "hard" stuff and throw some money at them instead of doing it themselves.

[dj_convoy]

Despite the dodginess of it showing up on Indiegogo, I'm not against an emulator box, especially when they are being up front and saying it's an emulator box you have to provide the BIOSes for.

[StopDrop&Retro]

^ agreed. As long as they're up front then I don't have a problem with a company repackaging something and charging for convenience.

 

I wish they would disclose what they're running, but going off the system compatibility list, it's clearly a Pi based console. In fact, their campaign is just a copy of the "indieGO!" https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/681890174/indiego-all-in-one-retro-game-console-raspberry-pi

[dj_convoy]

^ agreed. As long as they're up front then I don't have a problem with a company repackaging something and charging for convenience.

 

I wish they would disclose what they're running, but going off the system compatibility list, it's clearly a Pi based console. In fact, their campaign is just a copy of the "indieGO!" https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/681890174/indiego-all-in-one-retro-game-console-raspberry-pi

Well, this will all make a good video someday when you have some kind of "stop buying clone consoles on Indiegogo, you moron" compilation.

[MagnaRyuu]

They clearly (although in small print) state that they're not shipping the system with anyone's copyrighted CD BIOS, and that you've got to supply your own.

 

That's perfectly legal.

 

 

 

Again, not even slightly illegal, as long as they comply with the terms of the GPL and other Open Source licenses for the software that they're using, i.e. avoiding the specific emulators that forbid commercial-use.

 

They're even saying that they'll release the software to their changes and CD-enhancements, which, if true, means that they're complying with the GPL, and are being honest about this.

 

Unlike the PolyParrot, which looks to be completely locked-down system, and so would violate basic GPL requirements, these guys are claiming to ship an open system that you can modify.

 

 

It looks like it's running a regular laptop CD drive inside a slightly-modified external-laptop-CD case. So when the laptop CD drive breaks in a few months, you can probably just go out and buy a replacement.

 

Unlike the PolyParrot, which is using a slot-loading and claimed-customized CD drive.

 

 

From my POV, this is basically the honest-but-slighty-sad version of what the PolyParrot guys are trying to do.

 

It's just two guys that have got together to sell some pre-configured-and-easy-to-use cheap hardware and open-source software to stupid and lazy folks who can't be bother to read the instructions on how to set up their own box.

 

 

I wouldn't buy one, or recommend that anyone buy one, but I don't see why there's a rush to pile on and hate it.

 

It's just yet-another sign of our sad times in that most consumers/fans are tech-illiterate these days and that they'd rather have someone else do all of the "hard" stuff and throw some money at them instead of doing it themselves.

I'm not piling on hate was just curious. Also the inflections of speech in the indiegogo video just brings back memories of all those Vaporware systems that have been popping up over the last couple of years.

[godslabrat]

I'm not piling on hate was just curious. Also the inflections of speech in the indiegogo video just brings back memories of all those Vaporware systems that have been popping up over the last couple of years.

All that's missing is Gamester81's seal of approval. After the check clears, naturally.

[cybercylon]

Despite the dodginess of it showing up on Indiegogo, I'm not against an emulator box, especially when they are being up front and saying it's an emulator box you have to provide the BIOSes for.

By the book, I guess to get these CD based systems working, one of two things has to happen:

 

1. If the manufacturer provides the bios files, they are breaking the law.

2. If the manufacturer sells the device without those files, the user goes out and finds them, then the user is breaking the law unless they have the original hardware and have a means to extract the needed bios files (I bet many do not).

 

Option three is I guess a manufacturer writes compatible version of the bios files from ground zero (no different than these SOC boxes that runs carts), but my guess is that this is not very easy.

 

I didn't read the details of this newer endeavor as carefully. but I would tend to agree as well as long as they are being upfront; convenience does have a cost. I certainly would not buy something like this though.

[godslabrat]

By the book, I guess to get these CD based systems working, one of two things has to happen:

 

1. If the manufacturer provides the bios files, they are breaking the law.

2. If the manufacturer sells the device without those files, the user goes out and finds them, then the user is breaking the law unless they have the original hardware and have a means to extract the needed bios files (I bet many do not).

 

Option three is I guess a manufacturer writes compatible version of the bios files from ground zero (no different than these SOC boxes that runs carts), but my guess is that this is not very easy.

 

I didn't read the details of this newer endeavor as carefully. but I would tend to agree as well as long as they are being upfront; convenience does have a cost. I certainly would not buy something like this though.

What I do like about the Seedi, vs. other options, is that providing the code up front theoretically allows the user to substitute in their own preferred emulator, or slapping in support for a system that isn't supported out of the box. Whereas R-Blow is trying to lock down open source code (presumably... hey, prove me wrong, guys) Seedi at least pays lip-service to the concept of FOSS. Then it just becomes a matter of how strong the support community is and the durability of the hardware itself. I still don't LIKE the box, per se, but it has the virtue of not being ambitious beyond its means.

[TheTIGuy]

I have a felling this is going to go the way of very, very many similar projects.

Wake me up when you can buy it, there are good reviews, and user-taken photos.

I ain't sinkin' money I don't have (I am a teen with not many money options) into a ghost.

[Flojomojo]

What's your story, TIGuy? I don't know many 1980s-obsessed modern teenagers.

[PikoInteractive]

 

That Seedi dingus looks incredibly cheaply made with paper thin plastic, if it even exists in the real world (photorealistic renders are everywhere nowadays). Their use of Retrode as their "cartridge adapter" is unimpressive, because why would I buy from them when I can just get that on my own?

 

To top it all off, that workmanlike writeup on the comicbook.com site is by Robert Workman, he of the illustrious ReadRetro site, the online companion to Mike Kennedy's RETRO Magazine. He wrote most of the game reviews, viewable here via wayback machine. https://web.archive.org/web/20160412172546/http://readretro.com:80/

 

I wonder if Eli is going to bring that back? Right now, it says

 

 

 

Site will be back, but completely different. Although we'll use some of the old content for SEO purposes.

[godslabrat]

 

If I could err on the side of trust for just a minute, it's sounding like the Blox team realized that if they put the system into production the way they had originally planned, it would have been yet another emubox with a fancy case. The "rebranding" was apparently more than just a name change, it seems a huge chunk of the project was completely retooled. Otherwise, why are they only NOW hiring electrical engineers, and why are they taking so much time on a system that was supposed to be "crowdfunding ready" in April?

 

I still stand by the statement that the original public prototype wasn't a legitimate representation of the final product. It was only half a hair above the JagSNES.

[StopDrop&Retro]

I always get suspicious when a company that's been planning for crowdfunding decides out of the blue that they're now going to avoid that whole mess and instead accept "preorders" when the project is "finished."

 

Okay.

 

Congrats... ??? ... I guess??

 

Why do they need to announce that? If that's the case, wouldn't it be better to wait until it's ready and then make the big announcement that "we're not going to KS! It's on sale now!" to ride that wave instead of continuing with this drip feed of information?

 

I don't think they're sincere about turning away from crowdfunding, I think that move is purely it's strategic. They know that having crowdfunding in every press piece isn't working well for them. It's only adding to the suspicion that these guys don't know how to make this. So now that they've disavowed that, declared that all the emulation is their own in-house software and announced their shiny new office in Dallas of all fucking places, it's letting them rewrite the narrative. Now most news stories won't mention crowdfunding but they're under no obligation to keep to that promise.

 

Mark my words: they will go to crowdfunding

[Keatah]

Emulators take time to bake. I'd be leery of anything new and untested by time and thousands of users.

 

Kickstarters always project an aura of amateurism and cheapness.

 

Drip-feeding information can only work so long before potential buyers get frustrated. IMHO it's best to keep something under wraps unless you are making steady, proven, visible progress or are well into the beta testing or release candidate cycle.