Why some CF cards work unreliable on Ataris

[ParanoidLittleMan]

All it is not new problem, and I attached CF card to my Atari ST with IDE port back in 2004. That was 128 MB Sandisk card. In that time not many manufacturers made CF cards, or Flash cards generally. SD cards even did not exist then.

 

There was first ATbus standard for IDE disks - as we call them now, but that name came later. It was basically MFM/RLL disk with controller moved from computer motherboard or disk controller card to hard disk. Integrated Drive Electronic. Even basic command set (CHS type) is same as for MFM . IDE became popular because lower price than SCSI, so it was normal that even Atari Falcon was equipped with IDE port. But it was done in 1992, so about 10 years before any CF cards. IDE developed, and became ATA, with complete new addressing modes, now transfer modes (DMA, UDMA) . And bus timings changed too. And later is the key of problem.

 

 

From this page: http://atari.8bitchip.info/astideTP.html

And here I must say that some people used this my pic. where I self drew lower part, without crediting it.

 

Why Sandisk is generally best CF card for oldies ? Because they use better timing than others. Kingston is not bad normally, but I have 1 GB card what is just not good for Falcon. With Sandisk success rate is still 100% . Of course, this stays for most of diverse IDE adapters used in retro computers, since they go to CPU bus, so timing is similar to ST bus timing.

 

All this is a bit obsolete now - CF cards are not popular anymore, and may be cheaper to get IDE-SD adapter + SD card than CF card. That worked fine for me in Falcon, and with IDE adapter in STE. It still prevents not some people to discuss about this, without some even decent knowledge level about subject, over many posts. Talking about driver SW influence. No any driver SW can correct bad timing in HW. There will be errors, mostly write errors if card timing is not OK with adapter/retro computer timing.

But this is where Atari community is now.

[vattari]

Interesting write up Petar. It pinpoints why so many people do have luck with Sandisk and not with other brands. I’ve had some people state that SD isn’t reliable either but like you, I’ve had not problem with them in my Falcon and STE via IDE-SD adapters (not to mention, I used them via UltraSatan, Satandisk and SCSI2SD adapters as well).

 

Has it been suggested by some people that your driver was at fault for some CF issues?

 

 

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[ParanoidLittleMan]

Interesting write up Petar. It pinpoints why so many people do have luck with Sandisk and not with other brands. I’ve had some people state that SD isn’t reliable either but like you, I’ve had not problem with them in my Falcon and STE via IDE-SD adapters (not to mention, I used them via UltraSatan, Satandisk and SCSI2SD adapters as well).

 

Has it been suggested by some people that your driver was at fault for some CF issues?

 

 

I did not see that someone blamed my driver SW for this problems. But was many times talk that should try with some other driver in case of problems. The real problem is that there is people, moderators on some forums which have big ego and low knowledge, and they really don't care for what are facts, for going little deeper in problem. No, all what they like is to be 'winner' in some discussion.

 

To add, that I saw some 12 years ago, on Sandisk WEBpage diagram and description of their timings, and that was little different. Too bad I did not save it. Because page is removed. The reason for sure is CFA association - ATA DOCs for CF cards are not public anymore - you need to pay for them. That diagram above, upper part is from some old ATA specs, around 2008, when it was public and free. Should we wonder that now, for instance using HDMI connector in your commercial HW project needs that you pay for it to HDMI association or whatever is it's name ?