What was the last "REAL" game console?

[PFG 9000]

I was recently having a discussion with some friends and associates at work about game consoles. During the discussion the recent xbox one and PS4 were being put forth as the "best" game consoles but I threw in that neither was really a game console. I felt that pretty much every console since the original xbox has been a pc in disguise. I would have to say the GBA or N64. Anyone else like to throw in their opinion?

You're arguing with people who think the Xbox One and PS4 are the best game consoles. Why bother?

 

On point, it seems obvious to me that consoles have always been computers, regardless of whether they have internet connectivity or mouse support or keyboard peripherals or shitty DLC practices. As I understand it, the current gen was intended to be more focused on gaming and less on being a media center like the last gen. Doesn't that invalidate your argument to some degree?

[DJ Clae]

I was recently having a discussion with some friends and associates at work about game consoles. During the discussion the recent xbox one and PS4 were being put forth as the "best" game consoles but I threw in that neither was really a game console. I felt that pretty much every console since the original xbox has been a pc in disguise. I would have to say the GBA or N64. Anyone else like to throw in their opinion?

Don't bring your retrogaming opinions to work. I work in IT myself. Nothing good can come from it.

[Eltigro]

Coworker and I were talking retro today... Castlevania, Galaga, Mortal Kombat (thanks to the RetroCore vid), and others...

[+thanatos]

Don't bring your retrogaming opinions to work. I work in IT myself. Nothing good can come from it.

 

I don't have that issue, I'm the only real retro-gamer in my IT department. The other guys just like hearing about the old stuff and were mostly just casual players back in the day. And once in awhile I'll bring in yet another system they've never heard of.

[DJ Clae]

Sure, my coworkers are the same. But your argument in this thread is too extreme for a mainstream audience.

[+wongojack]

I understand the point of the thread. It recognizes that game consoles have changed over the years and perhaps to someone who was transported here suddenly from 1990, consoles today would appear to be very different. However, they still meet the same needs for the consumer. They are a lower cost method of gaining easy access to a software library that principally plays games. I know where you are coming from comparing XOne and PS4 to a PC, but the comparisons end quickly once you really start breaking down the details. For example, the process of buying one of those devices compared to a PC is pretty different in terms of price and feature comparison. Buying software for it is also quite different.

[SuperDork3000]

IMO, a "real game console" is a console that plays media that doesn't require any internet connection or patching/updating of any game or console. With that said, PS2 was the last real game console.

[Tanooki]

IMO, a "real game console" is a console that plays media that doesn't require any internet connection or patching/updating of any game or console. With that said, PS2 was the last real game console.

PS2 though had an online (minimal) network and also a hard drive for a select few offerings, plus it was sold as a DVD player first in Japan as it was starkly cheaper than the off the shelf DVD players then. Gamecube came out after, has no hard drive, no network, and games worked on the disc or else as there was no storage other than save memory cards. That's why I made that argument on the last page. That generation though was both the start of the end (MS as their Pentium3 incognito PC and network) PS2 was riding the edge with movies and HDD,

[Bill Loguidice]

PS2 though had an online (minimal) network and also a hard drive for a select few offerings, plus it was sold as a DVD player first in Japan as it was starkly cheaper than the off the shelf DVD players then. Gamecube came out after, has no hard drive, no network, and games worked on the disc or else as there was no storage other than save memory cards. That's why I made that argument on the last page. That generation though was both the start of the end (MS as their Pentium3 incognito PC and network) PS2 was riding the edge with movies and HDD,

 

GameCube could also go online, albeit only with Phantasy Star Online as far as I know. Anyway, online capabilities, media, etc., are all just arbitrary distinctions. Forms of online connectivity, downloadable games, expansion to computer capabilities, alternative media, etc., all date back to the Atari 2600 days. I mean, I get the point of the original poster, but there's really no argument here. A console is a console, be it a Fairchild VES or an Xbox One X.

[SignGuy81]

I wasn't complaining about newer tech. I think I was actually changing the question to "Pure" instead of "Real"... Everything since the Gamecube has been some form of multimedia hub... I have friends on Xbox Live who, every time I see them on, they're just watching Netflix. At that point, is it really a game system or a Netflix box that can play games?

 

Well, if the game system didn't have it then instead you wouldn't see them online as they would instead get on a Roku or something instead if they want to watch something. Why does it matter if the game console has streaming services built in. If back in the day there was a combination VHS player/Super Nintendo the VHS part might get used more than the actual playing games by some. Some people although they like video games like movies/shows more and may have used the PS2 to watch movies more often that gaming. I am on youtube more on my Xbox probably than playing video games. There are some games that I really get into and one week or two you might see it show that I'm playing whatever game all the time in the evenings. But once it is beat the rest of the time it is either Sling or youtube until another game comes out that I really want(which could be months).

Edited March 29, 2018 by SignGuy81

[Tanooki]

Yeah sure the lame XBX is a console, it's a dedicated console in the terms of a multimedia device that you can use on your TV that focuses on games. But he said REAL and given the context of the site here, REAL would be better perhaps replaced with DEDICATED console, or CLOSED console. A system that uses just the one intended forum of interaction, physical games made for it, nothing more, no videos, no browsers, no email, no internet, no hard drives for beta release as retail fixes, the digital rental market, and the rest.

 

The thing is, it's not a date thing. Look at the Famicom. Family COMPUTER. Keyboard, disc drive, main 'console', and then there was its dialup capabilities into a Nintendo early network for a closed environment maybe in a way an earlier form of how the early era of closed net/pre-net services like compuserve had or BBS's. The SNES/SFC lacked this, but then the N64 came back around to it with the disc drive and other junk it did. Sega got into the racket on Genesis with their Sega Channel using internet services for game streaming, an early taste of gamefly before it went to the netflix style. It's kind of tricky to nail it down, because like you pointed out with the Cube there was the one off of PSO with the online play, and then you can add more with that Warp Pipe hack job a crew did to get Mario Kart and others into that realm.

[SignGuy81]

Well, I would say the Sony PlayStation but it is also a CD player.

[my80chevette]

WOW! Quite the response...... I realize that the game consoles are computer based but a computer is not always a pc or a game console. My primary irritation with more modern systems is the similarities to pc gaming. Updates to fix system errors, or updates for game issues, or my favorite..... hangs or crashes. So my criteria for a "Real" game system would most likely be... Turn on, game starts, play game, turn off (really turns off, doesn't go to sleep). Keep in mind that this is just my opinion and in no way demands that anyone else believe the same

[derFunkenstein]

The PS3 and Xbox 360 went beyond games in a real, tangible way. The Xbox (with dongle and remote) and PS2 could do DVD playback but nowadays systems are all-in-one beasts that do all kinds of media.

 

That doesn't make the current generation "not" consoles. Generally speaking if you never plug into the Internet you can get minimum firmware updates from disc and games can be played without an internet connection from physical media. But you're losing out on a lot of the value.

Edited March 29, 2018 by derFunkenstein

[+Atari_Warlord]

I guess I don't care enough to argue on subjects like this, but did have a couple things to think about. Even our beloved 2600 was marketed as a Video Computer System. It also had a system designed to download games long before the internet was available to commercial enterprises (look up where America Online came from).

[Bill Loguidice]

I get that this is not most people's points on here, but I'm curious what's wrong with having features beyond gaming in these boxes hooked up to our nice TVs and sound systems? If they're already there and already have the power, then why not let it do other things? (and of course, other things of our choosing - very few features or apps are forced on us) I can't think of very many powerful devices purposely limited to single functions. And these consoles obviously need all that extra power to play the kinds of games modern gamers demand. So again, why not put it to use for other things? It's literally already there next to our TVs and we're unlikely to play games 100% of the time.

[Tanooki]

I'm not so certain doing more stuff is really the problem, but the negatives of a swiss army knife setup is the problem. Great it plays disc or streaming movies. Not great, hard drive is used to release incomplete or buggy games, same with the firmware too. Some people would rather just plug it in and have it work like an old system or those jakks/radica TV games devices. No bs, just turn it on, play game, and have it actually really turn off when done. The other baggage would be like people drama, and people don't always like more drama.

[Bill Loguidice]

Some people would rather just plug it in and have it work like an old system or those jakks/radica TV games devices. No bs, just turn it on, play game, and have it actually really turn off when done. The other baggage would be like people drama, and people don't always like more drama.

 

Sure, but it's been over 20 years since we've had a console like that (Nintendo 64). That's a long time since things have changed. Expectations and demands are far higher than they used to be. That kind of plug and play, instant on, game-only concept is best left to the retro stuff.

 

Again, the power is there, the expectations are there, so it would be rather silly to purposely not meet them. And it's not like the current setups don't have their benefits over the old way of doing things. I know I'm pretty much all-in on digital, which makes it trivial to switch games on the fly without getting off the sofa. That's progress to me.

[zzip]

I'm not so certain doing more stuff is really the problem, but the negatives of a swiss army knife setup is the problem. Great it plays disc or streaming movies. Not great, hard drive is used to release incomplete or buggy games, same with the firmware too. Some people would rather just plug it in and have it work like an old system or those jakks/radica TV games devices. No bs, just turn it on, play game, and have it actually really turn off when done. The other baggage would be like people drama, and people don't always like more drama.

You mean the good old days like:

 

1) plug in the cartridge

2) turn on console

3) Doesn't work? Turn off, blow in the cartridge, repeat step 1 until it works?

 

I don't need to revisit those days. I'll take my modern console with digital library anyday.

[DJ Clae]

You've got some dirty carts and slots if it takes you more than two tries to get a game working. Can't believe you're even mentioning the issue in this discussion.

[Bill Loguidice]

You've got some dirty carts and slots if it takes you more than two tries to get a game working. Can't believe you're even mentioning the issue in this discussion.

 

It's something of a valid point. Not everything in the past was better or perfect. Picture quality could be hit or miss, controllers weren't always the best, there was sometimes no way to save your place and/or there were codes you had to write down, etc. There are plenty of ways to do pluses/minuses with both vintage stuff and modern stuff.

[Tanooki]

Look I'm not saying he's right or wrong I'm poking a stick at what I think he meant by a real console, a real dedicated games that just work and play console.

 

I think if there's anymore expectation now it's a mix of the modern entitlement complex of people coupled with years of systems going swiss army knife and having permanent storage internally that allows people to be more complacent and accepting of the problems that exist now. There's no good reason a game can not be properly finished and bug free enough to sell like years ago, some people still do it now so it's not totally unreasonable. I know there are factors that go into this garbage going on in many cases, including bean counters, and going over on time/budget for stuff, but it is what it is.

 

And I know the power is there, kind of like ATGames with their systems, but they close them off to play too. They could do far more while still emphasizing the Genesis or whichever in the realm but they don't. Movie capture, screen capture, other modern elements you could send back to an open space using simple bluetooth, wifi, or existing SD card options.

 

The problem with current digital library stuff is that outside of GoG, and even that's a middle ground, you don't own or control a damn thing. It's just borrowing time until it is decided you have had enough. Good luck coming back to a digital only game in 10 or 20 years unless you've repurchased it for yet another fee if you're lucky down the line, or someone hacks the system and you can load whatever later.

[Bill Loguidice]

The problem with current digital library stuff is that outside of GoG, and even that's a middle ground, you don't own or control a damn thing. It's just borrowing time until it is decided you have had enough. Good luck coming back to a digital only game in 10 or 20 years unless you've repurchased it for yet another fee if you're lucky down the line, or someone hacks the system and you can load whatever later.

 

Not to go too far down this rabbit hole, but digital ownership being temporary is only a problem for some of the past generations of players who grew up with the concept of physical ownership. Most of the current generation of players has no such concept so there's no issue whatsoever for them with digital possibly being temporary. And frankly, I agree with the current generation of players. I really don't need to physically own every last thing I use. Been there, done that, and I can tell from personal experience it can get real messy. I'd much rather have clutter-free digital ownership for as long as that lasts. It's all just entertainment after all and I think I can live with the possibility of being without access to a small handful of games, particularly since new and interesting games are released on a daily basis.

[zzip]

You've got some dirty carts and slots if it takes you more than two tries to get a game working. Can't believe you're even mentioning the issue in this discussion.

Every one of my NES-owning friends went through this often and it usually took them more than two tries to get it working.

[+GoldenWheels]

Last "REAL" game console as far as I know.....but who knows maybe Panasonic gets back in the game!