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tep392

New Donkey Kong PK batch

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They were $40 last time I checked.  When did they drop to $20.  That changes things.  

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As I've posted elsewhere, the creator of PokeyONE is an acquaintance of mine. He's a local arcade guy and designed this specifically to replicate the aspects of POKEY most essential to arcade operators - e.g., DIP-40 form factor; 5V DC compatibility; absolutely perfect RNG emulation (needed for some arcade boards to function); and sound so close I can't see a difference on a scope at audible frequencies even with super-sampling the sound. More importantly, it's a device available in whatever quantity an arcade operator needs at a basically fixed price - which cannot be said for vintage POKEY chips. Yes, Brad will sell you one from Best for cheaper. But just that one. If you need to restore a dozen old Atari arcade cabs in a year, good luck with that. 

 

However, that DIP-40 form factor really drives up the cost. In an ideal world, we'd be able to get a POKEY implementation on FPGA directly integrated into the game cart PCB and machine assembled at the fab house, and some enterprising homebrew publisher would buy a few hundred of this putative new design at a time.

 

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I’m down to one shrink wrapped Ballblazer myself and I won’t have any problem if/when it comes time to rip its guts out. 

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4 minutes ago, sramirez2008 said:

I’m down to one shrink wrapped Ballblazer myself. 

 

I am not. :evil:

 

 

IMG-7051.JPG

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That small board isn't very expensive, so putting all the parts directly on a cart won't save much.  The key to reducing cost is sourcing and volume.   Source the parts/assembly in China or some other low cost country and build in volumes high enough to move down the curve.  

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1 minute ago, tep392 said:

That small board isn't very expensive, so putting all the parts directly on a cart won't save much. 

It's not the board that's the driver - the DIP-40 form factor drives some of the assembly requirements, including a bunch of hand soldering. That could be avoided with a full SMD/machine assembled design. That in turn would allow higher volumes, etc. 

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1 minute ago, CPUWIZ said:

Has anyone tested the P-ONE on my board, in multiple systems?

I'd be able to test my PokeyONE in one of your boards on both my 7800's. 

 

If I had one of your boards ... 😛 

 

(I kid - I know there are guys like Perry and Al who have PokeyONE chips and more 7800 variants than my two :) ). 

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9 minutes ago, DrVenkman said:

It's not the board that's the driver - the DIP-40 form factor drives some of the assembly requirements, including a bunch of hand soldering. That could be avoided with a full SMD/machine assembled design. That in turn would allow higher volumes, etc. 

I haven't priced them, but I would be shocked if the board plus DIP-40 header assembled is more than $5.  I don't know this guys cost and profit, so can't guess how much cost reduction opportunity there is.  I just don't think the board is the big driver.

 

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3 minutes ago, DrVenkman said:

I'd be able to test my PokeyONE in one of your boards on both my 7800's. 

 

If I had one of your boards ... 😛 

 

(I kid - I know there are guys like Perry and Al who have PokeyONE chips and more 7800 variants than my two :) ). 

 

All POKEY homebrews use it, so you can rip one of those open, aside from Perry's, they should all be socketed. :P

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40 is not all that much. Need the Xm and done.. how many thousand Bblazers died in the last 10 years..

Edited by Jinks
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4 minutes ago, tep392 said:

I haven't priced them, but I would be shocked if the board plus DIP-40 header assembled is more than $5. 

He's doing the hand-soldering himself. And he has a day-job so that's part of the retail price (not parts/raw materials) calculus. I don't begrudge anyone their time or what it's worth - I've found that out myself in the last few months building 5200 analog thumbstick controllers; I built 54 of them myself for retail sale. At about 120 individual solder joints per board, that shit gets old quick. :) 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, CPUWIZ said:

 

All POKEY homebrews use it, so you can rip one of those open, aside from Perry's, they should all be socketed. :P

You want me to rip open my Bentley Bear or Donkey Kong PK to test a PokeyONE? Dude ... I'd feel like I was shooting a puppy if I damaged the label to get to the screw. :(

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14 minutes ago, CPUWIZ said:

 

All POKEY homebrews use it, so you can rip one of those open, aside from Perry's, they should all be socketed. :P

I didn't socket my game because I know that no one would every want to rip it open. ;)

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8 minutes ago, DrVenkman said:

He's doing the hand-soldering himself. And he has a day-job so that's part of the retail price (not parts/raw materials) calculus. I don't begrudge anyone their time or what it's worth - I've found that out myself in the last few months building 5200 analog thumbstick controllers; I built 54 of them myself for retail sale. At about 120 individual solder joints per board, that shit gets old quick. :) 

 

 

He of course has every right to charge whatever he wants.  $40 would seem fair if he is hand soldering in small batches.  If it was me, I wouldn't have jumped right in with high volume Chinese production either.  I would want to get them into as many hands as possible to make sure every bug was squashed.  I might also want to expand capabilities so would want all features implemented before pulling the trigger.

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7 minutes ago, tep392 said:

I didn't socket my game because I know that no one would every want to rip it open. ;)

 

We socket them, because if the game fails, you can still pull the POKEY.  ;)

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5 minutes ago, CPUWIZ said:

 

We socket them, because if the game fails, you can still pull the POKEY.  ;)

I've built hundreds of copies and everyone has worked 1st try.  None have been returned or have notified me of a failure.  I always have my trusty Hakko if needed. :)

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That is great to hear, which confirms, why my new device will work on all systems.  I have never heard of a single failure with a VersaBoard.

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2 minutes ago, CPUWIZ said:

That is great to hear, which confirms, why my new device will work on all systems.  I have never heard of a single failure with a VersaBoard.

The sign of an excellent design and designer. 

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On 6/20/2019 at 6:54 PM, Trebor said:

Correct...but...

...this won't work. 

 

The largest POKEY sound supported ROM size is 128K (I.E. Commando) under the CC2.  Donkey Kong PK (and Bentley Bear's Crystal Quest) are 144K with POKEY.   I believe technically, if one was to rebuild/recompile the source files for the CC2, support could be added.  Lack of resources have resulted in this not happening.

 

Regardless, attached are both the NTSC and PAL respective demo bin files.

Donkey Kong PK-XM (NTSC) (Demo) (v1.2) (20130905).bin 144 kB · 18 downloads Donkey Kong PK-XM (PAL) (Demo) (v1.2) (20130905).bin 144 kB · 12 downloads

I'm super excited to say that these files (confirmed with the NTSC file) now play perfectly with POKEY sound on my CC2. Mitch released some CC2 banking files last week here.

 

Here is my text configuration entry:

 

7800:    Donkey Kong XM    DKXM78    144RPK    78QUICK 

 

Thanks to all involved!

 

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