Ben Heck: new Atari 5200 controller

[Koa Zo]

Has Ben Heck answered anywhere whether his project actually functions as an analog controller?
It's quite an incredible oversight to not test and validate the analog capabilities, and I find it odd that hardly anyone seemed to pick up on the fact that analog compatibility hasn't been established.

[Osgeld]

1) relax, it was a fun video not a product advertisement

 

2) I can't speek for Ben but about ~5 year ago I did the exact same thing using a 10k thumbstick an arduino and a digital pot and it did work in analog modes, though a bit stair steppy,see digital pots go from X to Y in steps and depending on the resolution determines that, the model I was using was 128 position and the one he used was 256 so it would be 2x as smooth but at some level still would have steps

[deepthaw]

Is there a way to translate pot values without involving a microcontroller like arduino?

[bohoki]

not sure on my math but when adapting a pc controller to 5200 i add a .22uF marked 224 so i guess to adapt a 10k controller you would need a 225

 

https://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/rc/rc_1.html

Edited April 30, 2018 by bohoki

[Osgeld]

adding capacitance works great on systems that use 555 timers like going from a thumbstick to apple II or pc or whatever, the 5200 has its analog controls going into a chip and I dunno if its a proper adc setup or if its a timer like other machines of the time

 

one could try pretty easily though, proper way would be to see if there is any capacitance on those pins and ground then do the math, or one could get a thumbstick and start jamming caps in it to see if things start working

 

I wrote an article about converting a thumbstick for use on an apple II a number of years ago that explains how that works, but again I dont really know how the internals of the chips inside the 5200 handle it so it may be the wrong track

 

https://hackaday.com/2012/01/26/analog-joypad-for-your-retro-pc/

 

edit: not really wrong track but maybe the math wont match up

Edited April 30, 2018 by Osgeld

[SINGLE TOOTH]

He did seem to skim over the actual usage part. Would have liked more info.

[Rick Dangerous]

It would be a shame to do all that work and not make this available. I'd snap up a few in a heartbeat.

[JBerel]

He's a maker, and he's into prototyping stuff. I get it. But unfortunately, there's a huge stretch from making something for fun and making something for a customer, especially at a price that's practical. The minute you start making something for somebody else, the fun part tends to go away really fast.

[Koa Zo]

1) relax, it was a fun video not a product advertisement

 

2) I can't speek for Ben but about ~5 year ago I did the exact same thing using a 10k thumbstick an arduino and a digital pot and it did work in analog modes, though a bit stair steppy,see digital pots go from X to Y in steps and depending on the resolution determines that, the model I was using was 128 position and the one he used was 256 so it would be 2x as smooth but at some level still would have steps

1) Eat a dick. I sure felt relaxed when I typed my previous posts. I'm not now. What are you talking about "product advertisement"? What does that have to do with anything? The video alludes to the controller as being analog, but then it is just forgotten and never mentioned again. Oh, is that "fun"? It's just a fun video that has feverish 5200 fans clamoring for something that might not be real, or at least fully functional. Oh! That's fun! Misinformation or straight bullshit on the internet is always lots of fun. That's exactly what the infamous 5200 needs.

 

2) I asked a straight forward question. i.e.: "Has Ben Heck commented on the analog functionality?" Apparently the answer is "No". Nobody is asking you to speak for him, though it appears you'd like to. But now as you've shared your experience you confirm just what we'd expect: your analog conversion was jittery, which isn't exactly playable, and sure isn't a "better" controller.

 

I want to read and see that this project worked, but at this point it's beyond suspect that no analog games were shown. Do you really want to excuse them by suggesting that's the only games they had? They can order parts for the controller but can't order a $5 Star Raiders cart to test their project with?

 

[deepthaw]

I'd just like Ben to release whatever code/plans he has and let the community run with it.

[JBerel]

1) Eat a dick. I sure felt relaxed when I typed my previous posts. I'm not now. What are you talking about "product advertisement"? What does that have to do with anything? The video alludes to the controller as being analog, but then it is just forgotten and never mentioned again. Oh, is that "fun"? It's just a fun video that has feverish 5200 fans clamoring for something that might not be real, or at least fully functional. Oh! That's fun! Misinformation or straight bullshit on the internet is always lots of fun. That's exactly what the infamous 5200 needs.

 

2) I asked a straight forward question. i.e.: "Has Ben Heck commented on the analog functionality?" Apparently the answer is "No". Nobody is asking you to speak for him, though it appears you'd like to. But now as you've shared your experience you confirm just what we'd expect: your analog conversion was jittery, which isn't exactly playable, and sure isn't a "better" controller.

 

I want to read and see that this project worked, but at this point it's beyond suspect that no analog games were shown. Do you really want to excuse them by suggesting that's the only games they had? They can order parts for the controller but can't order a $5 Star Raiders cart to test their project with?

 

 

I'm sure when you make your own, it will work great! Be sure to share your success with us. Best of luck.

[jaybird3rd]

I sure felt relaxed when I typed my previous posts. I'm not now.

Next time, please take a few moments to calm down again before you post. We don't need that kind of language here.

[Koa Zo]

 

I'm sure when you make your own, it will work great! Be sure to share your success with us. Best of luck.

Is that what this is about now? I don't make controllers, dood.

All I'm doing is trying to clarify reality. Does the project work or does it not? That bothers you?

For a lot of the fans here and on youtube, all they seem to need is for a prominent youtuber to make a "fun" video and they're all begging for that youtuber to take their money, despite the project never being shown to function fully.

Brilliant.

Edited May 1, 2018 by Koa Zo

[JBerel]

He is not making a product to sell.

[jaybird3rd]

For a lot of the fans here and on youtube, all they seem to need is for a prominent youtuber to make a "fun" video and they're all begging for that youtuber to take their money, despite the project never being shown to function fully.

Brilliant.

1) They never asked anyone for money.

2) They are not advertising their controller as a product, so why do they owe it to you or to anyone else to show it functioning any more fully than they already have?

3) You don't seem to be able to discuss this subject politely, so you just got yourself blocked from the thread. "Brilliant."

[The Lizard King]

[PhoenixMoonPatrol]

That guy could make allot of money selling those controllers.

God I wish I didn't suck at electronics

Nice video.

[cybercylon]

But I also understand why people do one offs and don't intend to sell. They do it for fun just because it can be done. Not everyone wants to put up with aggravation of making something to sell. I certainly don't (especially with the idiot that was just banned from this thread as an example).

 

It is nice when people share diagrams, but there is no obligation to do so.

[S1500]

Ben Heck released the source code to America's Most Haunted, so there's a chance.

[Keatah]

Is there a way to translate pot values without involving a microcontroller like arduino?

 

Absolutely. You could use 2 op-amps per axis and there would be no stair-step quantization either. And you'll get full range with no lag.

 

Doing it via the micro-controller method is the easy, prefab, expensive, way out. Real electronics knowledge will let you pick discrete parts that will cost less than $2.00.

 

---

 

Added: Maybe throw in some resistors and capacitors to buffer noise, smooth the power, and make it all electrically nice'n'tidy. + $1.00

Edited May 12, 2018 by Keatah

[CopterCommando]

sign me up as well ha, my controllers are all worthless

[phuzaxeman]

is it just me or did he use an analog controller but then just set it with trigger values so it acts like 4 way

 

oh well since there is only like 5 analog necessary games superbreakout,kaboom,missile command,star wars,gorf

 

he could have done it with resistors 4 buttons and a nes dpad instead of a PIC

 

 

 

There are more games that just 5 analog necessary games including Pole Position,Galaxian, and the sport games.

 

 

River Raid, Galaxian, Centipede, and Dreadnaught Factor may be 'analog-preferred' games, but they aren't 'analog-necessary' games... Not sure about the other two.

 

Yeah that gamepad he made is very interesting - want two of them

I've got high scores on Centipede and Galaxian that for me are necessary. :-)