New Atari Console that Ataribox?

[Flojomojo]

They were so smart about it when they started. Start selling just books, cheap prices. Add on heavier S&H (back when S&H on line was a profitable factor) and make their money on the S&H not the product. Then slowly dominate the market and lower shipping prices to drive that domination. Pure brilliance.

 

Worked for Waldenbooks for 5 years in the early 90s. Amazon helped kill that company in many ways IMO. They are a retail beast these days.

Amazon was able to leverage its accounting system into industry-leading cloud storage and computing. Their retail business is innovative and neat, but Amazon Web Services (probably invisible to non-techie people) is their big moneymaker.

 

Gosh, Waldenbooks ... haven't thought about them in a long time. Ah the days when I'd go looking for books and games and music in the mall. So long ago!

[RugglesTx]

for strength.jpg

 

you have the chemical enhancements on your side, but even Guinness can't stop the ravages of time.

 

Oh man how true...

 

Use to hurt when squatting down.

 

Then started to hurt when standing back up.

 

Now it hurts to think about doing either !

 

Time is cruel..

[RugglesTx]

Amazon was able to leverage its accounting system into industry-leading cloud storage and computing. Their retail business is innovative and neat, but Amazon Web Services (probably invisible to non-techie people) is their big moneymaker.

 

Gosh, Waldenbooks ... haven't thought about them in a long time. Ah the days when I'd go looking for books and games and music in the mall. So long ago!

It was a good company. Was a Store manager for them and it was fun. Loved unpacking the boxes of books as they came in and seeing all the new ones. We were allowed to check books out and take them home so we could in turn recommend books to customers. That was a nice perk for a cash starved young book lover.

[BiffsGamingVideos]

It was a good company. Was a Store manager for them and it was fun. Loved unpacking the boxes of books as they came in and seeing all the new ones. We were allowed to check books out and take them home so we could in turn recommend books to customers. That was a nice perk for a cash starved young book lover.

 

There have been big book stores come and go (Books a million, Waldenbooks) but there are still small stores that are happy making a couple hundred bucks a day after expenses. The same for Atari I think. They are not going to sell millions of VCSii systems but if they can sell 50,000 a year and turn a small profit, then maybe that's good. If you go big then you have to spend big.

 

It's like Star Wars Solo. It made like 371 million dollars and Disney probably lost money. However some smaller indie movie made 20 million and turned a 5 million dollar profit. Not worth it for Disney but sure worth it for those who made 5 million. This is also why Tron 3 is not being made.

[thetick1]

Amazon was able to leverage its accounting system into industry-leading cloud storage and computing. Their retail business is innovative and neat, but Amazon Web Services (probably invisible to non-techie people) is their big moneymaker.

 

Gosh, Waldenbooks ... haven't thought about them in a long time. Ah the days when I'd go looking for books and games and music in the mall. So long ago!

 

Amazon makes far more revenue with retail but the profit with Web Services is so much higher:

 

Are You Buying Amazon Stock for the Right Reasons?

The most visible Amazon business may not be the reason for you to pay $1,750 for a share.

https://www.fool.com/investing/2018/07/01/are-you-buying-amazon-stock-for-the-right-reasons.aspx

Edited July 6, 2018 by thetick1

[Matt_B]

 

There have been big book stores come and go (Books a million, Waldenbooks) but there are still small stores that are happy making a couple hundred bucks a day after expenses. The same for Atari I think. They are not going to sell millions of VCSii systems but if they can sell 50,000 a year and turn a small profit, then maybe that's good. If you go big then you have to spend big.

 

It's like Star Wars Solo. It made like 371 million dollars and Disney probably lost money. However some smaller indie movie made 20 million and turned a 5 million dollar profit. Not worth it for Disney but sure worth it for those who made 5 million. This is also why Tron 3 is not being made.

 

The problem for Atari, if that indeed is their plan, is that the margins on games consoles are pretty much negative, even when the volumes being sold are in the tens of millions. Nintendo might make a small profit because they're really good at making world class games with weaker hardware, but Sony and Microsoft are pretty much selling at a loss most of the time.

 

The way to make big money from games consoles is in licensing the software, but Atari can't realistically do that if they're only selling 50,000 units a year. Let's face it, who is going to even port games to it, let alone make exclusives if the most they can sell is a few tens of thousand of copies? Even a good indie game can cost upwards of a million to make these days, so those sales just aren't going to cut it. While it might potentially be the case that you could put Steam on it and get some games that way, that's not going to help Atari's business case much.

[Pink]

This is a good video worth watching. He originally started out doing videos on defunct retailers with "The decline of, What happened with..." Like Blockbuster Video, Kmart, Radio Shack, Circuit City, etc. but hes been doing different company videos recently. I suggested to him in the comments to do a video on Atari, that'd be cool to see.

 

Edited July 6, 2018 by Pink

[godslabrat]

So …. you have no source. Got it.

 

You MAY be correct in your assessment or you MAY be wrong. The thing is we don't know. That's my point. You are just guessing.

 

and yes the people running Atari have managed to mess up pretty much everything over the last year. I agree. and I don't see them fixing it anytime soon but I do think the system comes out sometime in 2019.

Read Nathan's post regarding Atari's financial health and strategy in their own words. They flat out say they don't have a lot of money and don't want to spend what they do have. We DO know. If you don't know, it's because you don't want to know.

[Pink]

 

So …. you have no source. Got it.

 

You MAY be correct in your assessment or you MAY be wrong. The thing is we don't know. That's my point. You are just guessing.

 

and yes the people running Atari have managed to mess up pretty much everything over the last year. I agree. and I don't see them fixing it anytime soon but I do think the system comes out sometime in 2019.

Did you read a single thing Nathan Strum or myself posted???

 

We're not "guessing" It's all in Atari's Financial statements that are publicly available.

Edited July 6, 2018 by Pink

[x=usr(1536)]

 

Thank you.

 

I was thinking that 3 million must have been a lot of money 10 years ago. Inflation isn't that bad, right?

 

Allow me to put three million dollars in perspective.

 

I used to live in a middle-class neighbourhood in Los Angeles. It wasn't Beverly Hills, Malibu, Santa Monica, or any of the other glitzy (a description of Santa Monica that I say doesn't apply, but, hey, Baywatch) parts of town that get shown on TV, but it was a decent place to live.

 

The average cost of a roughly 1200-to-1400 sq. ft. home on that street was $600,000. All that Atari SA's fundraiser has really done is to buy five houses in a part of the San Fernando Valley that's not total dogshit to live in.

 

And yes, I get that property prices are heavily-dependent on location - where we are now, $200,000 will get you a house around twice that size on a larger piece of land. The point is that their Indiegogo campaign has raised less money than a realtor in L.A. is likely to see in a week, and people need to stop being dazzled by OMG THREE MILLION BUX and realise that $3M is just chicken feed when it comes to building and delivering hardware.

[Pink]

Been bored and doing some Googling. I recall earlier in this thread someone brought this up (Or maybe it was the Chameleon thread, it's been sooooo long I can't remember)

 

Dormitus (Formerly RiverWest, the company that owns the rights to the Coleco name) claims AT&T has abandoned the Cingular name and thinks they have the right to use it. Question remains, what exactly are they going to do with it? Crowdfund to launch their own cell phone carrier??? Bwahahahahahahaha

 

https://www.courthousenews.com/firm-says-att-is-clinging-to-cingular-mark/

 

They got a website too says "Something new and exciting is coming" And links to Zazzle with a bunch of clothing with the Cingular logo on it.

 

http://www.cingularwireless.net

 

I have to say, they are absolutely insane. AT&T is no small company.... They think they're going to stand up to them in court and beat them? Although it'd be amazing to see AT&T's lawyers put that POS company Dormitus out of business for good.

 

"For example, the plaintiff’s principal has successfully re-established brands of yesteryear such as Brim®, Coleco®/Colecovision®, Cross Colours®, Salon Selectives®, Nuprin®, Ipana®, Rival®, Clearly Canadian®, Not All Snacks Are Created Eagle®,” the company says."

 

Complete and total horse sh**

 

Some other fly-by night company thinks they got the rights or that they can legally use the Nextel name (The phone carrier that merged with Sprint once upon a time)
http://retrobrands.net/our-brands/

https://www.nextelworldwide.com

 

https://www.rrmediagroup.com/Features/FeaturesDetails/FID/850

https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/news/2018/04/16/sprint-files-trademark-suit-against-nextel.html

https://www.kansascity.com/news/business/technology/article199405354.html

 

This is hilarious (and it pisses me off royally) that these arrogant twats are blatantly stealing old brand names while crying foul over various fanmade Facebook groups and websites about the Colecovision and homebrew developers and try to claim they've been victimized.

Edited July 6, 2018 by Pink

[godslabrat]

Been bored and doing some Googling. I recall earlier in this thread someone brought this up (Or maybe it was the Chameleon thread, it's been sooooo long I can't remember)

 

Dormitus (Formerly RiverWest, the company that owns the rights to the Coleco name) claims AT&T has abandoned the Cingular name and thinks they have the right to use it. Question remains, what exactly are they going to do with it? Crowdfund to launch their own cell phone carrier??? Bwahahahahahahaha

 

https://www.courthousenews.com/firm-says-att-is-clinging-to-cingular-mark/

 

They got a website too says "Something new and exciting is coming" And links to Zazzle with a bunch of clothing with the Cingular logo on it.

 

http://www.cingularwireless.net

 

I have to say, they are absolutely insane. AT&T is no small company.... They think they're going to stand up to them in court and beat them? Although it'd be amazing to see that POS company Dormitus to be put out of business for good.

 

"For example, the plaintiff’s principal has successfully re-established brands of yesteryear such as Brim®, Coleco®/Colecovision®, Cross Colours®, Salon Selectives®, Nuprin®, Ipana®, Rival®, Clearly Canadian®, Not All Snacks Are Created Eagle®,” the company says."

 

Complete and total horse sh**

Man, I was just thinking "I really miss the role that Nuprin had in my life."

[pacman000]

'About the only name recognition Atari has is "That ancient game console" Or "Those old games that my dad likes"'

I'm willing to put Atari in the same category as RCA & Polaroid; the name's lost most of its meaning, but is still recognizable enough to be worth something.

 

"The way to make big money from games consoles is in licensing the software, but Atari can't realistically do that if they're only selling 50,000 units a year. Let's face it, who is going to even port games to it, let alone make exclusives if the most they can sell is a few tens of thousand of copies? Even a good indie game can cost upwards of a million to make these days, so those sales just aren't going to cut it."

What!? 2600 games were made by one programmer in 6 months with no tools! With four people Atari could have more than a half dozen titles available by 1995...um...2019.

 

"Dormitus (Formerly RiverWest, the company that owns the rights to the Coleco name) claims AT&T has abandoned the Cingular name and thinks they have the right to use it."

Now that irritates me. I miss the little Cingular guy, & I don't want those folks to have him!

[Pink]

"Dormitus (Formerly RiverWest, the company that owns the rights to the Coleco name) claims AT&T has abandoned the Cingular name and thinks they have the right to use it."

Now that irritates me. I miss the little Cingular guy, & I don't want those folks to have him!

The part that really irritates me

 

 

 

A Chicago man claimed the Cingular cellular brand in 2104 (suppose to be 2014 I assume) on the grounds that AT&T had abandoned it after a 2007 purchase of BellSouth Corp. Mark Thomann, through Dormitus Brands, already sells prepaid calling cards under the Cingular name, though AT&T hasn’t given up the fight.

Already selling products using the Cingular name even though you have no right to do so.

 

“Sprint, I’m sure, is going to fight me on this,” Kaplan said. “I hope they don’t have any interest.”

 

Turns out, Sprint still cares about Nextel.

“We are aware of the situation and plan to respond,” spokeswoman Lisa Belot said in an email. “While it is no longer one of our primary brands, we maintain ownership, sell handsets under the Nextel brand and currently have no plans to sell it.”

Kaplan, advised of the response, said he’d do more research. He also said Sprint will have to show more than “token use” to reserve the Nextel trademark.

Their battle will play out at the U.S. Trademark Trial and Appeal Board, which is part of the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office. It’s where Kaplan staked his claim to Nextel on Jan. 29and included an example of how he’s using the brand already.

Kaplan didn’t wait for a ruling.

He licensed the Nextel brand to another Florida business that has begun offering familiar push-to-talk features on rugged wireless devices aimed at construction crews and others who remember the old Nextel’s services.

He just helped himself to the Nextel brand and started "licensing it out"

 

Are you kidding me?

 

What's next, are they going to start "claiming" the rights to old banks that merged with other banks? I'm sure Wells Fargo won't mind if you "claim" the Wachovia or Norwest Banks name, or Chase won't mind if you "claim" the Washington Mutual name because they "abandoned" them. I hope I didn't give them any ideas. Though if they attempted that, they'd get their asses sued big time so maybe it's a good thing if I do give them ideas.

Edited July 6, 2018 by Pink

[MrBeefy]

Brand names are powerful.

 

Around SE Texas its

 

You want a Coke?

 

Yes

 

What kind?

 

A Dr Pepper, Pepsi etc..

 

Soda or Pop are not even used by most.

 

Band Aide...QTip etc..

 

Atari has that and lost it. Not getting it back. Its Xbox or PlayStation now that own that right...

I mention the whole coke thing in a different thread. Had a dumb ex who was from Texas who did that. Its a soda, or pop, or soda pop. If you want a Dr.P it isnt a coke...

[Pink]

 

 

 

 

>~>~>~>~>~>BACK ON TOPIC NOW!<~<~<~<~<~<

 

Edited July 6, 2018 by Pink

[Rane]

That UDOO Bolt thing looks sick for the specs/price. If Atari really hasn't finalized the hardware at all and are targeting around the same price point they should probably literally steal that thing's specs and focus their manufacturing efforts on manufacturing the case well enough that they can sell at 299 USD or whatever with some decent profit margins.

[youxia]

That UDOO Bolt thing looks sick for the specs/price.

 

Does it really? Those are Early Bird prices, with no RAM or PSU. Start adding and all of a sudden you're over 350$, more if you want to do stuff they shout about, like AAA games or VR. For that money...well. The other thing is, I'm a great fan of modern micro-computing but today is the first time I 've ever heard of them - and apparently they've been around 5 years now. I looked on ebay and there were four () UDOO thingies for sale. They didn't exactly set that market on fire, then.

I'm not bashing them, indeed at least they make and release real stuff - just putting things into perspective a bit.

 

Meanwhile the bare VCS costs 200 bucks. The truth is, if they actually managed to deliver it in a few months time, working flawlessly within the IGG specs, refocused as a dedicated emu box+a mini PC, with solid UI/frontend, truly open environment, great support/updates, even greater community, perhaps a few decent indie exclusives then...hell, I still wouldn't buy it myself but it wouldn't be such a wishy washy and pointless catch-all concept as it is now. It could even succeed, of course never on a Sony et al scale, but in a niche, moderate way.

 

For that to happen the parent company would have to consist of people with actual vision, expertise and dedication in this field - not a bunch of clueless 3rd tier suits, who scrape a living from licensing old IPs to just about anybody, no matter how ridiculous their plans for said IPs are.

[Rane]

Re: RAM and PSU. Don't they already have only 4GB anyway? Add on a shitty chinese housefire PSU because you have a low TDP anyway and the fact they could manufacture the board themselves and I don't see why they couldn't do it for $300.

 

Meanwhile the bare VCS costs 200 bucks.

Wasn't it going to be $300?

Edited July 6, 2018 by Rane

[Matt_B]

The problem with using an APU for gaming is that - with CPU and GPU sharing the same bus - it's bottlenecked by the memory, so you really need the fastest dual channel RAM you can get. Sony and Microsoft both recognized this and went with custom solutions for their current generation consoles; the former uses GDDR5 RAM, where the latter has a substantial cache of ESRAM.

 

If Atari are just going to stick the cheapest 4GB single-channel chips they can get their hands on, there's going to be an even bigger gulf in performance than people might have been expecting.

[The Historian]

atari-today.jpg

Is it okay to feel bad about "Community Management" being a thing they list? I feel like they currently don't understand what that means...

[x=usr(1536)]

Is it okay to feel bad about "Community Management" being a thing they list? I feel like they currently don't understand what that means...

 

It's a typo. The prefix 'mis-' should have been added to that second word.

[x=usr(1536)]

This is hilarious (and it pisses me off royally) that these arrogant twats are blatantly stealing old brand names while crying foul over various fanmade Facebook groups and websites about the Colecovision and homebrew developers and try to claim they've been victimized.

 

This reminds me of a situation that cropped up some 20-odd years ago in the UK involving the use of the MG cars logo. I don't remember where in MG's ownership history this occurred, but believe it was some time after the selloff of Austin-Rover though prior to the current Chinese ownership of MG.

 

Basically, despite no cars or parts being produced under the MG name by the then-owners of the name, they decided to go after the MG Drivers' Club (which had been around for half a century at that time) over their use of the MG logo on their newsletter. This went to court, and it was ultimately ruled that the MG Drivers' Club was engaging in fair use of the logo, but it was an extremely expensive legal battle for the club to fight and nearly killed it.

 

Our most recent parallel is Atari SA going after the people they seem to think are making "gobs of money" from selling Jaguar-themed T-shirts and the like. If the folks doing this really were making gobs of money, why isn't Atari SA selling T-shirts to fund their console instead of running high-risk crowdfunding campaigns?

 

The short-sightedness of these 'brand custodians' never ceases to amaze me - they'll do anything they can to (from their perspective) protect the brand at all costs without realising the damage they're doing to it from the perspective of people for whom that brand may still hold some interest.

 

I wonder how they'd react if we started going the full Idiocracy route and started legally changing our names to things like 'Colecovision PS2 Astrocade' or similar.

[Rane]

If Atari are just going to stick the cheapest 4GB single-channel chips they can get their hands on, there's going to be an even bigger gulf in performance than people might have been expecting.

 

Thankfully there's going to be no games on the system so it won't have a possibility to perform poorly.

[youxia]

@ Rane I recall there was a 199$ VCS offered in the initial campaign. Now of course it's 239$. Surprise, surprise Anyway, please remember that all I said about it in my previous post was strictly an "Alternate Reality: The Console" what-if hypothetical kinda exercise.

 

The UDOO version which is used for their AAA benchmarks (720p lo-med) costs 480$. The basic one with RAM =300$.

 

Sure it's better than the nonexistent VCS, but my hypothetical scenario was about an emu box anyway. For that, the VCS specs would be enough, unless somebody really needs to go down a high end PS2-era emulation route. But for that you will be always better off with a dedicated proper mini PC anyway (unless UDOO prices drop).

 

I think a better comparison would be Arcade Dreamplay (or Dreamcade Replay, whatever). Their specs are Apollo Lake 2.4Ghz, with 4GB RAM & 32GB SSD. HDMI, VGA. for 130$. That is, a preorder for one, they also have yet to deliver. I'm pretty sure it could handle anything 2D just fine.