Mr Robot Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 I have a few questions related to construction kits on the Atari 8-bit. Am I correct in thinking that "Robbo" and "Robbo Konstruktor" were the only commercially released Robbo games for the Atari 8-bit and all other releases were homebrew? Who were Antic soft, Janu soft, LUK soft, LGB Soft, Robo-Soft, P.W. Software et al? Am I correct that only "Boulder Dash", "Boulder Dash II: Rockfords Revenge" and "Boulder Dash Construction Kit" were the only commercially released Boulder Dash games? Were ANY games produced using construction kits ever sold commercially? I remember some commercial SEUCK games on the ST/Amiga, did any PCS tables etc. ever get released commercially? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vitoco Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Rally Speedway included a track editor. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlsson Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Lode Runner too, but I think the question was if any games/levels/tracks made with an editor, ever were packaged and sold on their own or even supplied as extra level disks to other users through the original publisher. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+CharlieChaplin Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 (edited) Well, if I dive through my hundreds of A8 games that were created with construction kits/sets (98% of them are either new Boulder Dash or Robbo levels), I can surely find a dozen or so that were sold commercially... Afaik, some pinballs from the Pinball Construction Set (Raster Blaster, etc.) were also available as separate and commercial titles (not sure if DMM was also created with PCS, it looks similar). http://www.atarimania.com/game-atari-400-800-xl-xe-raster-blaster_4292.html http://www.atarimania.com/game-atari-400-800-xl-xe-david-s-midnight-magic_5979.html Boulder Dash Construction Kit was sold together with a new level set, named Boulder Dash IV or Boulder Dash 4. A british vendor (Shoesoft) sold several games created with Broderbund's Arcade Machine commercially - these titles all suck however: http://www.atarimania.com/pgelstsoft.awp?system=8&type=G&publisher=1609&step=25 KE-Soft made many commercial games with construction kits or sets and he also sold extra levels to his games commercially (Tobot II, Cultivation, Sogon, etc.). For the KE-Soft game "Zebu Land" there exists a commercial construction kit by ANG software. For the Brundles exists the Brundles editor and so on. Afair, I once played a simple PD Soko-Ban clone named "Push it" on the A8, the docs mentioned that all levels were stolen/borrowed from the original game Soko-Ban by Spectrum Holobyte. Well, KE-Soft sold "Sokoban" as a low price game for the A8 and later "Sogon" as a full price game for the A8 and both had the same (stolen/borrowed) levels... Afaik, Gauntlet did not really have a level editor (or did it?) - and still they (US-Gold?) made a contest and the best new levels were later sold commercially as Gauntlet - Deeper Dungeons. Were there ever any games (PD or commercial) created with the "Wargame Construction Set" by SSI ?!? Nowadays I do not collect nor play any Boulder Dash or Robbo levels anymore - there are just too many of them !! Edited May 21, 2019 by CharlieChaplin 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 You can add Sidewinder as having a construction disk, obviously Mr Robot, as to if any kit made games were ever published, no idea but unlikely.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Nowadays I do not collect nor play any Boulder Dash or Robbo levels anymore - there are just too many of them !! Tell me about it, and I see the new 'Baby' versions are now the thing on the C64, just out, Baby Mr Robot.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Robot Posted May 21, 2019 Author Share Posted May 21, 2019 Robbo, Boulder Dash and PCS were easily the most prolific of the Construction Kits, I have hundreds of titles as well. It's working out which ones are Commercial titles and which ones are PD that is the problem. The file names are unhelpful, especially for anything named by TOSEC, they (for example) incorrectly name L.K.Avalon as the publisher of lots of Robbo's because the © is there from the Konstruktor. Sometime people made these levels, sometimes companies, sometimes people used a company name to sound more professional so the 'company' is really just a person, sometimes they started off selling, then went PD, sometimes they started off PD and then started selling. This is the thing I'm struggling with! Davids Midnight Magic came out in 1982, PCS was 1983. I'm sure DMM influenced Bill Budge more than a little bit but they aren't related. Boulder Dash Construction Kit was re-released as a budget title and called Boulder Dash IV: The Game, it came with the same new levels in both cases. Sokoban was originally released on the NEC PC-8801 in 1982 by Thinking Rabbit. All versions since them have 'borrowed' (and expanded) the level data, I've even played sokoban on Nokia phones and Psion Organisers. Great game. I'd never seen The Arcade Machine! Thanks for that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Adventure Creator Racing Destruction set 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urchlay Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Lode Runner's Rescue. Though I never saw any levels for this game other than the ones I made myself: the pirate copy I had was disk 1 only, didn't have any levels (which would have been on disk 2). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Actually..... In Electronic Games Magazine (forget the issue. I will dig through and find it when time permits), they were doing a 'Pinball roundup' where they write about pinball games on the 2600, Intellivision, Bally Astrocade, computers etc... They mentioned someone using Pinball Construction Set from EA to make a commercial game. They showed a screenshot, and never did say what system it was for. I had the original magazine, way back in the early 80s and it remained a mystery for a very, very long time. Turns out, it was released for the Apple // platform. Hell, Let me find it..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 Ok, Found it... Volume 2, Number 9. November 1983. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Robot Posted May 21, 2019 Author Share Posted May 21, 2019 Raster Blaster was by Bill Budge and published by BudgeCo in 1982, I remember Bill didn't have a lot of success with PCS when he published it himself even though he was a well known programmer on the Apple II and he went to EA who made it a Success. I wonder if he wrote PCS to make Raster Blaster and decided the construction set would be a good release too. Interesting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 (edited) nope nope nope, gotta stop this very persistent anecdote, right now. Bill Budge did _NOT _write PCS to do Raster Blaster. Raster Blaster was done _before_ PCS. You can see it if you look at the released bits of source code for the two. Raster Blaster's collision detection system was a hand tuned list. PCS used a much more complex run-length list to keep the ball and other objects working correctly. Bill Budge talks about it explicitly in his GDC post-mortem talk for PCS. -Thom Edited May 21, 2019 by tschak909 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Robot Posted May 21, 2019 Author Share Posted May 21, 2019 It's not an anecdote I've ever heard. I did say "I wonder if", it was a question. Thanks for answering it in an authoritative and clear manner! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 it is, and cherry's correction is spot on.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 /me hugs @mr-robot. sorry, I jumped on that way too harshly. My bad. -Thom 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.atarimania.com Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 There were two or three "companies" - probably one-man operations - which released Pinball Construction Set tables on a commercial basis but, due to their rarity, the disks haven't been found yet. Computer Gaming World held a Lode Runner contest and sold the best creations on disk: https://archive.org/details/Computer_Gaming_World_Issue_5.2/page/n35 Anybody have that one? -- Atari Frog http://www.atarimania.com 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Robot Posted May 22, 2019 Author Share Posted May 22, 2019 /me hugs @mr-robot. sorry, I jumped on that way too harshly. My bad. -Thom I appreciate the passion! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
256 colors Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 (edited) I guess you could add Eastern Front (1941)as a Construction set with it's Eastern Front (1941) Scenario Editor Eastern Front (1941) Source Code http://www.atarimania.com/game-atari-400-800-xl-xe-eastern-front-1941-scenario-editor_12207.html http://www.atarimania.com/game-atari-400-800-xl-xe-eastern-front-1941-source-code_1792.html Edited May 22, 2019 by 256 colors 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Knight Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 (edited) Molecule Man by Mastertronic had a decent maze designer on the flip side of the tape. Polar Pierre by Databyte had a screen designer too Edited May 22, 2019 by Magic Knight 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlsson Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 Adventure Creator Perhaps also AdventureWriter which pretty much equals The Quill in Europe? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred_M Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 The Polish game "Saper" has 2 level editors to create your own Saper levels. Saper Konstruktor by Silver Software and Saper Constructor by ANG Software. The ANG constructor was able to create levels for the LK Avalon release and the KE-Soft release (the disks of the LK Avalon release and the KE-Soft release are different). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted May 23, 2019 Share Posted May 23, 2019 Perhaps also AdventureWriter which pretty much equals The Quill in Europe? Thanks for pointing this out, it interests me...but Adventure Creator is a graphical game creator, not a text adventure... http://www.atarimania.com/game-atari-400-800-xl-xe-adventure-creator_113.html 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlsson Posted May 23, 2019 Share Posted May 23, 2019 Yeah, I suppose a tool like AdventureWriter is closer to a programming language than a game construction kit. The Commode had The Games Creator by Mirrorsoft including a dozen different sample games. However I don't know about any otherwise released games made with this program. Perhaps it wasn't until the SEUCK generation that construction kits would produce games that were good enough to sell. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted May 23, 2019 Share Posted May 23, 2019 The Commode had That's fighting talk Actually made me laugh...Never heard that one before...Anyway, back to business... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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