Game on Retron 77 contract wants you to sign over all rights and copyright?

[Matthew]

Hm, all these homebrew-rights-discussions would not be necessary at all, when the Retron77 would have a SD-Card-Slot additionally to the modul-slot, that allows the user to load roms directly with it. This would be the buying-inducement number one for the most people i suppose and then every user can put on his SD-card what he want`s. 500 homebrew-games or other things. Then no games "must" be included from the beginning on, when the console was delivered.

 

Okay, many people now will try to use their Harmony on the Retron77 i suppose. Don`t know if compatibility to the Harmony is planed at least, when there is no direct SD-card-support on the Retron77? But i'd like to think NOT, when it's software-emulator-based. Or is still the chance for direct rom-support via SD-Card-slot or something like this on Retron77? Or have i even overlooked something when it comes to SD-Card support? The thread of the Retron77 is very long and i have not read all of the hundreds entries there.

 

I also never understood why for example the "Retron 5" don`t had direct rom-support via SD-card and why people must make the inconvenient way with those patch-trick to start a rom there? Is it so complicated for a producer of clone-retro-hardware or where is the crunchpoint (a legislation problem?) to include direct rom-support and if so, how AT@Games (Firecore) did it with clone-things like the "Mega Drive Gopher" handheld, "Atari Flashback Portable" handheld or the "Firecore Passport" which all allows exactly this? And i am sure, people like such a feature alot.

 

 

"Standard cartridges" means 4k/8k/16k games. There may be exceptions because our supply of cartridges is somewhat limited.

"Homebrew support" means the system will play .bin files placed on the SD card.

The older version of Stella will not be used. We are fully aware of its limitations; that's basically why in spite of paying for that earlier version, we decided to go open-source with this project, and use a more recent version, and to share the source codes with the community."

 

[Amstari]

Hm, all these homebrew-rights-discussions would not be necessary at all, when the Retron77 would have a SD-Card-Slot additionally to the modul-slot, that allows the user to load roms directly with it. This would be the buying-inducement number one for the most people i suppose and then every user can put on his SD-card what he want`s. 500 homebrew-games or other things. Then no games "must" be included from the beginning on, when the console was delivered.

 

Okay, many people now will try to use their Harmony on the Retron77 i suppose. Don`t know if compatibility to the Harmony is planed at least, when there is no direct SD-card-support on the Retron77? But i'd like to think NOT, when it's software-emulator-based. Or is still the chance for direct rom-support via SD-Card-slot or something like this on Retron77? Or have i even overlooked something when it comes to SD-Card support? The thread of the Retron77 is very long and i have not read all of the hundreds entries there.

 

I also never understood why for example the "Retron 5" don`t had direct rom-support via SD-card and why people must make the inconvenient way with those patch-trick to start a rom there? Is it so complicated for a producer of clone-retro-hardware or where is the crunchpoint (a legislation problem?) to include direct rom-support and if so, how AT@Games (Firecore) did it with clone-things like the "Mega Drive Gopher" handheld, "Atari Flashback Portable" handheld or the "Firecore Passport" which all allows exactly this? And i am sure, people like such a feature alot.

 

The Retron77 will have an SD card slot. They want to include some homebrew games on the SD card that is included with the console.

[Keatah]

I believe the want/need to include pack-in game(s) is irrelevant here. Aside from marketing wanting to do something. Practically the entire VCS rom library is available from many many sources.

[Flojomojo]

I believe the want/need to include pack-in game(s) is irrelevant here. Aside from marketing wanting to do something. Practically the entire VCS rom library is available from many many sources.

I agree with you, but there seems to be a certain type of person who needs this kind of thing to be playable right out of the box, with nothing else needed. Even the SuperNT shipped with 2 Turrican games embedded in firmware.

[MrBeefy]

I think it should include a homebrew demo cart with many demos of the games offered here. That way the buyers can be directed here to purchase great homebrews. The devs get some royalty that way too.

[Andromeda Stardust]

I think it should include a homebrew demo cart with many demos of the games offered here. That way the buyers can be directed here to purchase great homebrews. The devs get some royalty that way too.

Including a homebrew multicart would raise the price considerably. Would you rather buy an $80 Retron77 with no bundled games, or $100+ with a cart containing embedded games? And I'm being generous with +20$ for a multicart (that hopefully works with OEM hardware). Better yet, pay the same $80 for a sampling of games embedded on the system.

 

Yes, the contract is dickish. Piko Interactive homebrew appeared on the Retrobit Generations and he retained the rights to sell them on his webstore. There is nothing in the wording of the contract to suggest that the homebrew authors can continue to sell or distribute their own games, or lease them to third party sellers (such as AtariAge et al) without legal consequence.

 

Hyperkin Andrew, your lawyers are being donkey ravines to the community with the wording of their contracts. Please suggest they change it. It may not be Hyperkin's intention to deny the author the right to distribute or profit from his or her own work, but the contract does exactly this. The company lawyers could easily send Albert or others nasty cease and desist letters for distributing ROMs or carts containing game IP.

[MrBeefy]

Including a homebrew multicart would raise the price considerably. Would you rather buy an $80 Retron77 with no bundled games, or $100+ with a cart containing embedded games? And I'm being generous with +20$ for a multicart (that hopefully works with OEM hardware). Better yet, pay the same $80 for a sampling of games embedded on the system.

 

Yes, the contract is dickish. Piko Interactive homebrew appeared on the Retrobit Generations and he retained the rights to sell them on his webstore. There is nothing in the wording of the contract to suggest that the homebrew authors can continue to sell or distribute their own games, or lease them to third party sellers (such as AtariAge et al) without legal consequence.

 

Hyperkin Andrew, your lawyers are being donkey ravines to the community with the wording of their contracts. Please suggest they change it. It may not be Hyperkin's intention to deny the author the right to distribute or profit from his or her own work, but the contract does exactly this. The company lawyers could easily send Albert or others nasty cease and desist letters for distributing ROMs or carts containing game IP.

Well it can be demos on the SD card. My sentiment is to have more people directed to the AA store.

[Keatah]

Yes, the contract is dickish. Piko Interactive homebrew appeared on the Retrobit Generations and he retained the rights to sell them on his webstore. There is nothing in the wording of the contract to suggest that the homebrew authors can continue to sell or distribute their own games, or lease them to third party sellers (such as AtariAge et al) without legal consequence.

Hyperkin Andrew, your lawyers are being donkey ravines to the community with the wording of their contracts. Please suggest they change it. It may not be Hyperkin's intention to deny the author the right to distribute or profit from his or her own work, but the contract does exactly this. The company lawyers could easily send Albert or others nasty cease and desist letters for distributing ROMs or carts containing game IP.

 

Mainly that.. The way I see it is that it was already posted and some expectation we should accept it was assumed at some point.

 

I'm just waiting for Emulator Stella project to blow up on us. I can't see it yet, the vibes aren't in resonation yet, but a distant early warning alarm is being readied. I wish I could be more straightforward.

[Andromeda Stardust]

Mainly that.. The way I see it is that it was already posted and some expectation we should accept it was assumed at some point.

 

I'm just waiting for Emulator Stella project to blow up on us. I can't see it yet, the vibes aren't in resonation yet, but a distant early warning alarm is being readied. I wish I could be more straightforward.

How so? Hyperkin and Stella had an affair, and the Retron77 is their baby. At least it won't be the conjoined quintuplet monstrosity that was the Retron5.

[Matthew]

To be honest, this looks like a wasted opportunity by AtariAge and homebrew authors.

 

Put an AtariAge intro page (with url) at the start of your homebrew, then pass them to Hyperkin. You will reach a far greater audience than otherwise possible, the free advertising through Youtube reviews of the console would be huge.

[Thomas Jentzsch]

As of now, no reason for drama from Stella side here.

[+stephena]

I agree. Hyperkin has said they will obey the GPLv2, and that's all I need to care about. I have no reason to believe they won't after publicly saying they would, so AFAIC this is a closed deal. We just have to wait for them to release the hardware and then check if they follow through (which I'm sure they will at this point).

[DirtyHairy]

What Thomas and Stephen said. As long as Hyperkin honor the GPL, I am fine.

Edited May 20, 2018 by DirtyHairy

[MrBeefy]

To be honest, this looks like a wasted opportunity by AtariAge and homebrew authors.

 

Put an AtariAge intro page (with url) at the start of your homebrew, then pass them to Hyperkin. You will reach a far greater audience than otherwise possible, the free advertising through Youtube reviews of the console would be huge.

What would be wasted is if they sign and then Hyperkin tells Al he can no longer sell those homebrews on AA. Otherwise I think it would be a good idea. I am curious as to who already signed contracts before this blew up.

[+KaeruYojimbo]

To be honest, this looks like a wasted opportunity by AtariAge and homebrew authors.

 

Put an AtariAge intro page (with url) at the start of your homebrew, then pass them to Hyperkin. You will reach a far greater audience than otherwise possible, the free advertising through Youtube reviews of the console would be huge.

 

Adding a title screen to a 2600 game that doesn't already have one is not that simple. Even if some did the legwork of creating a template with the graphics for the url, adding anything to an existing game means adding more ROM, which means adding bankswitching to 4K games.

 

And would that increased exposure really lead to increased sales? How many people that buy the Retron77 are going to pay another 20-50 dollars for a cartridge of a game that came free with the console?

[Keatah]

Some games are already jam-packed and highly optimized. And there'd be no room for additional title-page graphics or text.

[Coolcrab]

Yea I wonder who signed the contract

[AndrewHyperkin]

Small update: we have signed a few contracts to include some homebrew games with the system. To the best of my knowledge, our lawyers agreed to the contract form suggested here by the community (it was signed right away, as submitted), and that was the case for most authors; and according to our development / legal departments, those who signed the early version, have explicitly expressed their agreement to go ahead with that.

 

For those earlier contracts, I'm saying this again: under no condition Hyperkin shall ever restrict these developers' rights to publish their games, sell them or modify them. What we want is really simple:

A. We have the right to put your games on the SD card that ships with our system. and B. There will be no situation when suddenly there's a contributor out of nowhere saying: "Hey I never wanted my game to be there, and you published it without my consent".

 

I think all that has been reflected in the updated contracts, so everything should be good to go. With that said, I'm signing off the SD card images to mass production. :-)

 

To be transparent, here are the games that we will bundle with the system:

1. astronomerV1.0

2. Baby

3. Muncher77

4. NeXioN_3D

 

After all, I'm glad that this situation happened; it was not a pleasant experience for anyone, but we at Hyperkin have learnt our lesson. In particular, for Stella license, we will be sending a few developer kits to the authors / contributors to make sure everyone's happy with the wording and contents. It is our first experience with an open-source community-friendly project like this, and we want to do it right.

[Flojomojo]

Noice

I'm glad this seems to have worked out in a sensible way.

[+Karl G]

Awesome. I'm happy that the community's concerns have been taken seriously and addressed, I think having the whole system be open source will end up benefitting everyone in the end. I'm looking forward to this getting released!

[cybercylon]

Good to see that it looks like you have been addressing concerns.

[thetick1]

Small update: we have signed a few contracts to include some homebrew games with the system. To the best of my knowledge, our lawyers agreed to the contract form suggested here by the community (it was signed right away, as submitted), and that was the case for most authors; and according to our development / legal departments, those who signed the early version, have explicitly expressed their agreement to go ahead with that.

 

For those earlier contracts, I'm saying this again: under no condition Hyperkin shall ever restrict these developers' rights to publish their games, sell them or modify them. What we want is really simple:

A. We have the right to put your games on the SD card that ships with our system. and B. There will be no situation when suddenly there's a contributor out of nowhere saying: "Hey I never wanted my game to be there, and you published it without my consent".

 

I think all that has been reflected in the updated contracts, so everything should be good to go. With that said, I'm signing off the SD card images to mass production. :-)

 

To be transparent, here are the games that we will bundle with the system:

1. astronomerV1.0

2. Baby

3. Muncher77

4. NeXioN_3D

 

After all, I'm glad that this situation happened; it was not a pleasant experience for anyone, but we at Hyperkin have learnt our lesson. In particular, for Stella license, we will be sending a few developer kits to the authors / contributors to make sure everyone's happy with the wording and contents. It is our first experience with an open-source community-friendly project like this, and we want to do it right.

 

Very nice. Assuming Hyperkin keeps their stated promises I'll be getting my first Hyperkin product.

Edited May 22, 2018 by thetick1

[Coolcrab]

I'm excited about this now

 

If you read this in time, could you rename astronomer 1.0 to Astronomer?

[Arenafoot]

Small update: we have signed a few contracts to include some homebrew games with the system. To the best of my knowledge, our lawyers agreed to the contract form suggested here by the community (it was signed right away, as submitted), and that was the case for most authors; and according to our development / legal departments, those who signed the early version, have explicitly expressed their agreement to go ahead with that.

 

For those earlier contracts, I'm saying this again: under no condition Hyperkin shall ever restrict these developers' rights to publish their games, sell them or modify them. What we want is really simple:

A. We have the right to put your games on the SD card that ships with our system. and B. There will be no situation when suddenly there's a contributor out of nowhere saying: "Hey I never wanted my game to be there, and you published it without my consent".

 

I think all that has been reflected in the updated contracts, so everything should be good to go. With that said, I'm signing off the SD card images to mass production. :-)

 

To be transparent, here are the games that we will bundle with the system:

1. astronomerV1.0

2. Baby

3. Muncher77

4. NeXioN_3D

 

After all, I'm glad that this situation happened; it was not a pleasant experience for anyone, but we at Hyperkin have learnt our lesson. In particular, for Stella license, we will be sending a few developer kits to the authors / contributors to make sure everyone's happy with the wording and contents. It is our first experience with an open-source community-friendly project like this, and we want to do it right.

Andrew,

 

Are you looking for more homebrew games to include????

[Coolcrab]

Also I know baby but what are the other two games? Does anybody know them?