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Keatah

Seedi - yet another emulation box, perhaps good enough?

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You're right! That's guy's video is gone! It was from SegaLordX. Here's the link:

 

Oh THANKS I could not for the life of me remember the name! I can tell you I DID watch the video and pretty much his assessment was that it was PERFECT in every way, everything he tested was flawless and it was shown in a very favorable light. Maybe the video and his disappearance is coincidental but still....MAYBE IT IS THE SEEDI CURSE lol :lol:

Edited by OldSchoolRetroGamer
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Well, this took a turn for the worse. You might even say its seddi.

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Metal Jesus video was fair pointing out the flaws and things not working too well.

 

 

This is why I love this site... unlike YouTube or twitter, AA has adults who don't just immediately assume I'm endorsing something because I did a video on it... even though in the video I say I'm not endorsing it. I feel my video was fair and balanced and thanks for saying so.

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This is why I love this site... unlike YouTube or twitter, AA has adults who don't just immediately assume I'm endorsing something because I did a video on it... even though in the video I say I'm not endorsing it. I feel my video was fair and balanced and thanks for saying so.

Yes! AA is AWESOME! (I Rarely use that... err.... is it even a word?)

P.S. Not all of us are adults, for your information.

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Seedi console BS? WHO SEEN THAT COMING? You know a funny thing? IMHO Metal Jesus video was fair pointing out the flaws and things not working too well. ALSO a couple weeks ago there was another youtuber, I do not recall the name, typically a Sega fan apparently had a prototype and he had a long video that pretty much showed it as being flawless, perfect and he was acting totally supportive, I am guessing he was in on it or getting some type of kickback because I went looking for the same video a couple days ago to post on atariage and I am positive the video has Totally disappeared, I think in my history I found the link and the video was "NO LONGER AVAILABLE" lol, BIG SURPRISE, it is a external CD hooked up to a Orange Pi, WHY ARE PEOPLE STILL FALLING FOR THIS CRAP????????

 

 

This guy, like almost all youtube people, over accentuates and yells too much. Decent info but horrible video presentation. He's quintessentially what I don't like about youtube and the gaming culture right now. But I digress.

 

On this topic of the Seedi I'm disappointed that this is turning out to be a farce. But let me say this, I have no problem paying someone for a system that legitimately does play 90's CD based games and DOS games. I don't have the technical ability to build my own machine nor do I have the time. There is such a huge market for 90's gaming that we need something like this in an attractive package. I don't want a notebook nor do I want some half-assed Raspberry Pi concoction that I'd have to slap together with chewing gum and duct tape. With a ton of modern TVs not able to even use the HD Retrovision cables (like all 3 of mine) some retro systems are pretty much emulation only if you don't want or have space for a clunky CRT.

 

Someone needs to legitimately come up with something that isn't a scam or whatnot for the community.

Edited by jce3000gt
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I built a RasPi emulator box that was nearly exactly like this.

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Going by the comments we're supposed to trust something who is going through some serious medical mental problems. I'd rather wait and see the fall out from sane individuals than some yelling conspiracy theory rant.

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^ lol! You got the guys mixed up.

 

While I would agree the guy in the "EXPOSED" video is probably off his rocker, the reviewer who is supposedly having the mental issues is the SegaLordX guy, who's video was deleted.

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People don't seem to like these little ready-made things, because they're kickstarters and indigogos, or because there's always something shady going on. Potential to take your money. Potential to turn into crap. That's fine.

 

People don't like a laptop full of emulators, no matter how sophisticated or capable such a thing may be. It's too PC'ish. Especially in the post-PC era of today. Ok too.

 

People don't like building up an emulator box from scratch - too much configuring they say. Got it.

 

But, original hardware is becoming less plentiful as time goes on. Oh sure there's thousands of systems on ebay, but again, as time goes on, what you buy is going to need more and more work or preventative maintenance. What's one to do?

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People don't like building up an emulator box from scratch - too much configuring they say. Got it.

TOO MUCH CONFIG? WHAT THE HECK? IT TAKES LIKE 1 HOUR TO PUT TOGETHER AND 3 HOURS TO INSTALL SOFTWARE!

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What I don't understand are the people who say things like, "this is too technical and I don't have time for that" but apparently have all the time in the world to play twenty- and thirty-year-old video games. I just don't grasp the concept of someone limiting themselves in that way, being unwilling or unable to expand their horizons.

 

It's not that hard, and it doesn't take long to tweak something and make it reallly good and fun. Keatah, you said something a while back that sticks with me (and sticks in my craw), something about taking all day for a week to shine up an emulator to make it extra kickass. While I agree that one can spend unlimited time and money on these things, the quick-n-dirty approach gets it done, too.

 

As someone who is both quick and dirty, I heartily endorse that plan of action.

 

I'm starting to think of the retro game Kickstarters as being no bettter than the bottom feeders who buy up Nintendo Mini consoles to scalp on eBay. They add nothing to anyone's experience and jam up the works.

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In the end I think it's about people's perceptions. I dislike RPi emulation for being too PCish (then I just use a PC) but I'm happy with FPGA boxes that only require you to drop some files on an SD card (for me boot time and ease of backup/resetup is important).

 

That is still considered too technical by some (judging by comments in some threads) and that's fine. Only the Retro Freak is really straightforward but open enough to allow expansion if you're willing to dig a bit. Too bad they don't upgrade it anymore.

Edited by Newsdee
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What I don't understand are the people who say things like, "this is too technical and I don't have time for that" but apparently have all the time in the world to play twenty- and thirty-year-old video games. I just don't grasp the concept of someone limiting themselves in that way, being unwilling or unable to expand their horizons.

 

It's not that hard, and it doesn't take long to tweak something and make it reallly good and fun. Keatah, you said something a while back that sticks with me (and sticks in my craw), something about taking all day for a week to shine up an emulator to make it extra kickass. While I agree that one can spend unlimited time and money on these things, the quick-n-dirty approach gets it done, too.

 

As someone who is both quick and dirty, I heartily endorse that plan of action.

 

I'm starting to think of the retro game Kickstarters as being no bettter than the bottom feeders who buy up Nintendo Mini consoles to scalp on eBay. They add nothing to anyone's experience and jam up the works.

Alternate view:

I might like watching movies, but I don't want to spend a lot of time messing with settings on my VCR. I could, but I just want to watch movies.

 

It's the same with video games. Playing games is fun. Configuring a system is work. Even if I have the skills to set up a system, I just want to play games. If someone offered a system that was already ready to go I might be willing to get it if the price was right. It's not laziness or lack-of-skill; it's just an investment, and a preconfigured system may offer a better return for my time and money. Not saying I'd never set up my own system, but the incentive would have to be different. (e.g. If I found the prospect of setting something up akin to building a model, or if I thought I could do a better job than what was available commercially, etc.)

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What irks me about the Raspberry Pi is the boot time and having to shut the OS down before turning the machine off. It only serves to remind me that this is a miniature PC running Linux and not a dedicated gaming machine. Some people don't mind it, some people do.

 

But it's not all bad, in my opinion. A Raspberry Pi is a computer just like a classic gaming console from a couple of decades ago, only with more bells and whistles. Setting up an R-Pi to deliver a good emulated gaming experience simply means that the knowledgeable tech people need to stop seeing Linux distributions as the default solution for an R-Pi OS, and devise custom operating systems that boot fast (without annoying boot text that mean nothing to most people), don't require a shut down prior to turning the machine off, and are crafted to run a specific emulator (or an array of emulators).

 

Of course, this means that the emulator(s) must be compiled for the custom OS, so the OS and the emulators must be offered together as a "software package", with respect to the hardware connected to the R-Pi. But once this hurdle is passed, offering R-Pi solutions that are practically plug-and-play (via a quick and easy installation) becomes possible.

 

All this to say that developing custom R-Pi operating systems is a field of hobby computer programming that needs to develop, in my humble opinion.

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What irks me about the Raspberry Pi is the boot time and having to shut the OS down before turning the machine off. It only serves to remind me that this is a miniature PC running Linux and not a dedicated gaming machine. Some people don't mind it, some people do.

 

But it's not all bad, in my opinion. A Raspberry Pi is a computer just like a classic gaming console from a couple of decades ago, only with more bells and whistles. Setting up an R-Pi to deliver a good emulated gaming experience simply means that the knowledgeable tech people need to stop seeing Linux distributions as the default solution for an R-Pi OS, and devise custom operating systems that boot fast (without annoying boot text that mean nothing to most people), don't require a shut down prior to turning the machine off, and are crafted to run a specific emulator (or an array of emulators).

 

Of course, this means that the emulator(s) must be compiled for the custom OS, so the OS and the emulators must be offered together as a "software package", with respect to the hardware connected to the R-Pi. But once this hurdle is passed, offering R-Pi solutions that are practically plug-and-play (via a quick and easy installation) becomes possible.

 

All this to say that developing custom R-Pi operating systems is a field of hobby computer programming that needs to develop, in my humble opinion.

This. A low-level boot-right-into-the-emulator solution is the next step. Granted, it would be several generations before it worked well enough to displace RetroPie, but if these DIY boxes are the future, it seems worth doing.

 

As for the "shutting down" feature, isn't there some way of configuring it to power down if there's been no input for 60+ minutes? That could be a decent workaround. Personally, I kind of like knowing my hardware will turn itself off if I get distracted and don't do it manually.

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TOO MUCH CONFIG? WHAT THE HECK? IT TAKES LIKE 1 HOUR TO PUT TOGETHER AND 3 HOURS TO INSTALL SOFTWARE!

 

Yup. That can be too much for some people. Waaay too much. Why? They could be senior, and just want to play a handful of certain games they remember. They could be businessmen and layers and hi-powered executives that are busy with a million other things. 4 hours of time can be worth thousands of dollars to them. Others are not simply technically inclined and have no ability to do anything beyond inserting an SD card.

 

I've met people that don't know how download anything, let alone find where its destination location is. Some people are totally raised on smartphones and have zero concept of a filesystem.

 

 

What I don't understand are the people who say things like, "this is too technical and I don't have time for that" but apparently have all the time in the world to play twenty- and thirty-year-old video games. I just don't grasp the concept of someone limiting themselves in that way, being unwilling or unable to expand their horizons.

 

It's not that hard, and it doesn't take long to tweak something and make it reallly good and fun. Keatah, you said something a while back that sticks with me (and sticks in my craw), something about taking all day for a week to shine up an emulator to make it extra kickass. While I agree that one can spend unlimited time and money on these things, the quick-n-dirty approach gets it done, too.

 

As someone who is both quick and dirty, I heartily endorse that plan of action.

 

Thing with quick and dirty is that the folks doing it naturally do away with all the fluff and stuff. And that is fine. They also understand what they are doing. They know the parts, the software, how it generally comes together. Some people I talk to don't even know what an emulator is! Let alone a filetype or directory hierarchy, or any other technical point.

 

As experts in doing this stuff we can dismiss a hundred things instantly and know what is important or not. Mr. Q&D has experience and working + conceptual knowledge of how it all comes together. Some people are simply not interested in how tech works.

 

A lot of folks doing it the quick and dirty way truly want to play the games and not be involved with anything more than plugging in an SD card. That is fine.

 

When I'm commissioned to build an emulator rig for someone, if you want, I'll sit down with you and school you in the inner workings. Workshop style. We'll discuss the types of games you want to play, the controller arrangements, the display, the sound, how much space is it going to take up, breakdown of parts. You'll learn where the important stuff and configuration files are located. You'll go through it and set up some of the emulators yourself so that you'll know how it all comes together. You'll be on-hand just prior to closing it up so you can see how parts are wired. Or you can spend time in my workshop building it intern/apprentice style. You'll get a set of complete documentation and technical files for the parts and software used. All this after having specified your controllers and keyboards and other items related to ergonomics, aesthetics, and more. It can be a big production. If you want it turnkey, that's fine too.

 

It's something I do for friends and acquaintances only.

 

Other times I've been asked if my soldering station could be borrowed. What for? Oh I'm wiring up this set of controllers for my games computer. Ohh yeah? What kind? It's going to play all the old arcade stuff! Ohh cool. Here.

 

And then days later they haul in this huge ass 65" into the garage/mancave and are playing games on it. So I drift over and check it out and they got this shitbox Pi thing going thinking it’s best thing in the world.

 

So all kinds stuff! And I believe the hobbyist has the advantage here, as they do in most endeavors like so.

 

 

This. A low-level boot-right-into-the-emulator solution is the next step. Granted, it would be several generations before it worked well enough to displace RetroPie, but if these DIY boxes are the future, it seems worth doing.

 

I've thought about that point for the past 2 decades. The closest we come (when using windows) is to strip it down, remove non-essentials and stuff like that.

Edited by Keatah

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This. A low-level boot-right-into-the-emulator solution is the next step. Granted, it would be several generations before it worked well enough to displace RetroPie, but if these DIY boxes are the future, it seems worth doing.

 

Problem is it would be geared toward only a few specific pieces of hardware.

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I came across the Metal Jesus video by happen stance this morning and came away impressed. This thing is pretty cool and the price isn't bad at all. If it significantly decreases load times then I would probably get one.

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I somewhat regret my initial skepticism. Seedi has its fair share of hurdles, but it seems to be on the level. I don't think I'll personally get one unless the supported systems list grows a lot, but it's refreshingly honest for a crowdfunded clone system.

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I have mixed feelings on Seedi.

On one hand it's a pretty cool device that simplifies the playing of CD-based titles at a pretty affordable price.

 

On the other hand, I have a PC just for emulation (which has a disc drive) and a modded PS1 that can play burned games...

 

I can't really comment on the software ordeal at this time. The best version would be to not go against the creators wishes... But I mean people are going to anyways?

 

And the final thought on this is that every single machine like this is going in one of two directions:

 

1. Emulation box with the same software as always with off the shelf parts. - These are more likely to work but feel lame cause it's something you could build yourself but... Convenience.

 

2. Emulation box with custom hardware and custom software. - These feel like a pipe dream at best. The only one with any hope is the Zimba 3000 (Kevtris's system), but that seems like a far off thing at most. Anybody else doing this doesn't really appear qualified and can only tell us the "grand idea" with no real delivery.

 

I'll consider the Seedi but will probably end up passing cause I don't really need it.

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A subtle lesser-known advantage of Software Emulation is that it generalizes the hardware or abstracts it. There are many ways and many kinds of base hardware on which you can play a game of VCS Missile Command. There are several emulators that run on 500,000 different combinations of hardware. That's a good thing.

 

SE is everywhere and becoming more prevalent as time goes on. SE is becoming more and more teamwork oriented. Complexity and accuracy is increasing and it only makes sense to have multiple developers share the workload. I also believe it easier for beginning devs to get involved in an existing SE project that's been underway for years. They might begin by fixing user interface issues or some other elementary problem - and thus relieving workload from a senior guy working on a core issue.

 

A custom emulation box with custom hardware like fpga is really limited by several factors. One of them is that the uniqueness (of the hard/soft combo) is so far out there no one really supports it except the single developer that made the box. Both the hardware and software is almost beyond niche and nowhere near the critical mass or the market penetration of off-the-shelf generic Linux-Windows-Arm-Intel stuff - which has mountains of support and loads of replacement/upgrade hardware at dirt cheap prices.

 

If I wanted to make a change to my emulation environment I can readily do things with the hardware, new processor, new memory, different video processor, new mobo, new storage.. Things like that. And I could submit new code and recompile the emulator myself. Or maybe the standard config files or in-emulator options will allow me to do what I want. None of that is really practical on custom fpga rigs.

 

So while these boxes of software emus are boring as beige, they do the job well and everyone can enjoy them at modest cost.

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I watched both MetalJesus's video, as well as SmashJT's (Fair Warning: I've known JT since we were kids, he has been this intense about things like this long before YouTube existed). Both videos bring up some interesting points.

 

The way I see it: It's just another emulation box. The gimmick this time? It has a built-in CD-ROM unit. All they do is offer it up to the consumer with everything configured. Everything but the roms, of course. At that point, you are almost to the point of building a Retropie, a cheap HTPC, a modded Wii or Xbox, or even downloading emulators and a frontend on a laptop. There are already multiple ways to do this better for less money.

 

Watching the Seedi struggle with some of the games also doesn't instill any confidence in the product. It boasts compatibility with all sorts of stuff, but I would figure a lot of people would buy it for Turbo CD/PCE CD and NeoGeo CD games, since those consoles are pricey. It didn't do a good job with either one of them. That's not great, and the only reason I'd buy one is now out the window.

 

Also, there's the whole "reselling RetroArch" thing, which basically runs the whole console. If these guys were developing their own proprietary OS, or even licensing RetroArch, then this wouldn't be so shady. Not to mention the crowdfunding stuff...

 

If you are going to emulate old game consoles and computers, you should be prepared to have to configure things to make them work. That comes with the territory of emulation, and for some, that's part of the FUN of emulation! Honestly, up until the Flashback consoles and the Nintendo Classics, that's how it was. It's not original hardware, so you can't expect it to behave 100% like original hardware. Getting it close is part of the fun. Then again, I'm nuts, so you may not want to take my word for it. :lol:

 

Final Verdict (for me): As of right now, there are better ways to do this. A more powerful, less "Seedi" version of this would be cool.

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Dinging it over game performance now seems an unfair argument to make since there's like what 2 prototypes and it's still sort of early-middle of life into development. They even stated in the video that the performance hasn't been finished or optimized so they have problems. I'm no seedi backer, but I get grumbly and annoyed anytime someone tries to show something off early to let people know, warn them it's not finished so things are beta, and then people call them out over stuff not working right. Well duh, you got told that much. Let them get their OS/firmware/drivers whatever it is finished, then slap them silly if it still struggles.

 

My only real gripe with them is not working out something so everything just works out of the box, even if it means reverse engineering the firmware and doing it yourself. 20 years ago a frenchman did it for PCE, then PCE CD and PCE Express and Arcade card drivers for PCE/TG16 under the named of Magic Engine. It's doable, been doable for decades now.

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