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2 hours ago, Sprybug said:

BTW, should I be adding you to the beta tester message group?

Yes, please add me to the beta tester message group! Thanks!

 

- James

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20 minutes ago, ZeroPage Homebrew said:

Yes, please add me to the beta tester message group! Thanks!

 

- James

Will do.  You know what I just noticed?  Ice and Sky Zone have the same screenshot. XD

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13 minutes ago, Sprybug said:

Will do.  You know what I just noticed?  Ice and Sky Zone have the same screenshot. XD

Good eye! Too many screencaps... hahah.  I've fixed it up now and even put a better Sky Zone picture. Thanks!

 

- James

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Scandalous lies! I was home all morning eagerly awaiting my RetroTINK 5X-Pro delivery. There was no knock/doorbell AND no note left on the door telling me they "attempted" to deliver.

 

Guess I'll be picking it up at the post office tomorrow afternoon...

 

- James

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FRIDAY AUGUST 20 @ 12PM PT / 3PM ET

EXCLUSIVE FIRST LOOK AT rubyQ!

 

20210819-rubyQ.thumb.jpg.0dc039036d6b8dc6c763e6cf0cc08f2f.jpg

 

Join us LIVE Friday Aug 20 on the ZeroPage Homebrew Twitch livestream
 
We have an EXCLUSIVE new look at the almost completed rubyQ for the Atari 2600 from @Silvio Mogno on Friday's ZPH! This incredibly polished port for the VCS not only brings home all the action of this favourite 1982 arcade classic, he takes it way further with alternate gameplay modes and all new enemies and challenges!
 
Silvio has really knocked it out of the park with this all new 2600 port of Q*Bert so you don't want to miss this!
 
Game: rubyQ (Exclusive WIP Update) (LIVE @ 12PM PT | 3PM ET | 7PM GMT)
 
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18 hours ago, ZeroPage Homebrew said:

Scandalous lies! I was home all morning eagerly awaiting my RetroTINK 5X-Pro delivery. There was no knock/doorbell AND no note left on the door telling me they "attempted" to deliver.

Yeah, but an "attempted delivery" in Canada means they just stand outside your door politely for a half an hour, because they don't want to be intrusive. ;) 

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FRIDAY AUGUST 27, 2021 @ 6PM PT / 9PM ET

EXCLUSIVE PREMIERE OF NFT GAME: ETHEREUM 2600

PLUS 3x 7800 POC PREMIERES!

 

1712329042_20210827-LetsPlay.thumb.jpg.72c4ec0918095a67c51743d7149272d0.jpg

 

Join us LIVE Friday Aug 27 on the ZeroPage Homebrew Twitch livestream
 
Tomorrow we have an EXCLUSIVE playthrough of the newly completed game Ethereum 2600 from @RevEng (Serpentine & T:ME Salvo)! This Atari 2600 game may be the very first game ever sold via an NFT*! We also have an EXCLUSIVE look at not one, not two, but THREE NEW PROOF OF CONCEPT games from Darryl Guenther, the mastermind behind the incredible 7800 port of Popeye! We'll be checking out three classic arcade ports of Mr. Do!, Pengo and Kick-Man!! Which ones is YOUR favourite, which one should he work on first?  We'll also be checking out the massive update on Ninjish Guy Perilous Island, now with 60 screens and THREE bosses! You DON'T want to miss this stream!!!
 
Games:
 
* There's plenty of in game items that have been sold via NFT but no full games that I could find.
 
 
686334796_20210827-Ethereum2600(firstNFT).thumb.jpg.6f53d99fcba76031a9f62d3af3521da9.jpg   1784755792_20210827-Mr.DoPengoKick-Man7800.thumb.jpg.c058c66c4394ac5470090e5369b93f4d.jpg
 
(SET TO 1080P60 FOR FULL QUALITY)
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Had to look up Ethereum to see what it was all about, looks interesting. The whole NFT thing is kind of odd, was looking for a purchase link to see how much and had to take a step back.

Sent from my SM-G996U using Tapatalk

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Yep, completely agreed - the thing is, it can be resold while maintaining rights to the keep rom, burn a cart, etc. so it's not the actual cost. It's a bit of an odd proposition, but I'm sure we'll get into the economics during the show, the difference between it and NFT rocks, etc. Should be an interesting discussion.

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Tried to follow the NFT stuff in the show. All I got is, that a NFT is a convenient way to create virtual and artificial rarity for non-rare stuff. 

 

Maybe I am too stupid to understand, but my summary is: "Let's milk collectors.". Please correct me, where I missed the point.

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1 hour ago, Thomas Jentzsch said:

Tried to follow the NFT stuff in the show. All I got is, that a NFT is a convenient way to create virtual and artificial rarity for non-rare stuff. 

 

Maybe I am too stupid to understand, but my summary is: "Let's milk collectors.". Please correct me, where I missed the point.

 

As I see it, it provides an effective certificate of authenticity, exclusivity, and ownership that is indisputable and permanent.

 

 

 

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9 hours ago, Thomas Jentzsch said:

Tried to follow the NFT stuff in the show. All I got is, that a NFT is a convenient way to create virtual and artificial rarity for non-rare stuff. 

 

Maybe I am too stupid to understand, but my summary is: "Let's milk collectors.". Please correct me, where I missed the point.

Answer for NFTs in general: there's wide number of use cases beyond "this is a one-of a kind digital work (which anybody can copy+paste)". As Andrew said, NFTs are proof of some kind of ownership (a buyer should know what that specific ownership is, because it will differ from NFT to NFT) and have on-blockchain contracts built into them that can do interesting things. Unfortunately big buck "tulip mania" NFT sales have overtaken the news.

 

Answer for my game NFT in particular: the buyer doesn't lose rights to using/selling the rom (and cart) after they sell the NFT on the open market - in fact, if there are future updates, they will have access to them long after they've sold the NFT. I don't think that's milking collectors.

 

It does expose the game distribution to a perfect market, however, which has interesting features. People may speculate on the demand for the NFT. The price may go up for a desirable game, the price will likely go down for one that's not desirable. In the traditional distribution method, speculators will buy up limited runs of certain games, and sell them on ebay. My distribution method discourages that behaviour, and even sends a small portion of that speculation market back to the author.

 

I have little doubt many people will still conclude I'm trying to milk gamers, collectors, and their mother-in-law, with my NFT. I can only say that my motive isn't participating in tulip mania here - if I wanted that I would have just allowed access to the rom when you hold the NFT. I'm positive that the future distribution of works from small artists will someday look like something like my experiment, and I wanted to participate in one of the first baby steps toward that, but honestly I'm probably a decade too early here for an number of reasons. I'm not expecting any AA buyer participation, and don't encourage it either - I strongly recommend that people should stay away from any crypto propositions they don't understand. (the exact same recommendation should go for any fiat currency propositions, too.)

 

I was hesitant about creating an AA thread about the project (legit wasn't looking to encourage any AA buying participation) but if you or anyone else wants to go into more depth, or has more questions, I can go ahead and do that. Let me know.

 

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It's in my long-term plans to make an offering on NFT. I just haven't had a "product" that I can sell yet. I'm a bit disappointed not to be "first" but at least I guess I won't cop the flack from making the choice. I like the idea of embedding royalty payments; one of the things that bothers me is seeing something I've sold for (say) $75 -- and for which I actually take-home something under $10 -- being upsold by someone else for $1400 and I see absolutely zero of that profit.  A good summary of the current state of royalties on NFT: https://www.nft-innovation.com/post/how-do-nft-royalties-work. It seems that the royalty implementation is not yet mature, but in principle I very much support the concept of NFTs providing some continuing royalty payment to original artists. For example, we don't seem to shirk at musicians and songwriters being paid for their creative works - so why not game developers, too?

 

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First, I have a general, major antipathy against making money by speculation. And NFTs as they are used here are mainly speculation objects, IMO. 

43 minutes ago, RevEng said:

I have little doubt many people will still conclude I'm trying to milk gamers, collectors, and their mother-in-law, with my NFT. I can only say that my motive isn't participating in tulip mania here...

Then why are you selling it for more than $300? To me that comes over as a pretty greedy price.

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11 minutes ago, Andrew Davie said:

For example, we don't seem to shirk at musicians and songwriters being paid for their creative works - so why not game developers, too?

Because I don't think money will improve our hobby in any way. Money shouldn't be the motivation.

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34 minutes ago, Thomas Jentzsch said:

First, I have a general, major antipathy against making money by speculation. And NFTs as they are used here are mainly speculation objects, IMO. 

Then why are you selling it for more than $300? To me that comes over as a pretty greedy price.

1) If I sell it for $30, there is little motivation for a buyer to resell it vs sitting on it (either for speculation or they can't be bothered) which means no game distribution. There's one NFT.

2) If there's market liquidity, it's not $300 you're spending in the traditional sense. You recoup some-of (or more-than that) upon resale. (again, assuming market liquidity)

 

 

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4 hours ago, Thomas Jentzsch said:

Because I don't think money will improve our hobby in any way. Money shouldn't be the motivation.

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree here. I support efforts like TailChao's Rikki&Vikki game being sold via emulation on Steam. In the end it wasn't a path to profitability, but if it did work out, we would have gotten more amazing games for classic platforms like Rikki&Vikki. I'm trying to explore a similar (but different) model.

 

Legitimate question - do you feel all music and art should be free too, without any monetary motivation?

 

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37 minutes ago, Andrew Davie said:

It's in my long-term plans to make an offering on NFT. I just haven't had a "product" that I can sell yet. I'm a bit disappointed not to be "first" but at least I guess I won't cop the flack from making the choice.

Yeah, I like the "first", but the likely outcome is you'll have a model of what not to do, when you're ready. :P

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21 minutes ago, RevEng said:

Legitimate question - do you feel all music and art be free too, without any monetary motivation?

No, if you are a professional, making a living from it, then of course you have to be paid. But in that case, money changes the game (the more money the more it changes), because you lose part of your freedom. As soon as you are looking into money, you automatically more or less follow potential customers demands, instead solely expressing you own ideas.

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7 minutes ago, Thomas Jentzsch said:

No, if you are a professional, making a living from it, then of course you have to be paid. But in that case, money changes the game (the more money the more it changes), because you lose part of your freedom. As soon as you are looking into money, you automatically more or less follow potential customers demands, instead solely expressing you own ideas.

So why can't homebrew developers have a go at turning professional, too? (or "indy", if you prefer) If music and gaming in general can support different classes of participant, there's nothing stopping us.

 

At some point none of those musicians or artists were professional, and they moved up the gradient from "hobby" to "professional". Currently we have things like Patreon and Steam to support the gradient ascent. I'm trying to cut out those middle-men.

 

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29 minutes ago, RevEng said:

1) If I sell it for $30, there is little motivation to resell it, vs sitting on it and speculating, which means no distribution.

Sorry, I cannot follow you here. Why is speculating with your game something good? Shouldn't the 1st, 2nd and 3rd motivation of our hobby be enjoying the games we create? 

29 minutes ago, RevEng said:

2) If there's market liquidity, it's not $300 you're spending in the traditional sense. You recoup some-of (or more-than that) upon resale. (again, assuming liquidity)

Still you are making major profit from something which is usually worth about a 1/10th of it. For me that's milking the market liquidity, which is formed by collectors.

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10 minutes ago, Thomas Jentzsch said:

Sorry, I cannot follow you here. Why is speculating with your game something good? Shouldn't the 1st, 2nd and 3rd motivation of our hobby be enjoying the games we create? 

Still you are making major profit from something which is usually worth about a 1/10th of it. For me that's milking the market liquidity, which is formed by collectors.

It's a good thing because it means people won't be motivated to turn out games that aren't desired. The market will speak, and punish them. It's a good thing because it might support a different class of classic game dev.

 

Believe it or not, $300 isn't "major profit", and that's one-time. For one, the NFT cost $120 to mint. For another, selling this sort of NFT is a promise to keep the thing the NFT represents (as opposed to the NFT itself, which is on blockchain) available as long as a viable market exists. So I'll have domain and hosting costs for the foreseeable future.

 

I take it you never accepted more than $30 in royaltees from Al?

 

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Just now, RevEng said:

So why can't homebrew developers have a go at turning professional, too? (or "indy", if you prefer)

You are completely free to go where you like. But IMO you are starting to separate yourself from people who are doing this as a hobby. And especially from people who want this to stay a hobby with minimal financial interests. For reasons given above.

Just now, RevEng said:

At some point none of those musicians or artists were professional, and they moved up the gradient from "hobby" to "professional". Currently we have things like Patreon and Steam to support the gradient ascent. I'm trying to cut out those middle-men.

I don't think that gradient ascent approach works well. As soon as there is financial interest, as soon there is compromise of artistic freedom. And it only gets worse the more money is involved.

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