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Baby Pac-Man

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I have not been keeping close tabs on this thread since probably mid-November. But when my notifications for this topic started exploding today I knew that I needed to get caught up.

 

I don't have a lot to add except this - As you can see from the attached picture I am in support of all sides of this as much as some of it is conflicting.

 

I appreciate the homebrew programmers like Bob and Kurt who use their precious TIME and TALENTS to produce games that help us to continue to enjoy the consoles we had in our youth or in my case of the 7800, wanted to have.

 

I have supported homebrew hardware developers like Juan Mateos and Fred Quimby directly by purchasing their homebrew hardware so that I can play WIP homebrews. And when I really enjoy a WIP or a finished game where the ROM has been made publically available I spend my hard earned money on physical carts from reputable publishers who provide a way to show monetary support for these homebrew projects.

 

I am saddened when things like this happen in our community. I hope a compromise can be struck and I can buy a CIB version of Baby Pac-Man to add to my collection.

 

What is not shown in this picture is that 90%+ of my homebrews and or hacks I have purchased CIB. Or I have bought a 3rd party repro box from a Marc O when the original box is no longer being offered.

(They are not shown in this pic for space reasons.) I love this hobby that I was sucked back into almost 2.5 years ago and hope to be able to continue to enjoy new games for many years to come.

 

Thank you PMP and everyone involved in bringing us games like these in whatever form we get or like to enjoy them in.

 

 

post-47669-0-60863100-1547679832_thumb.jpg

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Well this turned ugly, and it makes me sad. :(

Yeah I am stressed about it.

I almost punched something.

After the highs and lows it was suppposed to end with all the praise and whatnot.

I hope somehow everything can be worked out.

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Ok Kurt I will check that out tomorrow. I was not really thinking about the diagnostic mode but I will be happy to try it out.

 

 

 

 

 

@Imstarryeyed:

 

No? No pinball only mode? Maybe this was a misunderstanding, but according to the manual the arcade machine has a DIP switch #16 called "Playfield video adjustment". But according to the game manual, this is for troubleshooting only. If it's on, it says "Playfield will operate only", and off means "Playfield will operate with video".

 

However, since they talk about "for troubleshooting only", this might not be an actual different game mode, but they only switch the video off, but still the game is playing like if the video was there, it's just not visible, not the way Pinball only mode works now in the 7800 version. Could you verify this?

 

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Bob, I wanted to say I think your game is a work of art and will help preserve history. Video / Pin hybrids are a rare breed; so glad to see this ported. ;-)

I'm really at a loss here.
All I'm going to say at this point is that given the circumstances that the rom was released in, I refuse to download any of them, out of respect for all parties involved.

Although I might download the rom for safe keeping, I pledge not to actually play this game until I have the final cartridge in my hands... |:)

OK... I may have my binaries now, but I'm certainly not happy about the way they were posted... basically under protest, and by throwing in the towel. I meant to post something different, but it seems to be too late now. I wish we could have settled this in peace, but apparently it wasn't possible. All I can say now is that I'm very sorry about everything that happened. I hope I didn't ruin too much by my long posting, and I hope there will still eventually be an agreement on a cart release because I still think there are many people who would like to own Baby Pac-Man on a physical cartridge. As of now, I'm ready to agree to any terms presented in case my agreement should be necessary.

I hope you are happy Kurt, as it appears your "wish" has come true. FYI, Bob is not a genie in a magic lamp... :ponder:

Do you think I can do something to remedy what I've just destroyed?

Not without a flux capacitor... :_(

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@Imstarryeyed:

 

No? No pinball only mode? Maybe this was a misunderstanding, but according to the manual the arcade machine has a DIP switch #16 called "Playfield video adjustment". But according to the game manual, this is for troubleshooting only. If it's on, it says "Playfield will operate only", and off means "Playfield will operate with video".

 

However, since they talk about "for troubleshooting only", this might not be an actual different game mode, but they only switch the video off, but still the game is playing like if the video was there, it's just not visible, not the way Pinball only mode works now in the 7800 version. Could you verify this?

 

 

 

I tried out switch 16 today and all it did is black out the screen and the pinball part was dead. I am not sure how this switch is supposed to work but it did not engage a pinball only mode or video only mode of any sort, there is a chance that my unit may be running an older chipset or bios however but this falls squarely on the diagnostic sense.

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OK, thank you for the investigation! I still think the "pinball only" mode as implemented by Bob enhances the game and is a good counterpart to the "Video only" mode, so I'd keep it in there, even if the original arcade game doesn't have it.

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Bob & Kurt thanks for your work, looking forward to picking up the cartridge! To a drama-free 2019!

Yes, congrats. Put the petty drama behind us. Both of you guys are equally responsible for helping this game come to fruition. Kurt, sorry if I sounded harsh on you last night. Without your help, this game wasn't possible..

 

OK, thank you for the investigation! I still think the "pinball only" mode as implemented by Bob enhances the game and is a good counterpart to the "Video only" mode, so I'd keep it in there, even if the original arcade game doesn't have it.

Agreed 100%. More ways to play = more fun. Look at all the modes in the Tengen Ms Pacman for NES that weren't in the original. Lots of reasons the gamer may want to have their cake and eat it too. Hone in on skill shots or just casually play pinball, or a new variation on Pacman.

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I'm just so glad the game is done. So many of these ambitious projects never get completed- here's to the exception!

 

Also a major step towards getting my arcade game fixed and something I'll be super happy to see on the shelf, not to mention play.

 

Let's hope we can all buy this thing soon.

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Apology taken. Thinkin' about the drama now... where it comes from and how it could be avoided.

 

Yes, congrats. Put the petty drama behind us. Both of you guys are equally responsible for helping this game come to fruition. Kurt, sorry if I sounded harsh on you last night. Without your help, this game wasn't possible..

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I hope that this game gets some good play/bug testing in before it gets considered done . Especially on real hardware . Game looks great !

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Apology taken. Thinkin' about the drama now... where it comes from and how it could be avoided.

 

Don't sweat it. Forgive and forget. Put the past behind and move on... :)

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What about the "drama" should Kurt be forgiving? The ROM is out, as he wanted. Also, "drama" is a horrible choice of words. It implies theatrics and hysterics, without real life consequences. That is NOT what happened here.

 

After giving over a decade of homebrew ROM and source code contributions, Bob had one small wish for the game - to not have scumbags sell knockoffs of it.

 

Kurt had a right to object, though it was handled badly. (Even if a team member says something in public that you don't agree with, you take the argument private, and work out the damage control together.)

 

Others did not have a right to complain, but still felt it necessary to repay Bob with angry comments about homebrew pricing being insulting, and how the vast majority of homebrew would be thrown away by publishers during the original system lifespan. I also include those that supported the complainers with their silence. A big FU to all of you in that group.

 

To those who did want ROM downloads, and offered ideas on how to do that while respecting Bob's concerns about black market carts... thank-you. This is how the dialog is supposed to go.

 

I am obviously angry that my friend was forced into giving up a very small wish over his work, due to mob demands. You'll notice that Bob has been largely absent since the blow up. In his shoes, I would have said f*ck it and walked away. I'm not going to harp on it, but I won't be a party to any message of "kumbaya. Let's all heal and move past it" until I hear the words coming from Bob DeCrescenzo's mouth.

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I'd also point out that Bob currently has 19 homebrews in the Atari Age store. Baby Pac-man would be number 20. The 7800 has, what, like 61 original games? It's an incredible body of work, and I'm sure he doesn't get much in return.

 

For me, Bob nigh single-handedly has changed the 7800 from a classic gaming curiosity, to a must have retro system.

 

Thank you, Bob, for all you have done.

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Bob is incredibly talented and would be a huge loss to the homebrew scene! Seems like this all started with a single post.

Edited by eebuckeye
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What about the "drama" should Kurt be forgiving? The ROM is out, as he wanted. Also, "drama" is a horrible choice of words. It implies theatrics and hysterics, without real life consequences. That is NOT what happened here.

FYI, I was referring to everyone, not just Kurt specifically when I said "Forgive and forget." But apparently you didn't comprehend what I said because your long-winded rebuttal proves otherwise.

 

People need to drop this. It was ultimately Bob's decision whether or not to upload the ROM, not Kurt's, not anyone else's. And do I think Kurt's post prior to Bob releasing the ROM was in bad taste? Yes I do. But Kurt alone isn't to blame for this quagmire, really everyone is.

 

Feathers were ruffled, feelings were hurt, but what's done is done and there's no taking it back at this point. The more this train wreck of a discussion goes on, the worse it gets. Take a deep breath, step away from the computer screen, and do like Elsa from Frozen and just "Let it Go" already.

 

And to everyone (including myself): Next time before you click that reply button, think about the repercussions before proceeding.

 

*click*

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As I said before, what I initially wrote on this thread was abrupt and not well versed. A few people casually, even jokingly complained, too. Beyond Kurt, there was no mob or others, it was really just one dummy, yours truly. Bob responded to my post professionally. I felt no reason to reply, as Bob was pretty definitive that there would be no ROM, end of story. Didn't sound to me like there would be wiggle room. CPU-wiz asked us to take the piracy/rom discussion elsewhere, and Bob continued to discuss the game. Kurt then posted what he did, got into it with others, and Bob, who then obviously got fed up. They have had a few dust-up's on here before, during which Bob expressed exasperation and nearly stopped developing. I don't think either man is at fault. They've both complimented each other greatly, and stepped on toes, too. As for the future, I don't know what the best course is, but perhaps Kurt should pause before Bob has a chance to clear his head on this, in case he wants to return to developing it.

 

My "homebrew" comments on another thread were philosophical, and as I said there, not specifically directed at anyone, and I replied that the vast majority sold by A.A. did not fit those comments. Again, I should have thought more before posting, though I've written that opinion many times, including on this forum in the past. However, I was 100% NOT referring to this game with them. I didn't even see that Bob had responded angrily there initially, thanks to crappy Tapa-Talk on my phone, I only saw who quoted me. Would I prefer a ROM (including one for purchase) over a cart, yes. If not, that's fine too. Despite Bob's suggestion to me to the contrary, I'll probably still buy a cart. I don't support bootlegging of home brews, and have never bought one myself. Clearly, as I stated the other day, I don't see the other side of that.

 

I'm not an idiot, Bob D is STILL my favorite Atari homebrewer. This game is probably his greatest achievement, besides BBSB, and should be getting acclaim rather than head pounding stress. I also value this forum over pretty much any other on the Internet, so I certainly don't wish to be a pariah here. I've only had one major disagreement here in 12 years, and that was done in private anyway. I've also never had barely a critique for anything Bob has created or written here. In fact, I'm usually one of his prime cheerleaders. Bob has been nothing but generous, and I guess I was just stunned by this particular decision, and reacted badly on my part. I'm not sure what else I need to do for penance but open to suggestions in which video games are not harmed?

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FYI, I was referring to everyone, not just Kurt specifically when I said "Forgive and forget." But apparently you didn't comprehend what I said because your long-winded rebuttal proves otherwise.

I comprehended your instructions perfectly - hence my "kumbaya" comment - but you've sadly confused comprehension with obedience.

 

Clue: sometimes discussion can lead to understanding. Greg2000's clarification about his earlier comments has helped, and may help further when Bob returns.

 

Strangely, we didn't "just drop this" and progress has been made. Leave the crowd control up to the experts, please. The mods are more than capable.

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------------------------------------------------

Also, and I've been meaning to post this, I won't be posting any more final versions of the ROM (for the first time ever). I've been seeing reproductions being made on eBay too much (by one particular person especially, and they don't comply when I ask to stop selling them). Albert / AA is the ONLY person / site I want distributing the games I do.

 

...and there are QUITE a few hacks out there where someone changes a maze and then claims authorship of the game... That kind of irks me too.

------------------------------------------------

 

Sigh. I'm really sorry to hear that, Bob. Ugh.

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I have not been keeping close tabs on this thread since probably mid-November. But when my notifications for this topic started exploding today I knew that I needed to get caught up.

 

I don't have a lot to add except this - As you can see from the attached picture I am in support of all sides of this as much as some of it is conflicting.

 

I appreciate the homebrew programmers like Bob and Kurt who use their precious TIME and TALENTS to produce games that help us to continue to enjoy the consoles we had in our youth or in my case of the 7800, wanted to have.

 

I have supported homebrew hardware developers like Juan Mateos and Fred Quimby directly by purchasing their homebrew hardware so that I can play WIP homebrews. And when I really enjoy a WIP or a finished game where the ROM has been made publically available I spend my hard earned money on physical carts from reputable publishers who provide a way to show monetary support for these homebrew projects.

 

I am saddened when things like this happen in our community. I hope a compromise can be struck and I can buy a CIB version of Baby Pac-Man to add to my collection.

 

What is not shown in this picture is that 90%+ of my homebrews and or hacks I have purchased CIB. Or I have bought a 3rd party repro box from a Marc O when the original box is no longer being offered.

(They are not shown in this pic for space reasons.) I love this hobby that I was sucked back into almost 2.5 years ago and hope to be able to continue to enjoy new games for many years to come.

 

Thank you PMP and everyone involved in bringing us games like these in whatever form we get or like to enjoy them in.

 

 

 

Man I can see some of these games in this images I did label art on

 

Pac-Man Collection:

Asteroids Deluxe:

Space Invaders (7800):

Coke Wins:

Defender Arcade:

E.T. Return to Earth:

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Ill be purchasing a cart for sure, as I have for all of Bobs games. Why you gotta fuck with Bob. People on this forum should already realize. Dont fuck with Bob. Bob is God around here, he is to be worshipped. Im bummed about what has transpired. Everyone better buy this cart.

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