How many variants of 600XL without (!) sockets you know?

[+tf_hh]

Hi,

 

I´ve a PAL 600XL for repair and was surprised about the fact, that only GTIA, ANTIC and CPU were in sockets - all other parts are directly soldered in!

 

Until today I never have had an Atari 600XL seen with a mainboard, where NOT all chips are in sockets. Not dependent if it was a PAL or NTSC 600XL mainboard.

 

I´ve made some pictures...

 

(Both DRAMs, both 74LS158, the 74LS375 and 74LS32 were desoldered and sockets placed in by the owner - originally these chips were also directly soldered in)

 

Also not common: Basic "C" - I never found a Basic-C version in an Atari 600XL.

 

Datecode "1284" is very late for 600XL...?

 

Also I never saw such "rubberfoam" at the PBI´s connector (bottom, solder side).

 

Any comments?

 

BR Jurgen

 

 

 

[+CharlieChaplin]

Hmmm,

 

strange, all the Basic chips I have are:

 

- © 1979 Atari = Rev. A

- © 1983 Atari = Rev. B

- © 1984 Atari = Rev. C

 

I have never seen a Basic Rev. C with a copyright of 1979...?!?

[+Nezgar]

If it has rev C it would be later production, so maybe when the Trameils took over they told the factories to stop using sockets (or they ran out) before they were all finished...

 

I just checked Rev B BASIC chips from 1 600XL and 2 800XLs (NTSC) all are dated 1979...

Edited June 22, 2018 by Nezgar

[Level42]

Yeah all 600XLs I've seen are ALL-sockets.....(one of the reasons why I love them).

 

The last production date of one of the chips is week 44 of 1984 which is indeed very late (and much later than the PCB date, so was the PCB itself produced before or did they stamp them only when assembled ??) but I'm not sure when the 600XL production was exacly stopped. I always thought the 600XL was cancelled before the Tramiels took over but I'm not sure anymore.

 

If it had been one socket I might have guessed it was a factory mod but three....

 

 

There are some people who advocate that sockets are a source of problems....maybe a fanatic modded it ?

But why not all then.....doesn't sound very likely. It's also incorrect, I never saw problems because of sockets with XL's (with arcade PCBs yes....but those often had a worse life....)

Edited June 22, 2018 by Level42

[Level42]

If it has rev C it would be later production, so maybe when the Trameils took over they told the factories to stop using sockets (or they ran out) before they were all finished...

I just checked Rev B BASIC chips from 1 600XL and 2 800XLs (NTSC) all are dated 1979...

My guess this is because Atari outsourced Atari Basic. I bet they did the bugfixes themselves though, but they couldn't change the copyright date...

[+Nezgar]

I also saw the PBI rubberfoam in a chelco 1983 800XL - says rev A 2 on the PCB. The foam is on both sides. It also has a ground header for a jumper wire to the cart port on the top case instead of springy wires that press on the shield for ground.

Edited June 22, 2018 by Nezgar

[+Nezgar]

Tramiels took over Atari in July 84, so 12/84 date code is 5 months later...

[+DrVenkman]

Tramiels took over Atari in July 84, so 12/84 date code is 5 months later...

 

Indeed. There quite obviously cut costs dramatically in the next couple months as they sold out remaining inventory on-hand or in the immediate pipeline, before the 65XE and 130XE were ready. Late '84 NTSC 800XL's are less likely to be fully socketed as well, while '83/early '84 800XL's generally are, even including the logic chips.

[+hunmanik]

Nice!

 

Would you be willing to post a pic of the underside label, where the serial number is?

 

There may also be an assembly date stamped there (I hope).

 

I think your unit was probably made in Taiwan, looking forward to finding out. (Most 600XLs were made in Hong Kong.)

[Guest]

Hmmm,

 

strange, all the Basic chips I have are:

 

- © 1979 Atari = Rev. A

- © 1983 Atari = Rev. B

- © 1984 Atari = Rev. C

 

I have never seen a Basic Rev. C with a copyright of 1979...?!?

well the one pictures isn't 1979 is it?

it's a RevB '83

[+Nezgar]

well the one pictures isn't 1979 is it?

it's a RevB '83

 

Motherboard says RevB '83, but the BASIC Rev B ROM is © 1979

[flashjazzcat]

well the one pictures isn't 1979 is it?

it's a RevB '83

The BASIC ROM is dated 1979 but with the Rev. C part number. Edited June 24, 2018 by flashjazzcat

[+kheller2]

Its just a very late run 600XL, as mentioned above by others, under Trams December 1984.. I have this listed in my mobo database.

Solder side: UVO ATARI INC MADE IN HONG KONG CO61677 7/1983 REV B

Component side should say somewhere: CA0621760-001 REV A (which I believe is the silkscreen revision, but I don't see that on this board)

 

12/84 does seem like a late run 600XL. I'm not sure its been mentioned before exactly when the XL's stopped being manufactured. I would image up until early 85 when the XE's came out, but I can see them still making 800XLs into 85. I'm pretty sure I've seen a few with 85' dates on the serial sticker.

[+x=usr(1536)]

I had a PAL 600XL with Rev. C BASIC. The previous owner was someone I'd known from the local users' group, and he had had it upgraded from Rev. B by either Peat's (Dublin's main Atari dealer and service centre) or Atari UK. Which one it was, I don't recall.

 

Chances are that there's a handful of PAL XLs out there like this, but when it comes to PCB differences I can't really comment - it's been decades since I saw the guts of a 600XL.

[+Nezgar]

The BASIC ROM is dated 1979 but with the Rev. C part number.

Blarg, you're right, meant to say rev C. Too easy to post in haste on the phone.

[Level42]

The 600XL I had BITD was retro-fitted with Rev. C after I sent it back for repair while still in warranty. Took the wankers 3 weeks..... the job was done by "Geveke Electronics" which apparently did service work for Atari over here. (as a side-note, I have a huge Fluke 9100 set of test-equipment which used to be owned by Geveke).

 

I had so many unexplainable crashes while typing in listings. I knew nothing about "Rev B or Rev.C etc."I just thought the machine was bad somehow. I did get that information when I picked up the machine from the store, there was an A4 with what they had done to fix it. I probably only half-understood the info, it was so early in my computing days....everything was new..........Regretfully I never looked inside because today I wonder if it was a ROM or EPROM they put in...

 

Today I couldn't care less what's in there....who still uses plain Atari Basic when there's Turbo Basic XL

[+tf_hh]

I also saw the PBI rubberfoam in a chelco 1983 800XL - says rev A 2 on the PCB. The foam is on both sides. It also has a ground header for a jumper wire to the cart port on the top case instead of springy wires that press on the shield for ground.

 

Yes, these Chelco labeled 800XL I´ve also seen a few times (PAL and NTSC ones). But no 600XL with rubberfoam until today.

[+tf_hh]

Nice!

 

Would you be willing to post a pic of the underside label, where the serial number is?

There may also be an assembly date stamped there (I hope).

I think your unit was probably made in Taiwan, looking forward to finding out. (Most 600XLs were made in Hong Kong.)

 

The 600XL mainboard is already on it´s way back to the owner, but there´s no serial number or any other marking then the one I pictured already. I got only the bare mainboard, no case.

[+tf_hh]

I had a PAL 600XL with Rev. C BASIC. The previous owner was someone I'd known from the local users' group, and he had had it upgraded from Rev. B by either Peat's (Dublin's main Atari dealer and service centre) or Atari UK. Which one it was, I don't recall.

Chances are that there's a handful of PAL XLs out there like this, but when it comes to PCB differences I can't really comment - it's been decades since I saw the guts of a 600XL.

 

Of course some Atari dealer exchanges the Basic to a "C" one. But then, the chip already was in a socket (easy) or they remove the old one and solder a new one in (I hope with socket, but...).

 

Anyway, this mainboard has - except the solderjob by it´s owner - no manually solder handling. All pads of OS-ROM, BASIC-ROM etc. are done by a solder bath, not any hand soldering. So it´s like the factory does.

[+hunmanik]

 

The 600XL mainboard is already on it´s way back to the owner, but there´s no serial number or any other marking then the one I pictured already. I got only the bare mainboard, no case.

 

I see. Perhaps, the owner might be willing to supply a pic of the underside label of the case for this unit? It would still be really helpful (well, interesting to me) to be able to mate the insides of this unit with the information that would be on the serial number label. It would tell us where it was made/assembled (Hong Kong by Chelco, Hong Kong by Atari-Wong, or Atari Taiwan), and probably also the date of assembly/manufacture. Guessing those particulars from the insides is, as far as I can tell, still a bit speculative.

[Rybags]

Agreed, probably Tramiel cheapskatery.

 

Though by the mid 80s chip yields were much better so it might have been cheaper overall to save the few bucks per unit by deleting sockets and put up with the extra labour cost of pulling failed units and desoldering the faulty ICs.

[+x=usr(1536)]

 

Of course some Atari dealer exchanges the Basic to a "C" one. But then, the chip already was in a socket (easy) or they remove the old one and solder a new one in (I hope with socket, but...).

 

Anyway, this mainboard has - except the solderjob by it´s owner - no manually solder handling. All pads of OS-ROM, BASIC-ROM etc. are done by a solder bath, not any hand soldering. So it´s like the factory does.

 

Understood, and agreed. The main reason I brought it up was to suggest that it may be possible to have a socketed 600XL with a Rev. C BASIC that was originally a Rev. B. Depending on dates of manufacture, it may be difficult to distinguish from a factory Rev. B that was upgraded in the field to Rev. C vs. one that was originally Rev. C from the factory.

 

That said, without getting a definite determination on when socketed vs. soldered PCBs were introduced in relation to Rev. C's release, there's pretty much no good way of putting a definite production run (or date) to that change.

[SS]

So there's a really clean looking NTSC 600XL up on eBay right now. I was surprised to see that the back label reads "Made in Taiwan" because I didn't realize that any 600XLs were manufactured outside of Hong Kong. I wonder if this board might contain some soldered chips too?

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Atari-600XL-Vintage-Home-Computer-Gaming-System-Console-VERY-CLEAN/192909925156

 

..

Edited May 8, 2019 by SS

[+kheller2]

So there's a really clean looking NTSC 600XL up on eBay right now. I was surprised to see that the back label reads "Made in Taiwan" because I didn't realize that any 600XLs were manufactured outside of Hong Kong. I wonder if this board might contain some soldered chips too?

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Atari-600XL-Vintage-Home-Computer-Gaming-System-Console-VERY-CLEAN/192909925156

 

..

 

 

What is interesting about this unit, besides the guy holding it with gloves, is the bottom sticker with a 1995 week 29 date. Oh, it gets better. That sticker is over top of an original sticker with a date of week 45 of 1983.

[Sugarland]

On 5/8/2019 at 8:50 PM, kheller2 said:

 

 

What is interesting about this unit, besides the guy holding it with gloves, is the bottom sticker with a 1995 week 29 date. Oh, it gets better. That sticker is over top of an original sticker with a date of week 45 of 1983.

I believe that sticker should be read as the 29th week of '85. Maybe it's a refurbish/return product and Atari re-stickered it.

Edited August 5, 2019 by Sugarland