Lythium "All In One" Retro Console - Development Post

[habbasi]

This is all very good and technical. What I, as a simple-minded consumer, would like is a system that would enable me to play my NES/SNES/GENESIS cartridges reliably. I do not want an emulator, I want to play the original carts. I do not mind new controllers, I am not dedicated to original hardware, but the option would be good. One system that could play all three of those systems would meet my needs perfectly.

 

Is Lythium the product for me?

 

(I would also really like to see a similar system that could play Atari 2600, ColecoVision, Intellivision, and maybe Atari 5200 games.)

 

Thanks

 

Hello. What our system does in a nutshell is read the game off the cart and play it on your PC with the included software.

 

You can also buy the Lythium Pro which acts exactly like a home console. You attach the cart to it via a suitable adapter and play off it like an actual console.

[enoofu]

Some Atari and maybe some Vectrex support would bring me in. It's a less ambitious project than Retroblox, but I have much more confidence that it will actually exist next year.

Retroblox seems to have a lot of project creep compared to this

[keepdreamin]

Hello. What our system does in a nutshell is read the game off the cart and play it on your PC with the included software.

 

You can also buy the Lythium Pro which acts exactly like a home console. You attach the cart to it via a suitable adapter and play off it like an actual console.

 

It's dumping the game and loading the rom file, correct? Not actively "reading" like in the sense of original hardware. What would I gain as a gamer from using your emulator software, vs any other emulators that have long standing development time?

[habbasi]

 

It's dumping the game and loading the rom file, correct? Not actively "reading" like in the sense of original hardware. What would I gain as a gamer from using your emulator software, vs any other emulators that have long standing development time?

While it is doing that, the dumping times are very fast, within a few seconds most of the time. The emulator software we will be using LibRetro, one of the already-established open-source emulation code-bases.

 

What we want to accomplish is making the experience as seamless as possible for anyone who owns carts for any of the supported systems.

[TPR]

Hello. What our system does in a nutshell is read the game off the cart and play it on your PC with the included software.

 

Ok, wait... what? If this is all it actually does, I'm sorry but color me not interested at all. For some reason, I thought this was an actual *game console* because your website and your original post says stuff like:

 

Lythium is a modular micro-console that supports instant playing and ROM/SRAM dumping of: NES, Famicom, SNES, GameBoy, GameBoy Color, GameBoy Advance, N64, Nintendo DS, Sega Master System, Sega Genesis/Mega Drive, Sega Game Gear & more!

 

Lythium is a stackable modular retro game console

 

Sorry, I just really thought this was like the Retron 5 where it dumps your roms to the system, but then you can play them on your TV. And yes, I did read this part:

 

is capable of dumping SRAM & ROM, and can instantly play cartridges through our Windows/Linux/macOS client.

 

But I just assumed that was a feature in addition to playing them like you would on a normal console. You know, like a feature that the system is capable of doing, but not the ONLY option for playing your games. So I totally misread and misunderstood your pitch. Let me make sure I understand exactly what this device does...

 

 

It dumps ROMs from systems like NES, SNES, Genesis, Master System, Nintendo Gameboy Handhelds and TurboGrafx and then allows you to play those ROMs on your desktop computer via an emulator.

 

 

Now that it's a bit clearer for me, I guess I have to ask the question...

 

 

Why would I need a device to dump ROMs that are already widely available all over the internet? Through emulator software (LibRetro) that is already widely available all over the internet?

 

 

Just to dump save game files? Is that the only unique feature to this device? While I get that might be a cool feature for some people, I do wonder how narrow of a margin of retrogamers that would be. It's not the 'killer feature' that would make me personally buy this, but maybe I'm in the minority?

 

The product doesn't sound like it solves any current problem or a need for the retro gaming community. Now that I understand what it is, I don't understand why we need it.

[habbasi]

 

Ok, wait... what? If this is all it actually does, I'm sorry but color me not interested at all. For some reason, I thought this was an actual *game console* because your website and your original post says stuff like:

 

 

 

Sorry, I just really thought this was like the Retron 5 where it dumps your roms to the system, but then you can play them on your TV. And yes, I did read this part:

 

 

But I just assumed that was a feature in addition to playing them like you would on a normal console. So I totally misread and misunderstood your pitch. Let me make sure I understand exactly what this device does...

 

 

It dumps ROMs from systems like NES, SNES, Genesis, Master System, Nintendo Gameboy Handhelds and TurboGrafx and then allows you to play those ROMs on your desktop computer via an emulator.

 

 

Now that it's a bit clearer for me, I guess I have to ask the question...

 

 

Why would I need a device to dump ROMs that are already widely available all over the internet?

 

 

Just to dump save game files? Is that the only unique feature to this device? While I get that might be a cool feature for some people, I do wonder how narrow of a margin of retrogamers that would be. It's not the 'killer feature' that would make me personally buy this, but maybe I'm in the minority?

 

The product doesn't sound like it solves any current problem or a need for the retro gaming community. Now that I understand what it is, I don't understand why we need it.

I'm sorry, I should have been more clear. Lythium Core allows you to do what I just said. Lythium Standalone allows you to put carts in and play on your TV, but with most emulation features like save states, varying emulation speed etc.

 

We're aiming for both markets here. Those that want to play on the PC and those that want to play it like consoles.

[keepdreamin]

While it is doing that, the dumping times are very fast, within a few seconds most of the time. The emulator software we will be using LibRetro, one of the already-established open-source emulation code-bases.

 

What we want to accomplish is making the experience as seamless as possible for anyone who owns carts for any of the supported systems.

 

Ok, let's say I own a bookcase full of carts. How would me getting up to grab a game, and walking them over one by one save me time? seamless is simply having a rom pack collection ready to load. I wouldn't be making trips around the house, and I would have one less device plugged into my computer.

 

I understand the save game transfer to a limited audience, but my understanding there are already products specifically available to handle this should I absolutely need one for a given console.

Edited February 12, 2017 by keepdreamin

[habbasi]

 

Ok, let's say I own a bookcase full of carts. How would me getting up to grab a game, and walking them over one by one save me time? seamless is simply having a rom pack collection ready to load. I wouldn't be making trips around the house, and I would have one less device plugged into my computer.

 

I understand the save game transfer to a limited audience, but my understanding there are already products specifically available to handle this should I absolutely need one for a given console.

While you are correct that there are other systems out there that do this, to our knowledge none are aiming for our price point, or supporting as many systems as we are.

 

We are also hoping to aim for the PC market with Lythium Core and the console market with Lythium Standalone.

[TPR]

I'm sorry, I should have been more clear. Lythium Core allows you to do what I just said. Lythium Standalone allows you to put carts in and play on your TV, but with most emulation features like save states, varying emulation speed etc.

 

We're aiming for both markets here. Those that want to play on the PC and those that want to play it like consoles.

 

Ok thanks for clearing that up. I re-read the original post again and while it's still a bit confusing, I understand it more now. If I can make a suggestion - why are you making so many different products? Is there a real demand for all three of them? I'm assuming you've done your research, but for example, that "core" thing you are doing, if it really doesn't meet any demand or solve a problem, why do it? Just to have a cheaper option? Personally, I would just stick with the products you feel there is the strongest need for and focus on that instead of spreading yourselves too thin with options or various systems that people may not care about. Unless you guys have some sort of metric that says there is a huge demand for a core system like that, then please ignore anything I just said.

[keepdreamin]

While you are correct that there are other systems out there that do this, to our knowledge none are aiming for our price point, or supporting as many systems as we are.

 

We are also hoping to aim for the PC market with Lythium Core and the console market with Lythium Standalone.

 

Ok, if you are aiming to make a fairly priced save game transfer device, and with that expectation in mind I don't see a problem. But if you're expecting PC folks to use it mainly as an active gaming peripheral for their PC, I can't see that happening.

[habbasi]

 

Ok thanks for clearing that up. I re-read the original post again and while it's still a bit confusing, I understand it more now. If I can make a suggestion - why are you making so many different products? Is there a real demand for all three of them? I'm assuming you've done your research, but for example, that "core" thing you are doing, if it really doesn't meet any demand or solve a problem, why do it? Just to have a cheaper option? Personally, I would just stick with the products you feel there is the strongest need for and focus on that instead of spreading yourselves too thin with options or various systems that people may not care about. Unless you guys have some sort of metric that says there is a huge demand for a core system like that, then please ignore anything I just said.

The Lythium Core will act as a ROM/SRAM dumper and flasher and we believe there is enough of a Homebrew market out there that could benefit from this.

 

Also, there will be an option in the included software to just insert your cart into Lythium core, and to hit Play and play the game right away. In other words we will be abstracting away the step of dumping the ROM and passing it onto the emulator, rather, the software will do emulation for you.

 

We also plan to make it possible to share your moments via social media.

Edited February 12, 2017 by habbasi

[Flojomojo]

I understand why they're is no Atari on there (I think) but isn't it weird to come into AtariAge with a product called the "All in One" That doesn't even have "one" Atari system on it?

Into a forum that has printed badges for the hater brigade. There are certainly friendlier places to workshop an idea!

[Tanooki]

As fiddly as it is with a kickstarter, the more that is shown here, even if it's all pretty much smoke and mock up so far, it does show some promise if it can be developed as described and isn't some chameleon in the end.

[habbasi]

As fiddly as it is with a kickstarter, the more that is shown here, even if it's all pretty much smoke and mock up so far, it does show some promise if it can be developed as described and isn't some chameleon in the end.

Thank you for the words of encouragement. We have already gone through a few hardware revisions and are now developing the firmware and software in tandem.

[keepdreamin]

The Lythium Core will act as a ROM/SRAM dumper and flasher and we believe there is enough of a Homebrew market out there that could benefit from this.

 

 

From a development or sales of software point of view? If development wise, I would think devs would want to try their software on actual hardware. Wouldn't a standard flash cart, or even a EPROM writer be a more useful tool in this regard? Unless you're saying your cart can also write to an EPROM once cleared with ultraviolet

[habbasi]

We don't earn anything from the software, it'll be FOSS (GPL3). The Lythium Core will be able to write to flash carts as well, which is how it'll support the homebrew community.

[keepdreamin]

We don't earn anything from the software, it'll be FOSS (GPL3). The Lythium Core will be able to write to flash carts as well, which is how it'll support the homebrew community.

 

 

I didn't mean you selling software, I meant homebrew devs selling games to customers who are planning to use the games in your device.

 

maybe I'm missing something here, but isn't all you need to "write" to a flash cart is a SD card reader? I know there are some ancient, pre SD card devices, but are folks still using those?

[dj_convoy]

Ick to Kickstarting something if you're this far along, but I understand to a degree. Yay to Wonderswan and NeoGeo Pocket compatibility. Older systems would be welcome, as well. Dunno about three hundred bucks for the standalone bundle.

[Lyth]

Morning guys, just woke up. Excuse the time difference on my end. We are aiming to support at least Atari 2600, and possibly other classic systems, however we need to secure a manufacturer of those cart slots. If any of you know of a manufacturer/supplier, or a place to get those, you can PM me. I'd love to add that support, as I am a fan of it. We'll try our best to add this functionality. Our Engineer confirms that this is possible, if we can secure a supplier for the slot. So we'll be on the lookout for that.

 

I appreciate the feedback so far! Thanks to you all.

 

 

 

I didn't mean you selling software, I meant homebrew devs selling games to customers who are planning to use the games in your device.

 

maybe I'm missing something here, but isn't all you need to "write" to a flash cart is a SD card reader? I know there are some ancient, pre SD card devices, but are folks still using those?

 

I've seen that in Asia, simple "flash carts", which don't have any SD technology, seem to be popular due to price. Which are pretty much a blank cart, for repro and some homebrew games. (The way we explain them in China is a "Single ROM flash cart")

 

Additionally, we want to give people an option to put their homebrew ROMs on a cart, by using this device. Imagine Lythium to have the feature of a cart writer, that people can use with the relatively cheap, non-flexible storage flash carts, that existed before the SD ones. (For example, those 256M GBA cards).

 

However, this is a subset of our main goal and features, which we hope to grow as well. We need to test out flash cartridges that exist on the market, to see compatibility. I want to make note, that we can and aim to produce blank/flash carts in the future, as our part of our team has experience doing this.

 

 

Ick to Kickstarting something if you're this far along, but I understand to a degree. Yay to Wonderswan and NeoGeo Pocket compatibility. Older systems would be welcome, as well. Dunno about three hundred bucks for the standalone bundle.

 

Thanks for the compatibility feedback! These prices on here are preliminary, and we're trying to get them down as much as we can. We'll be sure to keep you guys in the loop, on any developmental steps we make.

Edited February 13, 2017 by Lyth

[godslabrat]

Fwiw, I've heard that one reason clone hardware for te 2600 hasn't been done is that there is no source for 2600 cart connectors. You'd have to factor in fabricating those as well.

[Tanooki]

Best Electronics finally ran out of 2600 connectors? I remember back when the original Flashback 2 popped up people were farming the parts off them to hack their systems to play games. I kind of wish I had someone make me one back then as I didn't and still do not have the tools for that kind of job.

 

Now if this thing comes out and it can also handle a flash kit that's going to get it a lot of interest over the retrofreak, retron5, and even retroblox too. It will get the testing types on board, homebrewers, pirates, etc to buy from them first if real hardware isn't something they want or isn't an option.

[godslabrat]

if these things are USB-based, I wonder how hard it would be to make them cross-compatible with RetroFreak?

[Iwantgames:)]

I didn't mean you selling software, I meant homebrew devs selling games to customers who are planning to use the games in your device.

 

maybe I'm missing something here, but isn't all you need to "write" to a flash cart is a SD card reader? I know there are some ancient, pre SD card devices, but are folks still using those?

I actually just bought a non SD card flashcart 8 in 1 with burner/dumper for the Watara Supervision, he also has carts for vectrex, gamate, Lynx, videopac and 7800 so there are still some being made

[Lyth]

Best Electronics finally ran out of 2600 connectors? I remember back when the original Flashback 2 popped up people were farming the parts off them to hack their systems to play games. I kind of wish I had someone make me one back then as I didn't and still do not have the tools for that kind of job.

 

Now if this thing comes out and it can also handle a flash kit that's going to get it a lot of interest over the retrofreak, retron5, and even retroblox too. It will get the testing types on board, homebrewers, pirates, etc to buy from them first if real hardware isn't something they want or isn't an option.

 

Hi!

 

Lythium is compatible with Non-Removable Media Flash Carts, which are the same types of carts that dumpers can flash to. In a sense, like a blank, re-writeable cartridge, that can be written to by the device.

 

 

 

Ick to Kickstarting something if you're this far along, but I understand to a degree. Yay to Wonderswan and NeoGeo Pocket compatibility. Older systems would be welcome, as well. Dunno about three hundred bucks for the standalone bundle.

 

 

As fiddly as it is with a kickstarter, the more that is shown here, even if it's all pretty much smoke and mock up so far, it does show some promise if it can be developed as described and isn't some chameleon in the end.

 

Hi guys,

 

We realize that some products on crowdsourcing platforms such as Kickstarter, lack feasibility and sustainability, due to not having a prototype and shady business practices.

That observation, is why we waited until we were past the initial prototype stage, to start unavailing our product, and aim to be transparent as possible.

 

We are choosing Kickstarter for a source of funding, as it gives us a platform to pre-sell our products, to generate funds for the longevity and success of our business, while retaining creative control.

Edited February 13, 2017 by Lyth

[Andromeda Stardust]

So you're basically selling a Retron5 with built in Retrode device, basically a Retroblox without the CD drive and nonsense talk about digital stores and hybrid emulation?

 

Also as for 24-pin Atari cart connectors, don't some of the old floppy cables have them?