masschamber Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 for the colecovision 2600, intelliision etc. Even the nes and master system I am completely fine with hdmi. The place where the lack of composite and crts is the 16 bit era in which art makes good use of crt blurring to get the desired art. anyway plan to back soon, just waiting on a few things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 The 59.94 vs 60 framerate issue is, as reaperman explained, a very specific use case. That is compatibility with a specific video capture device. It does not affect everyone else. Correct me if I'm wrong but all displays with hdmi/dvi input should support both frame rates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPR Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 The 59.94 vs 60 framerate issue is, as reaperman explained, a very specific use case. That is compatibility with a specific video capture device. Precisely why I called it out. When part of someone's "dealbreaker" is such a specific issue that they basically saying "I'm considering not supporting this item unless it caters to MY VERY SPECIFIC NEED" I just personally find that unrealistic and unfair to the developers. And while yes, Reaperman's post was generally very fair, that one thing just seemed a little unrealistic, which is why I added it to my response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaperman Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) If the difference of one tenth of a frame is honestly a "dealbreaker" after everything else you listed in your post, after all the other photos and videos that have been shared, after all the other positive features the system has, then maybe the console isn't for you. I would seriously hope that isn't the case, but you have to see why I would question such a statement. I'm leaning toward that conclusion as well, sadly. I think it's a great system for a great many people, but my post was intended more as a 'this is why it can't work for me, sorry' post, than a demand for change. I've been debating the un-backing for a while, and it's not a great feeling, especially given the state of the campaign. (hopefully PRGE turns things around) looks like I'm late with some response here. The reason I care about 60hz vs 59.9x (so it's actually more like a few hundreths of a frame ), is that I need pure 60 to record videos with the device--it won't sync to anything else, blackscreen-only. It's not a bad device (avermedia lgp2), it's just that it's for recording the HDMI of current systems, and isn't retro-friendly. 60 is vastly more common on HDMI, which my device loves to record, but 59.9x is more accurate to old tvs/consoles. As far as I understand, all of the kevtris cores solve this by slightly adjusting the clock of the system. HDMI supports both, as do TV's--there isn't an issue getting my tv to sync. If I had to guess, phoenix is probably pure 60 based on your monitor displaying 640x480x60 at startup--assuming it displays 59.9x on other things. As for the resolution itself, it doesn't integer scale into 1080, so my hardware would have to do some time-consuming lifting that it generally fails miserably at. It was built to do 720p to 1080p well, but 640x480 is doubtful. Noticeable lag on my set is why I even have the framemeister--you don't exactly get legacy upscaing stats on a set before you buy one. Truthfully I'm not sure the framemeister can upscale hdmi either--those inputs are as likely to just be passthrough, and the manual's in japanese (naturally). I do think that some mention of the current resolution should be made on the kickstarter, as it seems a little dishonest not to do so. I asked over there but had to come here/youtube for my answer. People could assume as I did that it's probably an HD signal with integer scaling to fill as much screen as is reasonable. Edited October 20, 2018 by Reaperman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gametrog Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 First post on AA, popped on just to marvel out-loud and the number of pompous hand-wringers on here. Good luck with the system, helped as much as I could currently. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPR Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 You know what an OCD is, right? Imagine Adrian Monk playing with a CollectorVision Phoenix, pausing the game he's currently playing, approaching his face close to the large TV screen and squinting and obsessing over how the pixels are not perfectly square, or about this little bit of vertical anti-aliasing on the 56th scanline which he struggles to find an explanation for. It's funny when you watch Monk do it, because he's a fictional character. But such people actually exist in real life, Robb. They bitch and complain about screen resolutions, automatic scaling (which every stinking modern TV does differently anyway) and every little screen artifact their eye catches as they're playing. This is a textbook example of an Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) I wouldn't be surprised if the lag from scaling either 480p or 720p in most televisions with 1080p native resolution is similar. Neither one is integer scaling. Edited October 20, 2018 by mr_me 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SegaSnatcher Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 I wouldn't be surprised if the lag from scaling either 480p or 720p in most televisions with 1080p native resolution is similar. Neither one is integer scaling. 720p definitely scales better on my 1080p Plasma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swami Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 720p definitely scales better on my 1080p Plasma. ...and over and over... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaperman Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Imagine Adrian Monk playing with a CollectorVision Phoenix, pausing the game he's currently playing, approaching his face close to the large TV screen and squinting and obsessing over how the pixels are not perfectly square Oh, don't you even get me started on how wrong square pixels are. PAR, or pixel aspe... Fine, I'll own up to this, but it doesn't mean I'm wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 We have been making a considerable effort through the ColecoVision Fan Facebook page and the ColecoVision Lunatics Group. Oddly enough, the response has been far more positive and less critical than what we are seeing on AtariAge. I'm not sure if the culture here is just more "nitpicky" or if the members on the Facebook pages are more die-hard (assuming yes considering the groups in question) but sadly the biggest hurdle seems to be the more "casual" retro gamer who keeps throwing out Chameleon and Mike Kennedy comments without even watching the videos or bothering to do a shred of research to see that this has nothing to do with that disaster at all. I was personally also unaware that so many people seem to have negative feelings towards Kickstarter. That actually took me by surprise. If this doesn't fund, I do wonder if CollectorVision will have better luck just doing a traditional pre-order? Facebook has a surprising number of quality hobbyists that frequent it. I noticed this for Apple II things. A lot of people are wising up to the risks involved with kickstarter. And kickstarter has clouds of amateurism blowing over it. I would never back anything. And I rarely pre-order anything either. I prefer buying things retail after I've talked with owners of the item and after there's unbiased/unpaid commentary for me to read. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPR Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Has anyone reported the kind of interest and reception the Phoenix is getting so far at PRGE? I would imagine this weekend has the potential to really up the pledges a bunch. Brian just sent me some pics from the show to post as he's crazy busy showing off the console. Says it's going well and there's been a lot of really positive interest! This is "Matt" of "Matt Patrol" fame playing on the CollectorVision Phoenix: Here is the Kickstarter link so everyone can stop what they are doing right now and go help fund the project: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1408938247/collectorvision-phoenix-an-fpga-colecovision-conso/ 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikrananka Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) Ooh I like the blue and red shell on that Phoenix prototype. Wow - and that's Matt Householder - fantastic to see a picture of him playing the Phoenix. He did an awesome job for Atarisoft with the Moon Patrol port for the CV. Edited October 20, 2018 by Ikrananka 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Can't get any more real than that. They have a working model in action. And a unit opened up for inspection. And a pile of carts. No hidden wires. It's pretty much out of Mike Kennedy's league. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_me Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 720p definitely scales better on my 1080p Plasma. Are you talking about picture quality, lag/latency, movies or games. The retrotink-2x only outputs 480p; it gets excellent reviews without complaints about resolution. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikrananka Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) Are you talking about picture quality, lag/latency, movies or games. The retrotink-2x only outputs 480p; it gets excellent reviews without complaints about resolution. Now that's a damn good point. If it's good enough for the RetroTink then.......it sure as hell is good enough for the Phoenix. Edited October 20, 2018 by Ikrananka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaperman Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Can't get any more real than that. They have a working model in action. And a unit opened up for inspection. And a pile of carts. No hidden wires. It's pretty much out of Mike Kennedy's league. Yeah, but I think we're going to need some more pix of that red one to, uh, validate that's it's real. ...real sexy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killersquirel Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Brian just sent me some pics from the show to post as he's crazy busy showing off the console. Says it's going well and there's been a lot of really positive interest! 44410772_258540781512727_6560022641481089024_n.jpg 44496504_321562945321662_4268934245088493568_n.jpg This is "Matt" of "Matt Patrol" fame playing on the CollectorVision Phoenix: 44425153_319516235526322_7169896955152171008_n.jpg Here is the Kickstarter link so everyone can stop what they are doing right now and go help fund the project: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1408938247/collectorvision-phoenix-an-fpga-colecovision-conso/ Which games are being played in the pictures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 Yeah, but I think we're going to need some more pix of that red one to, uh, validate that's it's real. ...real sexy... Maybe they'll need to call in a technician to verify it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariLeaf Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 The reason I care about 60hz vs 59.9x (so it's actually more like a few hundreths of a frame ), is that I need pure 60 to record videos with the device Correct me if I'm wrong please, but are you thinking of backing out because you can't make youtube videos with the Phoenix or is there another reason you need to capture footage? If it's a youtube thing, just film the tv. In a case like that it's perfectly acceptable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SegaSnatcher Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) ...and over and over... I simply told him my experience with my setup. This is just general, isn't specific to just Phoenix. Acknowledging that not all TVs scale the same is important. Some do certain resolutions better than others. Edited October 20, 2018 by SegaSnatcher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 .... validate that's it's real. Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zetastrike Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 I hope whatever new controller they cook up is modeled on that NTT Data pad. Also that red and blue shell is gorgeous. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J727AZ using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retroillucid Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 WTF did happened here!!??..... Geez.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SegaSnatcher Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 (edited) Are you talking about picture quality, lag/latency, movies or games. The retrotink-2x only outputs 480p; it gets excellent reviews without complaints about resolution. PQ in video games. Also, Retrotink 2x is a $100 product that converts and scales the analog output of multiple systems. Its definitely very versatile in that regard. Edited October 20, 2018 by SegaSnatcher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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