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R.Cade

NanoPEB, PEB, DM, EB, EA. Is running programs on the TI *really* this hard?

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I have a small Ti99/4a collection to play with. I used to have a PEB, but sold it to another enthusiast and got a NanoPEB instead.

 

However, I still have the same problem. Why does disk management and loading programs have to be this hard? I mean, I have experience with most of the other classic platforms and the TI is by far the hardest to use.

 

I really need separate Disk Manager II, Extended BASIC, and Editor Assembler carts to use it?

 

There is seriously no way to get a disk catalog from BASIC or Editor Assembler carts? I have to catalog a disk with Disk Manager, and actually write it down to turn off the computer, put in another cart, then boot it?

 

How can you know how to boot a given disk?

 

99% of the time I play with it for a while, get nothing but I/O errors from either typos (my fault, but the keyboard is tough to type on) or not knowing which option to use to load the program, then give up. Only occasionally can I get something to boot and run...

 

Has nobody made a menu system for this so that everything can be easily loaded?

 

</rant off>

 

:)

 

Edited by R.Cade

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With as little as Extended BASIC, and an XB loader for DM2K you can do a directory of your disks and in many cases even use DM2K to load a program.

It's not hard with the right programs, hell if I can do it anyone can! ;)

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Here is a catalog program that runs in TI Basic, so it does not matter what cartridge you have plugged in:

100 CALL CLEAR
110 DIM TYPE$(5)
120 TYPE$(1)="DIS/FIX"
130 TYPE$(2)="DIS/VAR"
140 TYPE$(3)="INT/FIX"
150 TYPE$(4)="INT/VAR"
160 TYPE$(5)="PROGRAM"
170 INPUT "MASTER DISK(1-3)? ":A
180 A=INT(A)
190 IF A<1 THEN 170
200 IF A>3 THEN 170
210 OPEN #1:"DSK"&STR$(A)&".",INPUT,RELATIVE,INTERNAL
220 INPUT #1:A$,J,J,K
230 DISPLAY "DSK";STR$(A);" - DISKNAME= ";A$:"AVAILABLE=";K;"USED=";J-K
240 DISPLAY:"FILENAME SIZE TYPE P":"-------- ---- ---- -";
250 FOR LOOP=1 TO 127
260 INPUT #1:A$,A,J,K
270 IF LEN(A$)=0 THEN 350
280 DISPLAY:A$;TAB(12);J;TAB(17);TYPE$(ABS(A));
290 IF ABS(A)=5 THEN 320
300 B$=" "&STR$(K)
310 DISPLAY SEG$(B$,LEN(B$)-2,3);
320 IF A>0 THEN 340
330 DISPLAY TAB(28);"Y";
340 NEXT LOOP
350 CLOSE #1 

...lee

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Between XB 2.7, HDX server and a NanoPEB, I find navigating, transferring and running programs pretty efficient and quick. Workflow looks something like this, starting from wherever (with XB 2.7 almost always in the cart slot)

 

- Fctn+ to exit to XB 2.7 main menu

- "U" to enter CFHDX to grab files from a connected share

- "HDX1",Enter,Fctn2 to select any files to copy,Fctn6,C,Fctn+ to return to main menu

- "1","2" or "3" if I want to check the contents of the disk I'd been copying files to.

- Usually "A" to go back into XB itself.

- "OLD DSK#.WHATEVER" to load desired program

 

So it's zero cart swaps or disk swaps, and about 30 seconds, to copy some files, and make use of them, for me, usually. Even noting every single keystroke, it doesn't look like much. And the workflow's going to be pretty much the same whether they're going to be loaded in XB or EA. I don't feel like that's a big ordeal. But the XB 2.7 cart has a lot to do with that.

Edited by pixelpedant

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Programs like BOOT and Funnelweb address this in different ways. My CF7+ (similar to nanopeb) is set up to load the BOOt program (which is a menu-style launcher) and from there I could run Funnelweb or disk manager or other programs. It also catalogs disks and lets you execute most programs from there.

 

Once you start using a few of the more advanced programs that have been written, you will probably come up with your own way of doing things.

 

I don't have access to my files right now but I know people here are using the programs or variations thereof.

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I think what you're witnessing is the hodgepodge nature of the TI, and the fact that it was abandoned by TI before anyone had come up with a cohesive BASIC with DOS built-in that could also run EA5 programs. It all seems to have been doable, it just didn't get done originally for cost/time cutting reasons, and later because TI had pretty well abandoned the platform because … of cost reasons. :)

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Thanks very much, I will have to seek out and try the BOOT program. I am away for the weekend now, but will try some of this next week.

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With the XB2.7 suite (cartridge) you have access to almost everything.... transfer programs, 3 different disk managers, games, Extended BASIC, Editor Assembler.... It almost never leaves my cartridge slot (unless I'm doing stuff with my GRAM Kracker)

 

It is easily the most important piece of my TI system.

 

With the FinalGROM cartridge, you can have every standard cart ever made on an SD card and just plug it in. Easy money.

 

 

If you have specific questions on how to accomplish certain tasks, many of us would be happy to help you out. We all started where you are right now. :)

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Programs like BOOT...

 

 

With the XB2.7 suite (cartridge) you have access to almost everything....

 

With the FinalGROM cartridge, you can have every standard cart ever made on an SD card and just plug it in. Easy money.

 

 

Both Tim and Owen have good suggestions for you. If you are using a standard non-F18A Ti, BOOT is a GREAT menu loader. It works fantastic with XB2.7s as shown in the video below. Of course now days I recommend the FinalGROM to everyone... why mess with different cartridges or buy separate ones for more money?

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQQR93oQeH0

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I never had a PEB (or tape drive) back in the day, so I am not familiar with all of the different ways to run programs either. When I got my NanoPEB I remember going through some of the same frustration.

 

The Nano has a built in disk manager that may or may not do what you want. The manual is attached.

 

All you need is Extended Basic, and to have the correct disk mounted as DSK1. If this is the case when you select XB from the boot menu, the Nano's DM will run. You should see something like what is in the attached screenshots.

 

You can get a disk catalog, or run some programs. I don't know if it will do everything needed, but you can certainly give it a shot.

 

In any case, I'm more of a cart guy so I don't mess around with disks too much. In this respect the Finalgrom has really been my menu system.

cfmgr.pdf

post-47499-0-05781500-1529717312.jpg

post-47499-0-53237500-1529717502.jpg

post-47499-0-32193900-1529717748.jpg

Edited by chue
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I was able to get CFMGR to boot from the first disk image on the NanoPEB, and got some things to run successfully using just that and the XB cartridge (original, not 2.7).

Thanks everyone- I wish it still were easier. It's still a two-step process to catalog the disk, remember the name, then go back to the menu to run an EA image and type the volume number and the name.

 

Will BOOT let me browse the files and just run them from the menu?

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I have a small Ti99/4a collection to play with. I used to have a PEB, but sold it to another enthusiast and got a NanoPEB instead.

 

However, I still have the same problem. Why does disk management and loading programs have to be this hard? I mean, I have experience with most of the other classic platforms and the TI is by far the hardest to use.

 

I really need separate Disk Manager II, Extended BASIC, and Editor Assembler carts to use it?

 

There is seriously no way to get a disk catalog from BASIC or Editor Assembler carts? I have to catalog a disk with Disk Manager, and actually write it down to turn off the computer, put in another cart, then boot it?

 

How can you know how to boot a given disk?

 

99% of the time I play with it for a while, get nothing but I/O errors from either typos (my fault, but the keyboard is tough to type on) or not knowing which option to use to load the program, then give up. Only occasionally can I get something to boot and run...

 

Has nobody made a menu system for this so that everything can be easily loaded?

 

</rant off>

 

:)

 

 

 

 

You know, RXB was talking about making some new system GROMs... we could built in a CATALOG program into one and at least give it that parity of using the command in intermediate mode.

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Speaking of RXB Rich can probably talk better about the functionality but as I recall RXB has some kind of disk menu. It also has DIR built in:

CALL DIR("DSK1.")
Edited by chue
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I was able to get CFMGR to boot from the first disk image on the NanoPEB, and got some things to run successfully using just that and the XB cartridge (original, not 2.7).

Thanks everyone- I wish it still were easier. It's still a two-step process to catalog the disk, remember the name, then go back to the menu to run an EA image and type the volume number and the name.

 

Will BOOT let me browse the files and just run them from the menu?

 

Depends on the storage format.

 

Yes.

 

Yes if it's a diskette, but if IIRC it chokes on FIAD directories like those on the Rpi or HDX.

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Yes if it's a diskette, but if IIRC it chokes on FIAD directories like those on the Rpi or HDX.

True, but in this case the OP is asking questions about nanoPEB hardware. No sense getting into even more complications at this stage, IMHO.

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Speaking of RXB Rich can probably talk better about the functionality but as I recall RXB has some kind of disk menu. It also has DIR built in:

CALL DIR("DSK1.")

RXB and REA can both catalog Hard Drive Directories.

 

REA does a much better job as I added many more features to LOAD & RUN, EA PROGRAMS and XB or Basic.

 

Also REA can Set up Assembler or Editor or Print files.

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With the XB2.7 suite (cartridge) you have access to almost everything.... transfer programs, 3 different disk managers, games, Extended BASIC, Editor Assembler.... It almost never leaves my cartridge slot (unless I'm doing stuff with my GRAM Kracker)

 

It is easily the most important piece of my TI system.

 

With the FinalGROM cartridge, you can have every standard cart ever made on an SD card and just plug it in. Easy money.

 

 

If you have specific questions on how to accomplish certain tasks, many of us would be happy to help you out. We all started where you are right now. :)

EXCEPT TF1.2

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I have a small Ti99/4a collection to play with. I used to have a PEB, but sold it to another enthusiast and got a NanoPEB instead.

 

However, I still have the same problem. Why does disk management and loading programs have to be this hard? I mean, I have experience with most of the other classic platforms and the TI is by far the hardest to use.

 

I really need separate Disk Manager II, Extended BASIC, and Editor Assembler carts to use it?

 

There is seriously no way to get a disk catalog from BASIC or Editor Assembler carts? I have to catalog a disk with Disk Manager, and actually write it down to turn off the computer, put in another cart, then boot it?

 

How can you know how to boot a given disk?

 

99% of the time I play with it for a while, get nothing but I/O errors from either typos (my fault, but the keyboard is tough to type on) or not knowing which option to use to load the program, then give up. Only occasionally can I get something to boot and run...

 

Has nobody made a menu system for this so that everything can be easily loaded?

 

</rant off>

 

:)

 

 

Your rant is fully justified. Even with all the newer utility carts and programs currently available, the TI is a bitch to use beyond Basic/XB and a tape drive. And that is why we are so enamored with it! There is a very geeky pleasure in bending this cantankerous machine to your will, and in time you will come to appreciate it. Just look at Omega's enthusiastic posts and you'll know what I mean :D

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Either an XB cartridge or an EA cartridge and F'WEB will load about anything you want and provides full disk utilities. If you combine it with a MENU(BOOT) program you can load just about anything you want with a single keypress once you type in the filename.

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