JustinMSalvato Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 I can't seem to find a workable Tapper (Budweiser) ROM for MAME. Granted, I am completely new to Mame. Use other emulators before, but not this. Went to mamedev.org, downloaded their 32 bit version for my Vista machine, got that working, but the Tapper ROMS keeps saying I am missing files. Anyone know what is going on? Or know of a Tapper Rom that works? I am trying to avoid Roms for Atari 2600, Atari 800. etc.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 one of the things to keep in mind about mame is its numbers and romsets so if you have 0.181 mame and roms from I dunno 0.156 they may not match up and give you an error (which is quite the pain in the butt at times with random single roms) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+wongojack Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 You are just breaking the seal on MAME. Get ready, its not like other emulators. Basically, the romsets change just like Os said. You need a matching set to your version of MAME. What I would do is go to pleasuredome.uk and download the latest MAME romset (warning it's big) then get the corresponding version of MAME and never update MAME ever again. Another solution is to still do the first step and download the latest romset, but then run a utility like CLRMAMEPro that will "fix" the roms you have in another directory by ensuring they match up to whatever version of MAME you are using. A good forum for answers is Build Your Own Arcade Controls. They spend all their time on this stuff. I believe there is even a spinoff version of MAME out there somewhere that behaves much more like a "normal" emulator and doesn't require you to know the difference between complete and split sets (or whatever they are calling them now). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 I tested mame 195 with an old 153 rom set. Tapper works fine. If you have an extremely old rom it would likely be a problem. And there is a small chance something changed in mame 196. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 (edited) I have advance mame 106 with a 106 romset and it works fine mame is more of an archive project less of a point n squirt emulator so it gets pretty picky from a "I just want to play tapper dammit!" cause of its nature ... its always been that way so yea download a romset or choose one that is pretty common and stick with it. There is not a lot of difference tween old versions and newer versions other than the romsets get bigger as more slight variations of games are found, and better emulation accuracy (which is in line with the goal of mame) which of course means more demanding of computer resources btw tapper is in my top 5 list, I love that game Edited April 14, 2018 by Osgeld 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMaddog Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 Just get the merged roms, they have everything you need in a single zip including the support roms images. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinMSalvato Posted April 14, 2018 Author Share Posted April 14, 2018 You are just breaking the seal on MAME. Get ready, its not like other emulators. Basically, the romsets change just like Os said. You need a matching set to your version of MAME. What I would do is go to pleasuredome.uk and download the latest MAME romset (warning it's big) then get the corresponding version of MAME and never update MAME ever again. Another solution is to still do the first step and download the latest romset, but then run a utility like CLRMAMEPro that will "fix" the roms you have in another directory by ensuring they match up to whatever version of MAME you are using. A good forum for answers is Build Your Own Arcade Controls. They spend all their time on this stuff. I believe there is even a spinoff version of MAME out there somewhere that behaves much more like a "normal" emulator and doesn't require you to know the difference between complete and split sets (or whatever they are calling them now). "You are just breaking the seal on MAME. Get ready, its not like other emulators." Yeah, that's what I'm sensing Much of what I'm reading seems like a foreign language, but I am picking up what you and Osgeld are putting down. I will try my best to take everyone's advice. Thank you. I appreciate the help, cause up until now, I was completely lost. Now, I have a direction. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 (edited) I downloaded and tested mame 196 as well as the tapper and midssio roms on emuparadise. Those roms seem incomplete or different for whatever reason. The old tapper.7z and midssio.7z files I have from a 153 set work fine in mame 196. Merged or split sets should both work fine. Edited April 14, 2018 by mr_me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 Looks like tapper rom files changed at either version 192, 193, or 194. The rom files on most download sites have the old files (not sure about the 193 set at archive.org). Clrmamepro can do the rom file update, no additional rom files needed. In both cases mame needs the additional rom file midssio.zip, which hasn't changed. Might take a bit of time before the updated rom files make it to the common download sites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClassicGMR Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 I saw this thread and I suddenly wanted to play Tapper!! Apparently RetroPie (using lr-mame-2003 and 0.78) won't run them properly. I found that I can run it under MAME4ALL and using the 0.37b romset. On my PC I loaded up MAME UI64 v0.189 with the 0.181 romset and it ran fine for me. Just my experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebor Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 I can't seem to find a workable Tapper (Budweiser) ROM for MAME. Granted, I am completely new to Mame. Use other emulators before, but not this. Went to mamedev.org, downloaded their 32 bit version for my Vista machine, got that working, but the Tapper ROMS keeps saying I am missing files. Anyone know what is going on? Or know of a Tapper Rom that works? I am trying to avoid Roms for Atari 2600, Atari 800. etc.. Looks like some kind soul has provided the following: Workable Tapper (Budweiser) ROM for MAME The above was tested with MAME 0.196 and works perfectly. Just click on "tapper.zip", as highlighted above, on the page from the aforementioned link, to download the file and then place it (as is) in the roms subfolder without unzipping it. Looks like tapper rom files changed at either version 192, 193, or 194. The rom files on most download sites have the old files (not sure about the 193 set at archive.org). Clrmamepro can do the rom file update, no additional rom files needed. In both cases mame needs the additional rom file midssio.zip, which hasn't changed. Might take a bit of time before the updated rom files make it to the common download sites. Check the CRC's. If you have an older complete tapper ROM set, look for a file named "5784". The CRC between it and what is contained in the midssio.zip archive, file named "82s123.12d", match (E1281EE9). CRC match supersedes filename match; a complete (older) tapper ROM set only works fine. The tapper.zip ROM file alone (without midssio.zip), with the "5784" file, having a CRC of E1281EE9, is evidently leveraged by the kind soul in the above link. Some may ask/question, "So why the hubbub, Bub?"... The filename/CRC in question is for the Midway SSIO Sound Board. The Midway SSIO Sound board is found in (15) MCR games: Demolition Derby Discs of Tron Journey Kick/Kickman Kozmik Krooz'r NFL Sarge Satan's Hollow Solar Fox Spy Hunter Tapper Timber Tron Two Tigers Wacko Instead of repeating/storing the same ROM in 15 different ROM sets, evolving and better organized documentation, centralizes the ROM into its own set that is shared among the 15 sets as default by MAME. However, obviously MAME can still run each game when the sound board ROM is stored in each individual game ROM set, if it is the preferred method of the user. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 (edited) The midssio.zip file is available at emuparadise, so that's not an issue. Some rom sharing sites include it's contents inside tapper.zip. Edited April 15, 2018 by mr_me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebor Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 The midssio.zip file is available at emuparadise, so that's not an issue. Some rom sharing sites include it's contents inside tapper.zip. 100% agree. No issue seen here, just explained that older complete 'tapper' sets with the sound board ROM file stored under a different file name within the game ROM set, would not need the midssio.zip file necessarily, as long as the CRC matches. Grabbing the midssio.zip file regardless, can be helpful. Especially, if the user is interested in any of the other MCR games. The kind soul's provision of the one file download was likely coincidental and simplified in nature for the sake and ease of playing the subject game only. I know it is not the case with you, but some take issue with the ROM set changes over the course of time, and some details were provided as to why this particular game/set was changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 (edited) The pre v0.193 tapper.zip file found on rom download sites have 12 of the 18 files not matching crc to what current mame uses. Both the older and newer tapper.zip have 18 files (not including middssio). Somehow clrmamepro can update them. Also for some reason my 0.153 tapper.zip has all 30 files and works with both pre v0.193 mame and current mame which I thought was strange. Why did these 12 files change? edit: It looks like they changed their minds about which tapper roms should be the parent and which should be the derivative (eg. tappera.zip). This explains why my 0.153 set works with all versions since it is a merged set. Files haven't been changed they've been reorganized. If you download both tapper.zip and tappera.zip from emuparadise and merge them together into tapper.zip than it works in current mame 196. You might also need midssio.zip, also available at emuparadise. Edited April 15, 2018 by mr_me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 (edited) Some may ask/question, "So why the hubbub, Bub?"... cause its a dumb pain in the butt, based on some arbitrary committee decision to directly effect 15 games after 21 years of not being a problem. Edited April 15, 2018 by Osgeld 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 I noticed that the naming went from Tapper Set 1 (tapper) and Tapper Set 2 (tappera), to Tapper 1/84 (tapper) and Tapper 12/83 (tappera). At the same time the roms were reversed. Maybe someone simply screwed up and reversed them by mistake, I would think the earlier dated roms would be primary. There is also now a third set Tapper date unknown (tapperb) that wasn't listed before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebor Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 ...Maybe someone simply screwed up and reversed them by mistake, I would think the earlier dated roms would be primary.... In general (but certainly there are exceptions), newer dated roms are made primary as they often contain bug fixes/updates lacking in the older versions. See Joust and the pterodactyl bug for example. ...based on some arbitrary committee decision... Aw, come on...The spoiler wasn't even looked at for details. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 Okay then, the recent changes with Tapper was to correct an old error and make the more up to date roms the primary set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinMSalvato Posted April 15, 2018 Author Share Posted April 15, 2018 This turned out to be more interesting than I thought it would be. I want to thank mr_me for helping me out. Thanks again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osgeld Posted April 15, 2018 Share Posted April 15, 2018 it is an interesting and complex project, which makes for a interesting complex time figuring it out at first, but once everything lines up its hard to go without 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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