+CyranoJ Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 Yawn. Seems like it's OK to work for nearly a year on something full time while living in a garbage can eating mouldy socks as a reward. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swansea_Mariner Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 WTF is up with this troll and the need to post all that negative bull on here. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh3-rg Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 WTF is up with this troll and the need to post all that negative bull on here. I honestly don't think he's trolling, but trying to offer useful feedback as to how the KS was perceived away from here. When you've backed and been burned in the past, there's certain things you look for and certain things you notice if they're not there. Presenting and succeeding with a KS is an art, you can't just Kevin Costner it anymore, you have to used-car-dealer the shit out of your product/idea and really go out of your way to present it and yourself in the very best possible light, not only on their site but via as much social media as possible, and have a constant stream of new content throughout the campaign to keep it newsworthy and in the minds of potential backers. There were a few areas in which the KS could have done better for itself, and others, such as phrases like "Please note that each Stretch goals may delay the release for 1 or 2 months each, because I will need to work on each game engine specific features. Thus, if the RPG Goal is met, the initial release (for Megadrive / Genesis) will be delayed of at least 4 months." that are only going to sew seeds of doubt. If I was looking to make MD games and not at all interested in RPGs, surely the best plan there would be to sit back and back at the last minute if it looks like it'll go my way. It's not always what you say, but how you present it and make it palatable. Having a single video that only appears to offer very rigid game forms, and apparently others that are in French but subtitled, for a lot of people that's not going to cut it, people just won't bother going out of their way to dig out the info, it needs to be clear, immediate and in their faces. It's 1028, fuckers got no time for that, simple truth. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Sargon Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 WTF is up with this troll and the need to post all that negative bull on here. Whether he is a troll or not, a lot of what he is posting is true. This is a very niche product that was priced higher than most people in that niche were willing to spend. Orion has the right to charge whatever he feels appropriate for his work, but there simply may not be enough interest to justify his efforts and the price he needs to charge. He can either revamp the campaign to try to make the product more appealing to the masses, lower the price, or drop it (which seems to be the route he is taking). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColecoGamer Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 I just spoke to Orion via PM and he’s dropping the project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VladR Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 This is a very niche product that was priced higher than most people in that niche were willing to spend. yeah, I read the two following conditions: 1. No more than $20 2. Multiple people working on that My brain froze for about 15 seconds, thank god I have a husky that was able to collect the jaw and bring it back to me. I seriously highly doubt the kids are the target market here. Where in the world, do these people think ,is it still possible, to survive from $20 ? it sure as hell ain't Eastern Europe or southern America, let alone India or China. probably slums of Sao Paolo.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColecoGamer Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 (edited) I really hope Orion takes a step back; cools off a bit; and finds a way to remarket his Retro Game Maker. I feel it would be an invaluable tool for the retro gaming community to have. Buying such a tool wouldnt stop me personally from learning how to program, though. I am already tinkering around with various packages, including Intybasic, Raptor, etc. But I do like the idea of having access to a drag and drop, GameMaker-like system like the one Orion was selling. Oh well, maybe someday... Edit: Orion, you still have people interested in your tool. There has to be a way to make this work. Edited May 27, 2018 by ColecoGamer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Final Theory Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 (edited) WTF is up with this troll and the need to post all that negative bull on here. If you ran two kickstarters and both failed getting feedback about your kickstarter is not being a troll nor being negative. Life is all about learning and improving. If the creator of the kickstarter doesn't know why it failed then how will they run a better campaign in the future? I posted real comments from people who backed the NESmaker kickstarter. In those comments you can read real thoughts and opinions of other people.... thats all. Also please note that this is a game engine that I personally am excited about. I would love to make a Genesis game. If Orion is reading this, here is my advice. Don't drop the project all together. Go ahead and work on just one single console... the easiest console to make your program for. Then code a complete or nearly complete program for that one console then do a kickstarter for that. Later down the road if everything goes well then you might be able to code another game engine for another console. In other words only do one console at a time. Then when its all said and done you can make exporting code and files easily between programs. Edited May 27, 2018 by Final Theory 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColecoGamer Posted May 27, 2018 Share Posted May 27, 2018 I believe Orion should finish his tool and then sell it as a digital download, both in parts (for each individual system) and then as one complete package. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColecoGamer Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 (edited) I also forgot to mention that Orion may want to test the waters on Valves Steam platform. I know it may seem like an odd fit for such a project, but you never know. I am making this suggestion because expensive (and professional) game maker tools sell well on Steam due to there being an active community of indie developers and hobbiests. Plus, these very same people have asked for a game maker tool similiar to Orions more than once, so this could be an untapped gold mine for him. Plus, he can do an Early Access release where people can buy the tool early and use whatever engine Orion has finished. Orion would get paid for his work, while being Early Access would allow him plenty of time to finish the other engines. Being a retro game design tool doesnt mean it should live or die based on a Kickstarter or even message boards. Edited May 28, 2018 by ColecoGamer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Final Theory Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Orion could also possibly use Patreon. I don't know exactly how Patreon works but if he is working on a program and providing updates can't people show support in this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 Idea sounds good to me. Hope things work out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacman000 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 " yeah, I read the two following conditions: 1. No more than $20 2. Multiple people working on that My brain froze for about 15 seconds, thank god I have a husky that was able to collect the jaw and bring it back to me. I seriously highly doubt the kids are the target market here. Where in the world, do these people think ,is it still possible, to survive from $20 ? it sure as hell ain't Eastern Europe or southern America, let alone India or China. probably slums of Sao Paolo...." I'm guessing a lot of hobbiests think tool development for classic systems is also a hobby; e.g. It's nice to make a little money off of it, but no one's expected to live on that money. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerosquare Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 The fact a crowdfunding campaign is launched for software development (which has very little associated costs) is a pretty big hint that it's not an "hobby" effort. Not to mention Orion_ has never hidden the fact that developing retro games is his only source of income. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 I'm not sure what the best solution would've been to get his Kickstarter successful. The general feedback I got from random people is: "Who the heck is Orion?" and then a general disinterest in his games. However, the developers (like me) all got very excited. Maybe the general public wasn't the right target audience. There IS demand and recognition for the utility in this project though. I don't think for one second a Kickstarter is a reason to kill this project. UPDATE: I guess I better add that I respect his decision to pull the plug. His time and money. Just thinking ahead to how future projects could go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmbe Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 I wonder if he would be willing to work just on the Jaguar portion of the program? Here are my thoughts. He originally wanted to raise about $18,000 and this would cover 4 systems. That breaks down to about $4,500 per system. If the Retro Game Designer (Jaguar Edition) was treated like RPG Maker for the Playstation One, it might get more interest within the Jaguar community. Setting a price at $50 for this edition, he would only need to sale 90 units to reach $4,500. I think this is a reachable goal. The $50 version would be the amateur version (unable to sell created games). There would also be the professional version at say $300. With the professional version, he would only need to sale 15 units to reach $4,500. I would think between the amateur and professional versions he would reach $4,500, possibly higher. For those who just buy the amateur version, an option could be available where they can upgrade to the professional version (just pay the difference between the two versions). Whether $4,500 is worth it for him to continue with the Jaguar only edition only he can answer. I know I would spend $50 for the amateur version to see what I could come up with. At that price I could only get one hour of work from a professional video game coder. Orion has done a lot for the Jaguar community. I wish him well. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerosquare Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) He originally wanted to raise about $18,000 and this would cover 4 systems. That breaks down to about $4,500 per system. Nope. A significant part of the work (making the editors, etc.) is common to all systems ; even if you support only one, it doesn't make it much faster/easier to develop. Plus it probably uses a code interpreter, which means the system-specific stuff is minimized. So the cost for a single system is likely to be significantly more than one-fourth of the cost for four systems. Edited July 13, 2018 by Zerosquare 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Maybe yet another game maker isn't needed. Maybe a unifying visual IDE for retro game consoles (batari BASIC, IntyBASIC, rB+, 7800BAS, etc..) would be desirable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacman000 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Someone's already made that for z80-based systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacman000 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Here: http://www.boriel.com/wiki/en/index.php/ZX_BASIC:Released_Programs_-_PV1000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Good find pacman000! I think ZXBASIC might be a BASIC compiler with many targets. However setting up even one of the targets like the Sega Master System has been a complete and utter mystery. The best you get is usually the source files included in some homebrew. If you can reverse engineer that then you might have a chance. My brain not good enough. I was thinking a retro higher level language IDE would be an interesting step forward. It would leverage existing work in easy to learn compilers. Maybe even connecting desperate tools in one easy interface. It may not be the drag and drop type stuff some want.. but, anything that accelerates the code -> build -> test cycle is a godsend. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+CyranoJ Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 but, anything that accelerates the code -> build -> test cycle is a godsend. Like the one button macro in Notepad++ to build, and run in VJ from the editor for rB+ ? It already exists for this platform. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 Like the one button macro in Notepad++ to build, and run in VJ from the editor for rB+ ? It already exists for this platform. I'm probably overstating my case here. Not enough coffee for proper thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerosquare Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 Feature request: add a coffee-making function to rB+. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColecoGamer Posted July 17, 2018 Share Posted July 17, 2018 Not sure if Orion has given up on the project or not, but I just wanted him to know that I am still interested in this project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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