Jump to content
Geister

1050, is that an "ICD" in your socket or are you "Happy" to see me?

Recommended Posts

Hello all, I bought a 1050 drive from a nearby vendor that knew nothing about the drive. When I took it apart to service it, the shielding was still in place, so I assumed it was a stock drive.

Because my original 1050 had an ICD chip i wanted to find a way to bump this drive up to true double density and high speed I/O so I eventually bought a Happy board from Atarimax.

 

A couple nights ago, I opened the unit to install the Happy board, and following the instructions, I removed the shielding, and that's when I saw the double-height chip with the letters "ICD" on top.

 

So, now the question is, should I go ahead and install the Happy board and remove the ICD Doubler, or just leave the Doubler in place and move on? I suppose I could buy another 1050 unit and install the Happy board in that...

 

I'm not really concerned about the other features of the Happy board, I'm not going to be duplicating copy protected disks, so I'd probably just use it in ICD emulation. Are there any reasons to use the Happy 1050 over the Doubler?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can you post a picture of your ICD chips? If its an ORIGINAL mask ROM of the US Doubler (not the double-high chip, which is the RAM pack), I would be very interested in getting a ROM dump of it from you, to verify definitively the 'authentic original' code. (Or borrowing it from you to do so).

 

The main benefit of the Happy board for general use is the track buffering for both reads and writes. It helps standard speed SIO a decent amount (no latency between sector reads from same track) but really flies when reading/writing with ultraspeed SIO mode, for any disk, and not just the ones formatted with a special skew using the US Doubler, which can only buffer 1 sector at a time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When the US Doubler was installed, the original 6810 chip (128bytes RAM) would have been removed, and replaced with the ICD pack, which is basically 2 stacked 6810's inside.

 

If you want to change it to the Happy board, the RAM socket still needs to be populated. the ICD module can technically stay if you don't have a replacement 6810 chip, but I'm guessing it may not fit under the happy board... You may be best off waiting for a new drive for the happy, unless you acquire a replacement 6810 chip from elsewhere. (ie eBay)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's good information! I had assumed that the double height chip was the whole deal. So the ROM next to it is also part of the ICD package? I did not know that. Probably because my original US Doubler was of questionable heritage. I have been looking at EPROM burners as something I wanted to get eventually. I could then dump the ROM for you.

 

Unless you live in the Lehigh Valley or relatively close by, I'd feel a bit nervous about loaning the chip...especially since I don't have the original chips to put the drive back into service if the post office decides to mail the ROM to Malaysia.

 

Anybody have any recommendations for a cheap and compatible EPROM burner?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's good information! I had assumed that the double height chip was the whole deal. So the ROM next to it is also part of the ICD package? I did not know that. Probably because my original US Doubler was of questionable heritage. I have been looking at EPROM burners as something I wanted to get eventually. I could then dump the ROM for you.

 

Unless you live in the Lehigh Valley or relatively close by, I'd feel a bit nervous about loaning the chip...especially since I don't have the original chips to put the drive back into service if the post office decides to mail the ROM to Malaysia.

 

Anybody have any recommendations for a cheap and compatible EPROM burner?

TL866 for burning.

 

Can we get a pic of your chips?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In the attached picture, the green circle is the ROM, red circle is the RAM. between the two is the 6507 CPU. The Happy upgrade requires removal of the ROM and CPU, and the happy gets inserted into the CPU socket.

 

Also thinking, depending whether your USD ROM is a mask ROM or EPROM, a mask ROM might not be directly readable in a programmer... the white jumper configuration above the ROM socket will answer that. (pic please!)

 

The TL866 programmer is cheap and compatible with 27C32's (that the 1050 is compatible with) and larger. The cheapest I see on eBay currently is about $44 + $2.45 shipping to US. It doesn't include all the extra adapters for TSOP's and stuff, not needed for most vintage EPROMs: eg: https://www.ebay.com/itm/232365295662/

post-53052-0-04208000-1537315001.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The next time I take it apart I'll remember to snap a picture.

 

I was just searching for 6810 chips and found a pin ball place that sells them for $7.50 ea. That's some expensive ram! Imagine getting a megabyte of that. Fortunately, Jameco electronics sells them for $3.50, $2.75 if you buy a hundred.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The one circled in green had a sticker, so unless it was just on there as promotional information, I'm thinking it's a EPROM.

 

I'll have to see what's on offer on Amazon. I don't buy off Fleabay...unless they're selling a new-in-box 1450XLD & expansion box.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the picture! very clean installation. The markings on the mask ROM indicate production date Nov '86.

 

The jumper configuration behind the ROM socket are in the mask ROM configuration:

JP 1/3 open for EPROM
JP 2/4 open for mask ROM

 

so.... It can't be read by simply dropping it into an EPROM programmer set to 2732 mode since the pinout is slightly different... It will need some re-wiring or an adapter to map the pins to 2732 configuration. Maybe it can be dropped into an 8K Atari cart PCB and dumped that way. I can test this method with a stock 1050 ROM to see if that works.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mine looks like his. I couldn’t get the damn ram pack to stay in the stock socket, so I had to unsolder the socket and install another one. Almost ruined it when I did the removal . Lifted some Traces. Seems to fit snug and works.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mine looks like his. I couldn’t get the damn ram pack to stay in the stock socket, so I had to unsolder the socket and install another one. Almost ruined it when I did the removal . Lifted some Traces. Seems to fit snug and works.

If you cut the plastic socket frame and remove it the pins can be desoldered/removed individually, much less risk of damaging pads/traces.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It works! ... or "How to dump a 2332/2532 ROM using a BASIC cart PCB" :)

 

I successfully dumped a 1050's Tandon mask ROM using an Atari BASIC cart PCB. Geister or tjlaser, you should be able to use this method to dump that US Doubler mask ROM, save it to an ATR and upload it here!

 

I cracked open a BASIC cart, and was grateful to see that the PCB was already socketed. I took out the 2 4KB mask ROM's, and replaced it with a single Tandon 4K mask ROM in 1 of the sockets:

post-53052-0-81106800-1537514579_thumb.jpg

 

Then plug it into the 800XL, and boot up a DOS 2 or 2.5 disk (or ATR even better, since saving the file to it is automatically on the PC then). Choose option "L. Binary Save" - then type filename,Start,End addresses eg "B000BFFF,B000,BFFF"

post-53052-0-13061600-1537514594_thumb.jpg

 

Then you should find a 4KB file on the disk, using 33 sectors. Then save your ATR, and upload here for me to further process, which is to strip header bytes to get just the 4096 data bytes.

 

If you have a hex editor, or the DUMP command in SpartaDOS X, you should see the string "3241" in the first few bytes of the file. This is the Drive # ID mappings. A similar string is present at the beginning the US Doubler ROM.

post-53052-0-70996500-1537514601_thumb.jpg

 

If yours is confirmed to be the same, next it would be interesting to find earlier dated versions, ie 84... Since the "L" marking implies a prior version may have existed that didn't support the 2797 controller...

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It works! ... or "How to dump a 2332/2532 ROM using a BASIC cart PCB" :)

 

I successfully dumped a 1050's Tandon mask ROM using an Atari BASIC cart PCB. Geister or tjlaser, you should be able to use this method to dump that US Doubler mask ROM, save it to an ATR and upload it here!

 

I cracked open a BASIC cart, and was grateful to see that the PCB was already socketed. I took out the 2 4KB mask ROM's, and replaced it with a single Tandon 4K mask ROM in 1 of the sockets:

attachicon.gifcart.jpg

 

Then plug it into the 800XL, and boot up a DOS 2 or 2.5 disk (or ATR even better, since saving the file to it is automatically on the PC then). Choose option "L. Binary Save" - then type filename,Start,End addresses eg "B000BFFF,B000,BFFF"

 

 

 

If yours is confirmed to be the same, next it would be interesting to find earlier dated versions, ie 84... Since the "L" marking implies a prior version may have existed that didn't support the 2797 controller...

 

 

So is the ROM version L?

I have a ROM from 85, but has just about the exact same marking as yours.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I only have my B&C EPROM to reference at this time, which has no version designation other than © 1985.

 

I would like to get a dump of Geister or tjlaser's mask ROM's to confirm the "L" 85/86 ROM. I posted the cart PCB dump method to assist them in hopes they can, since an eprom programmer can't do it.

 

I would also like to get a dump of your EPROM, which has a prominent "L" on it.

 

Then we can see if they are all the same or not.

 

Also, does anyone have an original US Doubler ROM with © 1984 on it? (May be different!)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I only have my B&C EPROM to reference at this time, which has no version designation other than © 1985.

I would like to get a dump of Geister or tjlaser's mask ROM's to confirm the "L" 85/86 ROM. I posted the cart PCB dump method to assist them in hopes they can, since an eprom programmer can't do it.

I would also like to get a dump of your EPROM, which has a prominent "L" on it.

Then we can see if they are all the same or not.

Also, does anyone have an original US Doubler ROM with © 1984 on it? (May be different!)

Confused I am. Your post states you dumped a masked rom with the cart method. I’m asking about that rom. And you have a copy of my eprom labeled L.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Confused I am. Your post states you dumped a masked rom with the cart method. Im asking about that rom. And you have a copy of my eprom labeled L.

Oh, sorry, I see! I don't have a USD mask ROM (only EPROM) so I only used a stock 1050 mask ROM to simulate the procedure, verifying that method works because I had never done it that way before myself. So, someone who does have a USD mask ROM and a basic or other 8K cart can repeat the process.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In theory, any old 4K/8K brown cart PCB will do the job, hopefully socketed as in my picture. I'm guessing a 16KB PCB won't work, and at least the few 16KB ones I've cracked open are not socketed either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh, sorry, I see! I don't have a USD mask ROM (only EPROM) so I only used a stock 1050 mask ROM to simulate the procedure, verifying that method works because I had never done it that way before myself. So, someone who does have a USD mask ROM and a basic or other 8K cart can repeat the process.

Oh I see now too. LOL. I was curious if the masked Tandon ROM is L and there were no later versions, in addition to the ICD masked version which we dont know what it is yet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh I see now too. LOL. I was curious if the masked Tandon ROM is L and there were no later versions, in addition to the ICD masked version which we dont know what it is yet.

Yes, the chip pictured was indeed a rev "L" stock ROM. not sure if the "L" at the end of the printed part no.'s is indicative. (Probably) L is the latest 'known' ROM for Tandon mechs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ICD marked "L" on kheller2's ©85 USD EPROM with 2797 support as well. That's why I'm now curious if an earlier, ©84 for instance, labelled ICD ROM exists that might only support the 2793.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...