Dropcheck Posted March 14, 2019 Author Share Posted March 14, 2019 I have the drive set to drive 2, when I attempt to format drive two, the drive spins up and appears to be trying to perform an action and I get an error 144. But what is the disk drive itself set for. Most PC 3.5 disk drives are set for Drive 1 on the drive pcb itself. They have to be set for Drive 0. If you are lucky the disk drive has actual jumpers, Otherwise you will have to locate the null resistor, desolder it and move it to the correct location to make the drive believe it is now Drive 0. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manterola Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 We are talking about this kind of drive selection: in the floppy 3.5 mechanism it self, not the Atari drive selection. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hueyjones70 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 Why would I want it to be drive 0,I don't have any 3.5 diskettes that are bootable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 (edited) the internal drive select is for the controller board, the external select if for the Atari sio ID. they are two different critters Edited March 14, 2019 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropcheck Posted March 14, 2019 Author Share Posted March 14, 2019 (edited) Why would I want it to be drive 0,I don't have any 3.5 diskettes that are bootable? The drive id on the 3.5" disk drive itself has nothing to do with the Atari. Remember you are trying to connect a circuit that was designed for the PC world to a different computing system. Without going too much into ancient history of PC floppy drives and their standardization all 3.5" drives made in recent times are by default set at Drive 1. In order for the Atari to see that drive it has to be set as Drive 0. What is the make and model of 3.5" floppy drive you are using? Edited March 14, 2019 by Dropcheck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hueyjones70 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 This drive has a 4 position switch on the side that shows a 0 on one end and a 3 on the other. I would suspect that it could be assigned as drive 1-4 or 0-3. When I place the switch in position 0 and set the Atari switch to drive 1. The drive attempts to boot and says BOOT?err16 on the screen. If I set the Atari switch to drive2, and a 5.25 drive as drive 1 when I attempt to read the directory or to format the disk, I get a few slow beeps for several seconds and then error 144. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hueyjones70 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 If the switch on the 3.5 is set to anything other that zero, the drive does not respond at all and the disk never spins up and the light does not come on except briefly at power on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mathy Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 Hello hueyjones40 Not sure if it helps, but there is only one MOTOR ON signal on the flat cable that connects a standard floppy drive (3.5" or 5.25") to the hardware controlling it. Meaning the motor probably spins if any of the four possible drive numbers is selected by the controlling hardware. Sincerely Mathy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 (edited) okay this is becoming a muddle.... so lets' try this... when you set another complete 1050 or whatever to SIO drive 1, and the other complete new board drive set as SIO drive 2, you are saying it's interfering with the first drive? if that is the case you need to double check your handy work on the new board drive... one drive per controller board. small steps... Edited March 15, 2019 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+kheller2 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 This drive has a 4 position switch on the side that shows a 0 on one end and a 3 on the other. I would suspect that it could be assigned as drive 1-4 or 0-3. When I place the switch in position 0 and set the Atari switch to drive 1. The drive attempts to boot and says BOOT?err16 on the screen. If I set the Atari switch to drive2, and a 5.25 drive as drive 1 when I attempt to read the directory or to format the disk, I get a few slow beeps for several seconds and then error 144. What DOS are you booting the 5.25 from? You won’t be able to read anything off the 3.5 until it’s properly formatted (and I worry a bit if that floppy was formatted in a HD drive). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hueyjones70 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 When the 1050 is drive 1 and the 3.5 is drive 2,the 1050 works perfectly. I boot MYDOS 4.3 then I try to read the directory of D2. The 3.5 spins makes some slow beeps as if the drive is trying to read a disk. After several seconds I get ERROR 144. The same thing happens when I attempt to format D2. I am not using a new board, I wanted to make sure I had a good 3.5 before I tried it on a new board. Tomorrow I plan to open up my PC and see if there is a way to hook up a 3.5. If so I could maybe test the 3.5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 (edited) ??? what pcb are you using with the 3.5 and what rom? please share the make and model of the 3.5 inch drive... it should be a 720k and below drive not a 1.414 drive Edited March 15, 2019 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropcheck Posted March 15, 2019 Author Share Posted March 15, 2019 If the switch on the 3.5 is set to anything other that zero, the drive does not respond at all and the disk never spins up and the light does not come on except briefly at power on. This is exactly what we are saying. The 3.5 needs to be on zero. Now we may have multiple problems here. We need to start eliminating variables. If you can let's first start with a back step. If you have an good XF551 compatible 5.25 disk drive and can connect it to the 'new' XF551 board. Change out the eprom as well. See if it works normally. If it does then the pcb is good. If not then the problem is with the pcb. Let us know what happens. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 ??? what pcb are you using with the 3.5 and what rom? please share the make and model of the 3.5 inch drive... it should be a 720k and below drive not a 1.414 drive Some 1.44MB 3.5" mechanisms will work with the XF551. When I purchased a CSS 3.5" mod for the XF551(early 90's) it came with a Sony 1.44MB mechanism that works when used with 720KB 3.5" discs, the ones that do not have the extra hole indicating HD. It is also supposed to be possible to use 1.44MB media by wiping them with a bulk eraser and covering/plugging the HD sensor hole(or other method of disabling HD media recognition). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mathy Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 Hello Bill I tried using 1.44 MB disks on a 720 drive. No luck. Not sure if it looked like it worked and then didn't or if it was a no-go from the get go, but it just didn't work. Sincerely Mathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillC Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 (edited) Hello Bill I tried using 1.44 MB disks on a 720 drive. No luck. Not sure if it looked like it worked and then didn't or if it was a no-go from the get go, but it just didn't work. Sincerely Mathy According to an article I found 1.44MB media needs to be demagnetized by a bulk eraser before they can be formatted at 720KB. Depending on the age of the mechanism density can also be set either 720KB or 1.44MB by switch/jumper, or automatically by the HD sensor. Later 3.5" mechanisms may also have dropped support for 720KB media as a cost cutting measure, eliminating the sensor for HD media recognition and configuring the mechanism to operate only in HD mode. I did say my 1.44MB Sony mechanism is from the early 90's. In IBM-compatible PCs, the three densities of 3 1⁄2-inch floppy disks are backwards-compatible: higher density drives can read, write and format lower density media. It is also possible to format a disk at a lower density than it was intended for, but only if the disk is first thoroughly demagnetized with a bulk eraser, as the high density format is magnetically stronger and will prevent the disk from working in lower density modes. Edited March 18, 2019 by BillC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 Some 1.44MB 3.5" mechanisms will work with the XF551. When I purchased a CSS 3.5" mod for the XF551(early 90's) it came with a Sony 1.44MB mechanism that works when used with 720KB 3.5" discs, the ones that do not have the extra hole indicating HD. It is also supposed to be possible to use 1.44MB media by wiping them with a bulk eraser and covering/plugging the HD sensor hole(or other method of disabling HD media recognition). very true... but for practical purposes when troubleshooting a problem- let's stick with what most folks can get up and running without pulling their hair out. We can go for the gold ring after it works with the standard stuff. One less thing to deal with so to speak. (Sounds like a post we've made previously about bulk erasing etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gozar Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 It is also supposed to be possible to use 1.44MB media by wiping them with a bulk eraser and covering/plugging the HD sensor hole(or other method of disabling HD media recognition). Yeah, don't do that. 1.44MB disks have a different coating than 720KB disks, and will be very unreliable as a 720KB disk. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+kheller2 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 Yeah, don't do that. 1.44MB disks have a different coating than 720KB disks, and will be very unreliable as a 720KB disk. Wouldn't you also run into similar issues that 1.2 vs 360 5.25 disks have with the RW head power and track width? All this reminds me of the evil I went through with 2.88 3.5" floppy drives... EVIL!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hueyjones70 Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 I finally finished one of the bare boards. It almost works perfectly. I can only get it to work as drive 1 or drive 2. When I first tested it, it would only work as drive 1 so I must have a bad selector switch or a bad solder joint on the selector switch installation. Going to have to look at it with a magnifying glass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hueyjones70 Posted April 3, 2019 Share Posted April 3, 2019 (edited) This is my cardedge adapter. Edited April 3, 2019 by hueyjones70 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1050 Posted April 4, 2019 Share Posted April 4, 2019 I see an issue with 2nd picture. Even row in the back is bottom row but if you'll look at a drive, the bottom row is odd. This one has been put together wrong or could have been made where the back row was the odd one. It can be fixed by unsoldering the IDE socket and mounting it from the other side of the board. Can you follow that? It has to make sense to you in other words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hueyjones70 Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 That could explain some things. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hueyjones70 Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 Are the 74LS38N and 74LS14N compatible with the 74LS38P and 74LS14P? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1050 Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 Yes, generally speaking. Final proof will be the datasheet by the maker of the chip which often has his logo on it for that determination. And probably not worth the effort of even looking for those. Once you have the datasheet for both and do some scouring you often learn that they are the exactly the same. P means plastic case in one and N means the same thing in other house of manufacture. Perhaps - I didn't look myself. Same basic number is the same chip across the board usually - but there is always that 1% chance that there is a devil in the details. A sense of humor eh? And I can assume you still have some hair left unpulled? Well done. What it doesn't explain is how the drive responded at ALL. You tell me how that happened and we'll both know. But I can spot a left handed shovel every time and that one right there just ain't right. It has another row. If they had placed the higher cost IDE 90 degree jack that has the extra length to reach the same spot that this one connects to the drive with, it would work perfect. So they cheaped out with the short jack while they made the board backwards with the wrong jack pinout at the far end to use the cheap part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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