AtariGeezer Posted April 4, 2019 Share Posted April 4, 2019 MOE or integrated system ? I’d say integrated for a couple of reasons: Easier to keep to a standard, and makes for easier coding in some cases. By MOE, I mean like say the Puff BBS, where there is a block of subroutines to handle access to the modem, and a few other utility routines. I don’t much like the idea of Basic, unless maybe it’s an OSS one, because it’s got a lot of restrictions on how you can do things, and it hogs a lot of memory. Action! would be good, PL/65 would be ok, the Pascals I’m less sure about. If nobody’s writing modules then it could just be assembler all the way, which would also be the case if the target was to use a super cartridge. The Puff BBS MOE is what I would be starting with as I have it close to being fully disassembled. It's pretty well coded. I wouldn't be using the full basic interpreter for the scripting language, but rather just as a starting point. When I wrote the Script Decompiler for ST Express! BBS back in the early 90's, I have become quite familiar on how it's scripting language works... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted April 4, 2019 Author Share Posted April 4, 2019 I would be willing to give it a go if there is a way to migrate the database files to the new system. Also, Pro compatible networking is a must have. I wonder. If the four of you running Pro all switched to something else at the same time, why would Pro compatibility even matter ? Let’s face it, there isn’t dozens of Pro systems now, and there isn’t going to be in the future. As long as there were tools to import the old Pro data, I don’t see why keeping compatibility is even an issue. The exception would be for reusing old command modules. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted April 4, 2019 Share Posted April 4, 2019 I would like to be able to run the games. Also, some games are node locked. Is there a way around that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted April 5, 2019 Author Share Posted April 5, 2019 I would like to be able to run the games. Also, some games are node locked. Is there a way around that? I don't know. I've been told about this node locking and crc checking and whatnot, and so far as I can tell, it's bullsh!t. Now for the modules, it's possible that they could look at the system node # and decide whether to run or not, but that should be easy enough to fix with something like Disk Wizard, or DiskRX in Sparta. Insofar as the kernel is concerned, it doesn't check anything. It issues an XIO 40 to SpartaDos to binary load the module (it doesn't even verify that the module loads at $7000) and then it blindly jumps through $7000 to execute the module. Since I need to look at WAITCALL anyway, I can see if it does any local verification of its own. The only thing I've seen is that the Stage 1 VBI flips a byte in the SYSDATA file, which on startup, if that byte is "wrong" you get a message saying to buy "updated disks". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikerbob Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 The Biggest thing I would like to see.. if sites are going to network.. AKA Basement, Parttime, Resistance etc... I would like it so that I sign up on 1 site.. and that is my USER AND PASSWORD on any networked site.. and it remembers me like that .. aka quick scans etc.. I love the bbs' but I hate logging on to one.. reading 14 msgs.. logging on to the next and having to read the same 14 msgs or more.. because I am a different user.. so of course what is marked at Quick on that board is completely different than the last board. I am not sure how often they update from each other.. but it would be nice.. that when it updates it goes through user list and passes along to the other boards that on that board I have read up to msg 150 for example.. so if I have not logged on to one of the other boards in a while.. on the networked msg base each night.. at least it updates to where I have read. Thats what I would like to see. James 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) It would be nice. but that is still a 146. "Function Not Implemented". Hopefully Alf can help us. Edit: NOT literally, but you should get the idea I am trying to convey. Edited April 5, 2019 by Kyle22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted April 5, 2019 Author Share Posted April 5, 2019 Ok, LOGON does appear to check something, whereas WAITCALL does not. $3C7C/D which is what the startup and Stage 1 VBI flip, is checked by WAITCALL and if it's "wrong" it prompts you for your Pro Serial #. Setting $3C7D to non-zero defeats all the checking, except for one case. Anyway, it's not doing anything serious, the code can just be deleted. It's about equal to the SSI level of security, lol. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnPolka Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) The Biggest thing I would like to see.. if sites are going to network.. AKA Basement, Parttime, Resistance etc... I would like it so that I sign up on 1 site.. and that is my USER AND PASSWORD on any networked site.. and it remembers me like that .. aka quick scans etc.. I love the bbs' but I hate logging on to one.. reading 14 msgs.. logging on to the next and having to read the same 14 msgs or more.. because I am a different user.. so of course what is marked at Quick on that board is completely different than the last board. I am not sure how often they update from each other.. but it would be nice.. that when it updates it goes through user list and passes along to the other boards that on that board I have read up to msg 150 for example.. so if I have not logged on to one of the other boards in a while.. on the networked msg base each night.. at least it updates to where I have read. Thats what I would like to see. James That's an interesting idea. However, I believe it would be really hard to support since userlogs are not shared between BBSs. Today, you could solve the problem by choosing one BBS to read the networked message bases and on the other BBSs, just read the local message bases. You can edit which message bases are in your quickscan using the '@' command. With that command, you could turn off the networked message bases on all but one of the BBSs that you call. -JP Edited April 5, 2019 by JohnPolka 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) Good stuff... as to bbs networked base duplication or reading during qwik scan... we could do something silly- you know how in game that don't save but you can still play the correct level and sometimes even score? You finish a level and it gives you a code/password that you type in later to pick up where you left off... that could be employed across the BBS's . user #, password, ALF/KEY! Using that method -callers- once set up would have a sort of config key... maybe two words as part of their log in, the first word being a global network config and the second the local bbs config.... if ALF could come up with such a thing I'd call it ALF/KEY! Some folks call in using ANSI one call, ATASCII another, CGS/IGS on another call.... Pro annoyingly sets it all to a some default each time you change translation.. it should keep your settings for each... or... possibly part of ALF/KEY! Live chat on internet connected BBS would be cool as well but you would need more than one R: port to do so. and either more than one serial to lan box/ console server to do so. A good way to check about node locked games...there was one or two that were cracked, a compare of the work around in action versus not might yield some more results... crazy Ideas I know... but why not? yeah the door games, modules etc is what folks would be looking to keep using.... Edited April 5, 2019 by _The Doctor__ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikerbob Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 That's an interesting idea. However, I believe it would be really hard to support since userlogs are not shared between BBSs. Today, you could solve the problem by choosing one BBS to read the networked message bases and on the other BBSs, just read the local message bases. You can edit which message bases are in your quickscan using the '@' command. With that command, you could turn off the networked message bases on all but one of the BBSs that you call. -JP Fine JP make a good point and shoot my idea all to hell.. James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnPolka Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 Fine JP make a good point and shoot my idea all to hell.. James I like the idea, but I'm having trouble not thinking up scenarios that could be problematic. What if you called two BBSs after they both networked? Anyway, keep the ideas flowing. -JP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) because the alf/key knows which BBS it was created on... not that such a thing will ever exist but, possible... Edited April 5, 2019 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted April 5, 2019 Author Share Posted April 5, 2019 What WaitCall do people commonly run now ? I don't really want to disassemble them all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 What WaitCall do people commonly run now ? I don't really want to disassemble them all. I'm using one that works on my UDS-10. I have had a really hard time finding a good one. The one I use now passes the ATA string through to the user on the other end. I wish it could say something like 'Press RETURN slowly a few times'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted April 5, 2019 Author Share Posted April 5, 2019 I'm using one that works on my UDS-10. I have had a really hard time finding a good one. The one I use now passes the ATA string through to the user on the other end. I wish it could say something like 'Press RETURN slowly a few times'. yeah, but what's the module name ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 yeah, but what's the module name ? I don't know the original name. I think that's the one John Polka sent me. IIRC, it was already named WAITCALL.CMD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnPolka Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 (edited) I don't know the original name. I think that's the one John Polka sent me. IIRC, it was already named WAITCALL.CMD. Basement BBS, Part-Time, and the Resistance are using waitcall.cmd version: 2.0 date: 2/25/89 crc: $D334 I had Kyle switch to version 2.0 for message base networking. The newer version of waitcall he was using wouldn't connect with my system when we first tried networking. Alcatraz BBS is running waitcall.cmd version: 1.3 date: 9/27/88 crc: $E165 I tried getting the SysOp of Alcatraz to run version 2.0, but he didn't like the screen getting turned off when somene logs in at baud rates above 2400 (even though you can turn it back on using Shift+Control+5). -JP Edited April 5, 2019 by JohnPolka 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted April 5, 2019 Author Share Posted April 5, 2019 hmm, the Waitcall I have is circa 1995. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndusGT Posted April 6, 2019 Share Posted April 6, 2019 (edited) duplicate Edited April 6, 2019 by IndusGT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndusGT Posted April 6, 2019 Share Posted April 6, 2019 Sounds great to me, might get opinions on what the best features are and liked about each platform across the field from all machines and start a list... I think networking, and mux, or even scsi messaging are cool... The BBS needs to accept a phone number and an IP address as part of the profile and be logged/saved. Allowing for real phone call or internet calls, and one step more extreme, possibly even allowing for packet radio. The lan device normally can show the IP at connect so it can be parsed from there. I think using the flow control registers of the black box, and mio as well as whatever new devices might be using could be looked at. The other possibility besides message base daily networking, filemail etc.. is active networking... a node to node chat or message for BBS's that chose to allow such a link... Express Pro was good, and it's the template you might follow to do portions of this, Pro suffered from losing key presses due to redundant jumps for things that just happened or protection checks and version checks.... That would be best done as a sanity check at start up or as a utility to be run by the system operator... not all the time during execution... Would this flow control, r:handler help? https://web.archive....r/hyperspd.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted April 6, 2019 Author Share Posted April 6, 2019 Would this flow control, r:handler help? https://web.archive....r/hyperspd.html I’ll have to check that against the Bobterm handler; we shaved it to be pretty fast, although I don’t recall we handled flow control, leaving that to the BB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted April 6, 2019 Share Posted April 6, 2019 The R: Handler must manage its own buffer and control RTS/CTS to control and monitor the data to/from the modem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted April 6, 2019 Author Share Posted April 6, 2019 What are some known Pro node numbers ? I’’m a bit puzzled by this goofy check. Thanks to the equates I can see it is in fact the node number being looked at, but why would all nodes higher than 256 get a pass ? Seems odd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted April 6, 2019 Share Posted April 6, 2019 What are some known Pro node numbers ? I’’m a bit puzzled by this goofy check. Thanks to the equates I can see it is in fact the node number being looked at, but why would all nodes higher than 256 get a pass ? Seems odd. My node number is 455. That means it must be a word instead of a byte for node number. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nezgar Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 I switched out the stock Waitcall with the "<'Kat-Ren>" Host on 5.0B in conjunction with Len Spencer's Hyperspeed R: handler for the MIO, so that the serial port was fixed at 19,200bps, and relied on the hardware flow control to regulate transmission to slower callers, and report the actual calling speed in the last callers list too.. Also to hang up using hardware DTR drop instead of +++ATH I recall it was versatile in that you could customize the modem initialization commands sent using a text file, which was important for me to get the Courier HST dual standard configured just the way I liked... Under emulation, I found this waitcall seems to take way too long to respond to the user connect so I may have to explore reverting to the stock waitcall to see if it is better for the virtual R: modem... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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