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why I hate commodore 64

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2 hours ago, zzip said:

It's funny, because even though I hated C64 BITD (mostly for getting tons of games I wished I could get),  today that leaves me with a certain fondness and curiosity about the machine that I don't have for machines I never encountered back then (such as ZX Spectrum, BBC Micro that weren't common in US).   And now I can explore its library to see what I've missed

The thing is I got a lot more machines of the 80s and explore their special fun... we were so stupid with all that wars back in those days... 

 

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1 hour ago, Heaven/TQA said:

The thing is I got a lot more machines of the 80s and explore their special fun... we were so stupid with all that wars back in those days... 

 

 

In German we have a saying "Wer für alles offen ist, kann nicht ganz dicht sein" .

 

Seems, in several cases I'm right. There is some aging dementia going on.

It wasn't stupid to create missing or new stuff for a platform. Some "power of the youth" can be very helpful there.

But how to name it , if you stand on a sinking ship, being happy to see people making a party on the distant Beach. Clever?

 

 

 

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I had a Spectrum, a 2600, an 800XL, a C64, an ST, an Amiga and then PCs. The only one I have any feeling of nostalgia for was the 800XL (and maybe the Spectrum). Despite the C64 having "better" facilities, the games all felt off, and the sound, well once you've heard that whiny noise once, that's enough. Rob Hubbard was the only reason I kept it for as long as I did!

 

Point being, it doesn't have to be the best, most powerful or whatever if you had the most fun with it!

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18 minutes ago, Heaven/TQA said:

 

 

Not recognizable overpixelated still image graphics , and  a rather weak 3D presentation . 

After knowing what an 8-Bit could do in

 

Starraiders

Rescue on Fractalus

Wayout

 

....

 

 

how could anyone be jealous of that ? 

The "hate" could belong to the fact that on the C64 every crap seems to find someone who is adapting it to that platform.

 

Transitions can be nice, to give a little more detail to an image.  Using Transitions to get the imagination of missing colors is crap. 

Adapting that engine to the C64 is "easy" , as early PCs have been veeeeryyyyyyyy slow in 3D presentation. 

 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, RAM said:

Point being, it doesn't have to be the best, most powerful or whatever if you had the most fun with it!

Exactly, its also possible to have fun with a variety of machines, its like having a satellite box but only watching the same one channel..I have a few real C64s, a few real Atari's (8bit only), a couple of real Amiga's, 2 PS2's an Xbox and an Xbox360, A Wii, a Gamecube, a Snes with Wildcard, a 3DS, a PS4 and lastly 2 PSX's. I still use them all at various times because they all have great games on, never mind how many bits they have or how pretty (or not) they are. The two machines on my desk are a 130XE and a breadbin C64, they get almost every day use, more the Atari at the moment but both.

 

Sometimes for the more stored machines its easier to use an emulator but I still use them all....I'm still an Atarian, I just also happen to be a C64 scener (retired) and a gamer, I CAN BE ALL THOSE and love here.

 

Stop bickering and just play or use utils, what ever floats that boat but making this thread longer with bickering and opinions is just stopping you enjoying yourself with a machine or machines of choice..

 

Sigh, you can have people on forums discussing stuff but you can't stop them sh*tting the bed as well..

Edited by Mclaneinc
spalling
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7 hours ago, Mclaneinc said:

 

 

Sigh, you can have people on forums discussing stuff but you can't stop them sh*tting the bed as well..

 

Seems, he knows about what he is writing.

 

It's exactly this distracting that they do, that is also distracting people to do real new stuff for the Atari.

 

Others get it as arrogance, but it is just their lose mind about the relevant.  So normally you won't find them in a dedicated forum of their "non relevant"  thoughts. But it is allowed to them to write distracting posts ...

 

Particular if someone has a "new" idea for a game on such an old machine, and to see it there first, you get that distracting by them, if you aim to do that for the Atari.

If you aim to do that for the C64 you don't hear or read a single word.

People(coders) just do it, and the same people who laugh on Atari projects, applaud to the same stuff on the C64.

 

A game like Eye of the Beholder , in a special Atari Version, could run with 20 colors on the screen and a window that shows 20 fps for the 3D part.  It could be a simple and logical progression, if people just did follow the programming of the Atari from 1979 to 1985.

 

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Pot..... kettle...... black.....

 

A life awaits you, you just have to leave the keyboard to find it..

 

If you don't understand the comment then just ignore it, if you had understood it then you would have seen its a point about doing stupid things like arguing....Zero F's given..Back on Ignore..

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30 minutes ago, Mclaneinc said:

Pot..... kettle...... black.....

 

A life awaits you, you just have to leave the keyboard to find it..

 

If you don't understand the comment then just ignore it, if you had understood it then you would have seen its a point about doing stupid things like arguing....Zero F's given..Back on Ignore..

 

I wonder , if he knows his own words.

 

Luckily I have a lot POKEY tunes. This might fit a little ;)

 

Intermission ...

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by emkay

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I wished I had a complete C64 here. And I also wished I had a NES, SNES... and a ZX spectrum and an Atari ST.... or an Amiga. 

 

I decided to keep atari 8bit only. It is the system I know best. It is the system that pleases me the most. But all those other systems and consoles are awesome too. Not just the systems, but the software collection makes them interesting and appealing. 

 

When I was a kid I hated the fact that everybody in my neighborhood had an C64 or an MSX. I was the only one with Atari XL. Another frustration was that as soon people heard you had an Atari homecomputer, they thought it was a GAME computer (because the brand Atari was linked to GAMES). But still... the Atari 8bit always worked like a magnet on me, and it still does. Of course I loved the games my friends had on their C64, but I never thought: hmm let me trade my XL for a C64.

 

Today is a different story. I do not understand the competition. All these consoles from the 80's and early/mid 90's are AWESOME. They simply wrote history. And in retroperspective I really can see why people loved their C64. And they are right. It is (just like the XL) a great machine, with incredible abilities and a very attractive software catalog. And because a lot of people had he C64, it was also easy to communicate with another C64 enthusiastic. That huge userbase helps too. 

 

I wished the Atari 8bit was like the C64. It would have been good for the software catalog and other development. On the other side I am very thankful for the fact that the atari 8bit had a revival in Eastern Europe in the late 80's and early 90's. A lot of great software and hardware development comes from Poland. Without their expertise and efforts I have no idea where we would have been today. 

 

I remember watching great demos like Cool Emotion and Joyride from HARD.... the incredible Overmind demo, Numen... and much more. The great tools (like MPT, Chaos Music Composer, Quick Assembler) and games. All fabulous stuff from Eastern Europe. They made Atari 8bit great again lol. 

 

So to me the fight is absolutely not between the systems/consoles. It is all about support and stuff, and I think the C64 had a very good start back in the 80's, but atari 8bit got pretty even thanks to Eastern Europe suppliers of software and hardware. It feels like a tie. 

 

Anyway, to end with the part I started with. I wished I had all the consoles and computers. But I do not have the space here. I 'limit' myself to atari 8bit, and I still haven't enough of that. From time to time I discover new games, or old games. I am very enthusiastic about new development with hardware, and the great firmware updates from @flashjazzcat or new titles from the abbuc software competition. Next to my 800XL I have connected my 2600. It gives me some extra games, which I like to play from time to time. But in the end I always fire up the 800XL. And I am pretty sure this would also happen when I had the C64, Nes, SNES, Atari ST, ZX Spectrum or Amiga here. Cool to play with ... for a while. And then: 800XL again!

 

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As said, that's the spirit....You have the wife, the Atari at home but you can flirt with mistresses like the C64, Amiga etc and then return home to your true love.. 

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9 minutes ago, Marius said:

When I was a kid I hated the fact that everybody in my neighborhood had an C64 or an MSX. I was the only one with Atari XL. Another frustration was that as soon people heard you had an Atari homecomputer, they thought it was a GAME computer (because the brand Atari was linked to GAMES). But still... the Atari 8bit always worked like a magnet on me, and it still does. Of course I loved the games my friends had on their C64, but I never thought: hmm let me trade my XL for a C64.

 

Hm. When I was a Kid I never even considered to get a Computer anyways. 

Around 1985 I have been searching for such a machine, just been curious what could be done with it. The first experience I actually had with CPC. That thing was fascinating by the ultraclean colors. 

A Friend was up to buy an 800XL plus 1010 Recorder and asked me , if I'm interested. So I got the Atari. 

The real cool thing back then was the SIO Sound and the easy to learn Basic. It allowed better to get to the functionality of how it all works. 

 

9 minutes ago, Marius said:

Today is a different story. I do not understand the competition. All these consoles from the 80's and early/mid 90's are AWESOME. They simply wrote history. And in retroperspective I really can see why people loved their C64. And they are right. It is (just like the XL) a great machine, with incredible abilities and a very attractive software catalog. And because a lot of people had he C64, it was also easy to communicate with another C64 enthusiastic. That huge userbase helps too. 

 

In 1986, when Atari officially named the XL/EX line dead, I tried the C128. I never had a worse experience with another computer. 

Games looked somehow more colorful and detailed than on the Atari. SID connected to a real stereo was very impressive. 

Back then there was simply no interest. Even the best games on the C64 didn't catch me, and SIDs can be listened to without a C64 or C128.  I bought an ST then. It wasn't such a bad experience as a lot games looked and sounded well. 1989 I bought an Amiga 2000, put a 5MB expansion with SCSI Adapter with 50MB HDD in and was able to play a lot games without Disk-Juggling. Windows XP Experience in 1989 given.

Thanks to the huge C64 Fanbase, the Amiga got sold well and earned a lot of what it deserved. 

 

9 minutes ago, Marius said:

 

I wished the Atari 8bit was like the C64. It would have been good for the software catalog and other development. On the other side I am very thankful for the fact that the atari 8bit had a revival in Eastern Europe in the late 80's and early 90's. A lot of great software and hardware development comes from Poland. Without their expertise and efforts I have no idea where we would have been today. 

 

If the Atari was like the C64, I'd chosen the CPC , I guess. Lot better to work on. 

 

9 minutes ago, Marius said:

I remember watching great demos like Cool Emotion and Joyride from HARD.... the incredible Overmind demo, Numen... and much more. The great tools (like MPT, Chaos Music Composer, Quick Assembler) and games. All fabulous stuff from Eastern Europe. They made Atari 8bit great again lol. 

 

Some stuff done by polish people really are outstanding. 

But as you might see, learning progression isn't given. 

There is too much stuff still not available on the small Atari that it would deserve. 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Mclaneinc said:

As said, that's the spirit....You have the wife, the Atari at home but you can flirt with mistresses like the C64, Amiga etc and then return home to your true love.. 

Haha this is actually a pretty good comparison! Well said!

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Today I had a good enjoyment.

Youtube is such a big library.

Basic 10 liner ...

 

 

But no one cares of a nice "3D game" in assembler.

That thing is faster than the small Window in the "Eye of the Beholder" Version on the C64....

 

 

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Although I think the 3D window speed could be improved, the way 'where's my cheese' does it isn't the answer.  It uses PM graphics and a lot of memory - a clever technique for a 10 liner but probably not viable for an actual game.

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un-ignored to see what folks were talking about, yeah its a nice little game and for 10 rather big lines its dead clever. Comparing it to Eye of the beholder isn't so clever, one game looks at where cheese is, dead end, left right or straight on and time while the other has many stats , combat, multiple enemies etc etc so to say one is slower isn't really the point. The point is, are they enjoyable and yes they are for different reasons so well done for finding this emkay. The guy also has some other pretty damn good 10 liners as well.

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Dunno much about the C64, never knew anyone who bought one, I did borrow a VIC20 for a while, but wasn't very impressed,

Most people has ZX Spectrums or Atari 800/400's, we even had an Atari user group at work.

 

One guy actually had an ORIC1 and later ORIC Atmos, he was very lonely 😂

 

The only computer I would probably have bought instead of my first 800 would have been a Lynx https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camputers_Lynx

 

but didn't get enough time with it as it was also borrowed, but it seemed impressive.

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