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New Dragon Ethernet cartridge interest check

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Interesting - is http://atariage.com/forums/topic/287376-preannouncement-dragon-cart-iia different deal all-together?

 

Yes. The Dragon Cart II will be realized as a PBI (XL series) and ECI (XE series) card. A few months ago ol.sc starts to talk with me about the idea of a Dragon Cart II, the first attempt was also realized as a cartridge. My personal suggestion was not to make another cartridge solution due the following reasons:

 

IMHO the main success for an Ethernet solutions rely on two worktypes: Multiplayer-Gaming and Internet communication. For gaming most users today uses Flashcards for the games. Or the game itself will be on a cart. When the Ethernet-interface would also be realized as a catridge, at last you´ve to "stack" the carts - not a very nice thing. Will raise the costs of production, more instable, and maybe the registers used on both carts will interfere with eachother. Also some external SDX solutions with not fully decoded address areas may not work fully with another solution acquiring the narrow $D5xx address range.

 

A PBI or ECI device can be managed at the whole addressbuss, can mirror memory, can switch off partial address ranges and more. This would be more compatible, configurable and better in physical handling.

 

I´m pretty sure, both solutions have their fans. And it should be no problem, as the same Ethernet SoC is used, new developed software should support both.

 

Just my 2 cents, of course.

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And it should be no problem, as the same Ethernet SoC is used, new developed software should support both.

 

My understanding is that this thread is about a CS8900A based (cartridge) device, while the Dragon Cart II is about a W5100 based (PBI/ECI) device.

 

According to my understanding is thread is about functionality-wise a Dragon Cart clone with the single addition to allow to move the 16 CS8900A registers inside the $D5 page via DIP switch. However, the network programs/libraries provided by me so far don't support the CS8900A on addresses different from $D500-$D50F.

 

Regards,

Oliver

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My understanding is that this thread is about a CS8900A based (cartridge) device, while the Dragon Cart II is about a W5100 based (PBI/ECI) device.

 

My understanding is that this not compatible to the original DragonCart since it uses the W5100 chip. But in cartridge format.

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Added myself to the list.

1. davidcalgary29 - 1 cart
2. xrbrevin - 1 cart
3. skriegel - 2 carts
4. Marius - 2 carts
5. brenski - 1 cart
6. AtariSociety - 1 cart
7. Mathy - 2 carts
8. Haightc - 1 cart
9. Markk - 1 cart
10. Sleepy - 2 carts
11. Nezgar - 1 cart
12. Gunstar - 1 cart
13. Chaosfaktor - 1 cart
14. Wadeford - 1 cart
15. sanny - 1 cart
16. DNA128k - 1 cart
17. Senor Rossie - 3 carts
18. KlasO - 2 carts
19. NML32 - 1 cart
20. CharlieChaplin - 1 cart.
21. slx - 1 cart
22. David_P - 1 cart
23. Rainier - 1 cart
24. AtariPortal - 2 carts
25. patjomki - 1 cart
26. Allan - 1 cart
27. Toddtmw 1 cart
28. TheNameOfTheGame 1 cart
29. adam242 1 cart
30. Stephen - 1 Cart
31. Jinroh - 1 Cart
32. Philsan - 1 Cart
33. Lastic - 1 Cart
34. invisible kid - 1 cart
35. gozar- 1 Cart
36. pixelmischief - 1 cart
37. BigBen - 1 cart
38. Brentarian - 1 cart
39. Ransom - 1 cart
40. TemplarXB - 1 cart
41. tuf - 1 cart
42. mariusz - 1 cart

43. Mr Robot - 1 cart

44. Firedawg - 1 cart

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My understanding is that this not compatible to the original DragonCart since it uses the W5100 chip. But in cartridge format.

 

Yes, you (and tf_hh) are right. Sorry for the noise.

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I was totally sold by the fact that is going to be PBI ...

"Shut up and take my money!!!"

1. davidcalgary29 - 1 cart
2. xrbrevin - 1 cart
3. skriegel - 2 carts
4. Marius - 2 carts
5. brenski - 1 cart
6. AtariSociety - 1 cart
7. Mathy - 2 carts
8. Haightc - 1 cart
9. Markk - 1 cart
10. Sleepy - 2 carts
11. Nezgar - 1 cart
12. Gunstar - 1 cart
13. Chaosfaktor - 1 cart
14. Wadeford - 1 cart
15. sanny - 1 cart
16. DNA128k - 1 cart
17. Senor Rossie - 3 carts
18. KlasO - 2 carts
19. NML32 - 1 cart
20. CharlieChaplin - 1 cart.
21. slx - 1 cart
22. David_P - 1 cart
23. Rainier - 1 cart
24. AtariPortal - 2 carts
25. patjomki - 1 cart
26. Allan - 1 cart
27. Toddtmw 1 cart
28. TheNameOfTheGame 1 cart
29. adam242 1 cart
30. Stephen - 1 Cart
31. Jinroh - 1 Cart
32. Philsan - 1 Cart
33. Lastic - 1 Cart
34. invisible kid - 1 cart
35. gozar- 1 Cart
36. pixelmischief - 1 cart
37. BigBen - 1 cart
38. Brentarian - 1 cart
39. Ransom - 1 cart
40. TemplarXB - 1 cart
41. tuf - 1 cart
42. mariusz - 1 cart

43. Mr Robot - 1 cart

44. Firedawg - 1 cart

45. manterola - 1 cart

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I was totally sold by the fact that is going to be PBI ...

"Shut up and take my money!!!"

This one is a cart product, the other one is a PBI device, they both use the same chip so hopefully software will be compatible with both.

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ok, so now I am confused....So the "dragon cart II" is not the same as the "new dragon ethernet cartridge"...? If that's the case I should erase my name from the list.. right?

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This one is a cart product, the other one is a PBI device, they both use the same chip so hopefully software will be compatible with both.

 

I don't see software supporting both devices implicitly. Rather it needs to be explicitly implemented to do so.

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So the "dragon cart II" is not the same as the "new dragon ethernet cartridge"...?

 

You are right. Two different things.

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Ok... Sorry for the confusion. I have deleted my name, so the #45 is open.

1. davidcalgary29 - 1 cart
2. xrbrevin - 1 cart
3. skriegel - 2 carts
4. Marius - 2 carts
5. brenski - 1 cart
6. AtariSociety - 1 cart
7. Mathy - 2 carts
8. Haightc - 1 cart
9. Markk - 1 cart
10. Sleepy - 2 carts
11. Nezgar - 1 cart
12. Gunstar - 1 cart
13. Chaosfaktor - 1 cart
14. Wadeford - 1 cart
15. sanny - 1 cart
16. DNA128k - 1 cart
17. Senor Rossie - 3 carts
18. KlasO - 2 carts
19. NML32 - 1 cart
20. CharlieChaplin - 1 cart.
21. slx - 1 cart
22. David_P - 1 cart
23. Rainier - 1 cart
24. AtariPortal - 2 carts
25. patjomki - 1 cart
26. Allan - 1 cart
27. Toddtmw 1 cart
28. TheNameOfTheGame 1 cart
29. adam242 1 cart
30. Stephen - 1 Cart
31. Jinroh - 1 Cart
32. Philsan - 1 Cart
33. Lastic - 1 Cart
34. invisible kid - 1 cart
35. gozar- 1 Cart
36. pixelmischief - 1 cart
37. BigBen - 1 cart
38. Brentarian - 1 cart
39. Ransom - 1 cart
40. TemplarXB - 1 cart
41. tuf - 1 cart
42. mariusz - 1 cart

43. Mr Robot - 1 cart

44. Firedawg - 1 cart

45.

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Yeah - after seeing the new PBI solution (and I already have an original Dragon), I'd like to remove myself from the list too (#30). Sorry - it was just bad timing on here.

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#MeToo. Sorry!

 

1. davidcalgary29 - 1 cart
2. xrbrevin - 1 cart
3. skriegel - 2 carts
4. Marius - 2 carts
5. brenski - 1 cart
6. AtariSociety - 1 cart
7. Mathy - 2 carts
8. Haightc - 1 cart
9. Markk - 1 cart
10. Sleepy - 2 carts
11. Nezgar - 1 cart
12. Gunstar - 1 cart
13. Chaosfaktor - 1 cart
14. Wadeford - 1 cart
15. sanny - 1 cart
16. DNA128k - 1 cart
17. Senor Rossie - 3 carts
18. KlasO - 2 carts
19. NML32 - 1 cart
20. CharlieChaplin - 1 cart.
21. slx - 1 cart
22. David_P - 1 cart
23. Rainier - 1 cart
24. AtariPortal - 2 carts
25. patjomki - 1 cart
26. Allan - 1 cart
27. Toddtmw 1 cart
28. TheNameOfTheGame 1 cart
29. adam242 1 cart
30.
31. Jinroh - 1 Cart
32. Philsan - 1 Cart
33. Lastic - 1 Cart
34. invisible kid - 1 cart
35. gozar- 1 Cart
36. pixelmischief - 1 cart
37. BigBen - 1 cart
38. Brentarian - 1 cart
39. Ransom - 1 cart
40. TemplarXB - 1 cart
41. tuf - 1 cart
42. mariusz - 1 cart
43.
44. Firedawg - 1 cart
45.

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I hate to do this also, but PBI is what I wanted in the first place.

 

1. davidcalgary29 - 1 cart
2. xrbrevin - 1 cart
3. skriegel - 2 carts
4. Marius - 2 carts
5. brenski - 1 cart
6. AtariSociety - 1 cart
7. Mathy - 2 carts
8. Haightc - 1 cart
9. Markk - 1 cart
10. Sleepy - 2 carts
11. Nezgar - 1 cart
12. Gunstar - 1 cart
13. Chaosfaktor - 1 cart
14. Wadeford - 1 cart
15. sanny - 1 cart
16. DNA128k - 1 cart
17. Senor Rossie - 3 carts
18. KlasO - 2 carts
19. NML32 - 1 cart
20. CharlieChaplin - 1 cart.
21. slx - 1 cart
22. David_P - 1 cart
23. Rainier - 1 cart
24. AtariPortal - 2 carts
25. patjomki - 1 cart
26. Allan - 1 cart
27. Toddtmw 1 cart
28. TheNameOfTheGame 1 cart
29. adam242 1 cart
30.
31. Jinroh - 1 Cart
32. Philsan - 1 Cart
33. Lastic - 1 Cart
34. invisible kid - 1 cart
35. gozar- 1 Cart
36. pixelmischief - 1 cart
37. BigBen - 1 cart
38.
39. Ransom - 1 cart
40. TemplarXB - 1 cart
41. tuf - 1 cart
42. mariusz - 1 cart
43.
44. Firedawg - 1 cart
45.

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I'm going to be in the "one of each to go along with my original DragonCart" camp.

 

(In other words, keep me on the list)

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As the CEO of a former company where I was said, "we do both". So best to get both variants, cartridge and PBI version :-)

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Now I'm confused. There's two dragoncarts now? Which one is better if I have a SIDE2 cart installed?

 

Unless you've got some way to have more than one cart installed at a time, you'll need the PBI/ECI version.

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Unless you've got some way to have more than one cart installed at a time, you'll need the PBI/ECI version.

 

Yeah, I think that's what I'll get.

Edited by TheNameOfTheGame

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As the CEO of a former company where I was said, "we do both". So best to get both variants, cartridge and PBI version :-)

 

 

sanny's former CEO:

 

both.gif

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So, this sounds like a good idea. Since it is not related at all to the original dragoncart, I would prefer that the name be different. The original was a 5v cs8900a chip and support glue attached to a cartridge, without it's own internal IP stack. From a quick thread skim, I'm not sure if the item being discussed is a cartridge, or an ECI/PBI, or maybe it's both. I think that the ECI/PBI is a better implementation than the cartridge, but if the cartridge has a pass through then I think it's kind of moot but I'd still prefer the ECI/PBI.

 

Please put me down for 2 of either the PBI/ECI (if available) or 2 of the carts. Actually, I'll probably buy 2 of both, but lets start with what's being discussed.

 

As far as software goes, I do have a stack written as a device handler using the I: device and driven by VBI, so it's accessible from any language that can use CIO calls. It supports a stack with ARP/ICMP/BOOTP/DNS/UDP, but the TCP part was about 1/3 done when I ran out of gas. It's freely available to anyone who is interested. Using a chip with it's own stack will change things greatly, but it's a good proof of concept for using an interrupt-driven CIO handler. It will probably be much easier using the new chip. For gaming, what you typically need is a really fast UDP implementation and so the makers should concentrate of the speed of mioving things off of the chip and into memory.

 

1. davidcalgary29 - 1 cart
2. xrbrevin - 1 cart
3. skriegel - 2 carts
4. Marius - 2 carts
5. brenski - 1 cart
6. AtariSociety - 1 cart
7. Mathy - 2 carts
8. Haightc - 1 cart
9. Markk - 1 cart
10. Sleepy - 2 carts
11. Nezgar - 1 cart
12. Gunstar - 1 cart
13. Chaosfaktor - 1 cart
14. Wadeford - 1 cart
15. sanny - 1 cart
16. DNA128k - 1 cart
17. Senor Rossie - 3 carts
18. KlasO - 2 carts
19. NML32 - 1 cart
20. CharlieChaplin - 1 cart.
21. slx - 1 cart
22. David_P - 1 cart
23. Rainier - 1 cart
24. AtariPortal - 2 carts
25. patjomki - 1 cart
26. Allan - 1 cart
27. Toddtmw 1 cart
28. TheNameOfTheGame 1 cart
29. adam242 1 cart
30. Dan Winslow - 2 carts
31. Jinroh - 1 Cart
32. Philsan - 1 Cart
33. Lastic - 1 Cart
34. invisible kid - 1 cart
35. gozar- 1 Cart
36. pixelmischief - 1 cart
37. BigBen - 1 cart
38.
39. Ransom - 1 cart
40. TemplarXB - 1 cart
41. tuf - 1 cart
42. mariusz - 1 cart
43.
44. Firedawg - 1 cart
45.

Edited by danwinslow
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As far as software goes [...]

 

In case you're interested in actively developing something for the W5100 I'd be happy to discuss details with you - either in another thread or 1:1, as you prefer. Just let me know...

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if you have an original unmodified 800 (that is without full PBI interface added to it) then this is the way to go at the moment. as for cost benefit, well you have to get prices on both of the new offerings and weigh them..

 

I'd get one of each to be sure.

 

I am going the eci/pbi route, as I already have and original dragon...

that being said, I have one unmodified 800 and off loading is of benefit, I may be snagging one of these newly available slots...

Edited by _The Doctor__
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1. davidcalgary29 - 1 cart
2. xrbrevin - 1 cart
3. skriegel - 2 carts
4. Marius - 2 carts
5. brenski - 1 cart
6. AtariSociety - 1 cart
7. Mathy - 2 carts
8. Haightc - 1 cart
9. Markk - 1 cart
10. Sleepy - 2 carts
11. Nezgar - 1 cart
12. Gunstar - 1 cart
13. Chaosfaktor - 1 cart
14. Wadeford - 1 cart
15. sanny - 1 cart
16. DNA128k - 1 cart
17. Senor Rossie - 3 carts
18. KlasO - 2 carts
19. NML32 - 1 cart
20. CharlieChaplin - 1 cart.
21. slx - 1 cart
22. David_P - 1 cart
23. Rainier - 1 cart
24. AtariPortal - 2 carts
25. patjomki - 1 cart
26. Allan - 1 cart
27. Toddtmw 1 cart
28. TheNameOfTheGame 1 cart
29. adam242 1 cart
30. Dan Winslow - 2 carts
31. Jinroh - 1 Cart
32. Philsan - 1 Cart
33. Lastic - 1 Cart
34. invisible kid - 1 cart
35. gozar- 1 Cart
36. pixelmischief - 1 cart
37. BigBen - 1 cart
38. Soulbuster 1 Cart
39. Ransom - 1 cart
40. TemplarXB - 1 cart
41. tuf - 1 cart
42. mariusz - 1 cart
43.
44. Firedawg - 1 cart
45.

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