Consoles that make owning other consoles redunant

[adamchevy]

Not so sure a Xegs can replace the 5200 Trak Ball Games. Also, some of the 5200 homebrews are pretty nice.

[Reaperman]

Ever since that NT Mini came around, I haven't played an 8-bit game on anything else, and all desires to fix my colecovision's power switch, or recap the game gears, have left my body. I doubt I'll play most of the systems it handles ever again. It's just so much easier.

 

Of course before they were rendered obsolete by NT Mini, I considered my GBC as rendering my GB obsolete (though the backlight mod kind of changed that) and the 7800 rendered the 2600 obsolete enough for government work. Especially once I got the supercharger working on my version.

[derFunkenstein]

I "liked" that post because it's interesting, but I don't think you're correct about the commercial appeal of the N64. It has aged poorly and its innovations have been improved upon by everything that's come along since. I wouldn't mind seeing better emulation though!

 

The N64 games that I care about (mostly first party) are generally emulated pretty well already. It's the controller that bugs me.

[Punisher5.0]

 

The N64 is a system that has become more popular over time. In retro gaming circles, it is a very popular system. It certainly doesn't bear much comparison to the 3DO because, although it was a commercial failure by Nintendo standards, it was still a very mainstream system. In 1998, you either had an N64 or a PS1. The Sega Saturn was history and the 3DO was some weird thing from the early 90s that no one knew anything about.

I wouldnt consider 32 million sold a failure by any stretch. It definitely made Nintendo a lot of money.

[VectorGamer]

 

I don't have the expansion module #1. When you plug it in can you use the Atari controllers with Colecovision games or do they just work when you are playing Atari?

 

Exp mod 1 has it's own controller ports

[+GoldenWheels]

 

The N64 games that I care about (mostly first party) are generally emulated pretty well already. It's the controller that bugs me.

I've learned so many timing intensive games with the weird freakin thing I can't even try to use other controllers and be any good. It's like trying to use a fork when you usually use chopsticks. Too different. I like the Retro Fighter controller I have ok, but I never use it for vs play (WCW Revenge) when I want to win. Gotta have the old funky N64 real deal...

[derFunkenstein]

I've learned so many timing intensive games with the weird freakin thing I can't even try to use other controllers and be any good. It's like trying to use a fork when you usually use chopsticks. Too different. I like the Retro Fighter controller I have ok, but I never use it for vs play (WCW Revenge) when I want to win. Gotta have the old funky N64 real deal...

Fortunately for me I never got any good at any N64 games. We played four-player Goldeneye in college, but it was License to Kill and power weapons. For a while we had a no-Oddjob but once we started throwing rockets, that midget didn't stand a chance! :lol:

[NE146]

People forget the Xbox 1 when hacked (easily) had pretty decent console emulation going for most major systems. So if that's an option.....

[DJ Clae]

Genesis doesn't support SMS/Mark III FM sound. Adding in a substitute isn't replacing it any more than a PC replaces everything because of emulation.

 

A Mark III SMS is the be-all 8-bit Sega console, as it supports the entire SMS library and plays SG-1000 games with a variant palette.

 

Agreed except it won't suppord the 3D glasses.

[derFunkenstein]

People forget the Xbox 1 when hacked (easily) had pretty decent console emulation going for most major systems. So if that's an option.....

Yeah it does all the 8-bit and 16-bit consoles with ease, and the front ends for its emulators (once you turn off the obnoxious music) are all pretty good. I've tried PSOne emulation on the system and found it to be slow and choppy, though.

[BassGuitari]

What are consoles that (in your opinion) make owning other similar consoles of the era (or current) redundant? Here is my take on a few:

 

-Having and XEGS makes the 5200 redundant. Both A8 computers that have been consolized, XEGS has more power and access to a larger library.

Gotta disagree here. The Atari 5200's analog control greatly enhances the games that make use of it, and having the second fire button, start/pause/reset/ and keypad/option keys all in one controller is a huge improvement. Why people prefer having one button and having to look down and reach for a key on a computer keyboard for everything else is beyond me. Additionally, contrary to popular belief, many 5200 games are not carbon copies of the 400/800 versions, however similar they may sometimes look. And the XEGS doesn't have a 2600 adapter or the 5200 Trak-Ball.

 

XEGS has more power? Huh? It has Missile Command and BASIC in ROM, and more RAM. That's it. Performance-wise, they're essentially identical.

 

What the XEGS does make redundant is the 400/800, 600/800XL, and 65XE. Although even then--at least in the case of the 65XE--it's really the XEGS that's redundant since there would have been no practical reason to have bought one if you already had an older A8 (unless it was a stock 16K 400 or 600XL). It brought nothing new to that table except a detachable keyboard.

 

 

[+GoldenWheels]

Gotta disagree here. The Atari 5200's analog control greatly enhances the games that make use of it, and having the second fire button, start/pause/reset/ and keypad/option keys all in one controller is a huge improvement. Why people prefer having one button and having to look down and reach for a key on a computer keyboard for everything else is beyond me. Additionally, contrary to popular belief, many 5200 games are not carbon copies of the 400/800 versions, however similar they may sometimes look. And the XEGS doesn't have a 2600 adapter or the 5200 Trak-Ball.

 

XEGS has more power? Huh? It has Missile Command and BASIC in ROM, and more RAM. That's it. Performance-wise, they're essentially identical.

 

What the XEGS does make redundant is the 400/800, 600/800XL, and 65XE. Although even then--at least in the case of the 65XE--it's really the XEGS that's redundant since there would have been no practical reason to have bought one if you already had an older A8 (unless it was a stock 16K 400 or 600XL). It brought nothing new to that table except a detachable keyboard.

 

 

I'd also take the 5200 over the XE (I prefer consoles to computers, natch) but making a positive case for it based on the controller is a bold gambit Guitari!

 

You can say one thing about the standard one-button Atari sticks...they're damn reliable....

[BassGuitari]

I'd also take the 5200 over the XE (I prefer consoles to computers, natch) but making a positive case for it based on the controller is a bold gambit Guitari!

 

You can say one thing about the standard one-button Atari sticks...they're damn reliable....

*shrugs*

 

Controversial, maybe, but it's not bold at all if you think about it. I've played a lot of Defender, Galaxian, Choplifter, River Raid, Star Raiders, and others on both the 5200 and XE (or 800 or 600XL or whatever), and the 5200 versions are so much more playable. Unless the 5200 controller is faulty (more on that in a sec), it makes zero sense to me how any other conclusion could be reached.

 

IMO any computer game (mainly talking about Atari and Commodore here, although the CoCo comes to mind as well) that makes use of the keyboard for secondary functions, or uses the keyboard for basically everything except movement and primary fire/action, should just be played entirely on the keyboard instead of effectively making you use two different controllers at once (joy + key). The 5200 solves this problem by putting everything in the palm of your hand.

 

The caveat of course being that, yes, Atari 5200 controllers universally require repair, which isn't that hard to do. However, properly repaired/upgraded controllers are usually quite reliable--the DIY tin foil method has held up for me for years. (For best results, make sure you have a good Rev. 9 flex circuit and a high-profile joystick boot.)

 

And the popularity of aftermarket and third-party joysticks and custom controllers indicates that a great many people do not agree about the reliability of the CX40. (My experience has been that they're just fine, though.)

[+GoldenWheels]

*shrugs*

 

Controversial, maybe, but it's not bold at all if you think about it. I've played a lot of Defender, Galaxian, Choplifter, River Raid, Star Raiders, and others on both the 5200 and XE (or 800 or 600XL or whatever), and the 5200 versions are so much more playable. Unless the 5200 controller is faulty (more on that in a sec), it makes zero sense to me how any other conclusion could be reached.

 

IMO any computer game (mainly talking about Atari and Commodore here, although the CoCo comes to mind as well) that makes use of the keyboard for secondary functions, or uses the keyboard for basically everything except movement and primary fire/action, should just be played entirely on the keyboard instead of effectively making you use two different controllers at once (joy + key). The 5200 solves this problem by putting everything in the palm of your hand.

 

The caveat of course being that, yes, Atari 5200 controllers universally require repair, which isn't that hard to do. However, properly repaired/upgraded controllers are usually quite reliable--the DIY tin foil method has held up for me for years. (For best results, make sure you have a good Rev. 9 flex circuit and a high-profile joystick boot.)

 

And the popularity of aftermarket and third-party joysticks and custom controllers indicates that a great many people do not agree about the reliability of the CX40. (My experience has been that they're just fine, though.)

 

I've repaired my fair share of 5200 controller flex circuits (in fact every one I've had that didn't become a parts unit, which would be 5 total repairs) and the problem is basically every 5200 controller you come across is going to need it. And even when in working order, I've never been a fan of the claw grip style you have to use on them and 7800 controllers. Just not comfortable for me. I use my competition pro whenever I can (all the non analog games) for the 5200.

 

Now, that there were a lot of aftermarket controllers for one of the most popular systems ever doesn't really mean the CX 40 wasn't reliable, it means an incredibly popular platform gave third party companies lots of chances to make stuff to try and make money. Sure the 40s break too, but compared to 5200 controllers? They're indestructible tanks! (also have a MUCH better button than the 5200 squishy bits IMO, wish there was an aftermarket button replacement option for those)

[BassGuitari]

Now, that there were a lot of aftermarket controllers for one of the most popular systems ever doesn't really mean the CX 40 wasn't reliable, it means an incredibly popular platform gave third party companies lots of chances to make stuff to try and make money. Sure the 40s break too, but compared to 5200 controllers? They're indestructible tanks! (also have a MUCH better button than the 5200 squishy bits IMO, wish there was an aftermarket button replacement option for those)

I'm not talking about the fact that so many third-party controllers exist; that's obviously a byproduct of the popularity of the Atari (VCS and 400/800) and Commodore systems. I'm talking about the fact that people generally seem to prefer them. Especially Europeans--extoll the virtues of the CX40 to them and they act like you're brain damaged.

 

FWIW I've never heard of anything on a 5200 controller literally breaking, which I unfortunately can't say for the internal rings or dome switches in some of the CX40s I've come across. Yeah, you will have to fix up 5200 controllers when you first get them. It's a fact of life with the system. But if you do it right you should only have to do it once.

 

But we digress, here. To reiterate my original point: the 5200 is not pointless if you have an XEGS. (IMO.)

[mr_me]

The a5200 controllers are not claw grip style. Unlike the a7800, both action buttons are on the same side with the 5200.

[+GoldenWheels]

The a5200 controllers are not claw grip style. Unlike the a7800, both action buttons are on the same side with the 5200.

Do you NOT still hold it the same way as a 7800 controller? If not, how do you hold it? That you don't need your index for the button doesn't mean you don't still need to hold the controller in a claw like fashion, grabbing the entire body from below....which is a pretty crappy design IMO.

[mr_me]

No you hold it differently. Since you don't have to work buttons with both your thumb and finger, like a claw on the a7800, you are free to grip the controller however you want.

Edited August 27, 2018 by mr_me

[+GoldenWheels]

No you hold it differently. Since you don't have to work buttons with both your thumb and finger, like a claw on the a7800, you are free to grip the controller however you want.

Again....HOW do you actually grip the controller differently? You still need to hold the base to use the controller. I don't see any other way to grip the controller regardless of needing the button on the other side. Are you holding it between your knees or something?

[adamchevy]

I’ve never had a console that made the previous one totally redundant. Technologically for sure, but aesthetically I can’t see it. The GameCube is a much better looking console than the Wii imo. Ofcourse it’s all preference when it comes to looks. I also would love a 7800 in a Sears Heavy Sixer body. The cartridge slot alone would make it worth it.

[English Invader]

I’ve never had a console that made the previous one totally redundant. Technologically for sure, but aesthetically I can’t see it. The GameCube is a much better looking console than the Wii imo. Ofcourse it’s all preference when it comes to looks. I also would love a 7800 in a Sears Heavy Sixer body. The cartridge slot alone would make it worth it.

 

It's not just aesthetics. It's the whole experience. I know I would miss the GameCube start-up screen if I jacked it in for a Wii and, although it wasn't a factor at first, there came a time when I forgot what the original Playstation start-up screen was like and I ended up getting a PS1 to play the games I was already able to play on my PS2 because I wanted the original experience. Same deal with the original Gameboy; got tired of the GBC/GBA colour-enhanced display and longed to play Gameboy games as they were originally released.

[high voltage]

Atari VCS 2600 makes every other console redundant, just because it is so

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

 

-Having A Genesis or SNES makes owning a TG-16 redundant. Most of the best 16 bit titles went to those two systems.

 

 

NONONONONONONONONONO!!!

 

While I agree with many of your other points, TG-16/PCe is absolutely NOT redundant. Some of the best 2D scrolling shooters ever made were released for the platform. Blazing Lazers is bar none the best classic SHMUP in existence IMO, and exclusive to Turbografx. Then you have the Bonk Series, Alien/Devil Crush pinball, Legendary Axe.

 

As a TG-16 owner, if you want the ultimate 16-bit experience, you absolutely need to own all three consoles. That said, PC Engine is much cheaper to collect for than a Turbografx, and aside from adventure/rpg games, most don't require reading. OR get a Turbo Everdrive. It's worth it considering the cost of some Hucard games.

[Punisher5.0]

 

As a TG-16 owner, if you want the ultimate 16-bit experience, you absolutely need to own all three consoles. That said, PC Engine is much cheaper to collect for than a Turbografx, and aside from adventure/rpg games, most don't require reading. OR get a Turbo Everdrive. It's worth it considering the cost of some Hucard games.

What about the AES? All four are fantastic machines that stood the test of time. They all compliment eachother too. What an amazing generation that was

[Eltigro]

I love the fact that the TurboGrafx one is the one that seems to be getting most people riled up. lol