SS Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 However, my old Dell with S-Video input provides better results (but it includes sharpening and refuses to handle one of my 130s): dell-monitor-converter.jpg I would say that my results are probably closest to this although maybe just a bit darker. My output was pretty clean looking but a little darker than I'm used to; results were a little improved when I put the TV's A/V setting to "GAME". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 So I did some tests of this little widget tonight after work - thankfully I did *NOT* have another 14 hour day! Pardon all the pics but I figured it would be best to show as much as possible for such a major investement ... Okay, first we have some closeups of composite video from my UAV rev D-equipped 7800. This box does not yet have an S-video connection. From sitting about 6' away from my 2013 Samsung 1080p LED set up in the gameroom, it looks just fine - as noted by others, maybe just a bit dimmer than through the direct Composite connection (this TV is just old enough to still have a composite jack built in; our 2018 Samsung QLED 4K set downstairs no longer has analog connections at all). First, a full-size view of the Commando title screen: Next a closeup: Joust: So all in all, pretty good. Now for my UAV rev C-equipped 1200XL, again through composite. For some reason, I'm getting no picture from the S-video connections on this box - I may have jostled a wire loose from the terminal block of the UAV when I moved all my stuff upstairs a few months ago and put it onto a shelf. But composite looks good here too. (Ignore the moire patterns - they're an artifact of my camera sensor and not visible in person). Since S-video wasn't working from this machine, I pulled out another 1200XL, this one with a UAV as well. S-video looks really good through this converter box, I think: And some pretty colors to finish it off: All in all, pretty good $20 investment. For those considering one, I did see a bit more ghosting and screen artifacts in composite when viewed up close though turning on my TV's digital noise reduction settings (set to "Auto") actually cleaned things up nicely). Anyway, hope this helps anyone else considering one. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 DrVenkman - I sympathize with your work schedule. Just finished a similar stint. Can you please do me a huge favour, and post a screenshot of FlickerTerm. That is the "go to test" for me. I have only seen one single scan convertor that works with it. I am betting there is a 99% chance, that a row of underscores will look like _-_-_-_-_ rather than _______. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 I dunno if I have a copy handy. I know I don't have one on the SIDE2 cart installed in that 1200XL I used. I will see if I can move my 1088XEL over to the TV later for a test and give it a test. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Yep, you're right, Stephen. Too bad. Jon's fonts in TLW look so much better! ICE-T's menus looked better too, though because I don't have a serial port device connected it just yelled at me about not being able to open a port and refused to give me a terminal window. I didn't bother taking any pics. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevymad Posted June 12, 2019 Author Share Posted June 12, 2019 Now does anyone have a Pal computer to try with their ntsc screen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevymad Posted June 12, 2019 Author Share Posted June 12, 2019 Is your monitor used in these pictures CRT, LCD or other? EDIT: Never mind, I forgot for a moment this is an HDMI converter and not VGA...I don't believe CRT monitors exist with HDMI or even DVI? (do they anyone?) It has to be a digital monitor for digital input, right? I have a 32" CRT Tv that's 1080p hdmi. It's in the back room and rarely even get's turned on anymore. Way too heavy to move by myself too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Yep, you're right, Stephen. Too bad. IMG_1649.JPG IMG_1650.JPG Jon's fonts in TLW look so much better! IMG_1652.JPG IMG_1651.JPG ICE-T's menus looked better too, though because I don't have a serial port device connected it just yelled at me about not being able to open a port and refused to give me a terminal window. I didn't bother taking any pics. Thanks for the confirmation. IMHO - a convertor is garbage and non-working if it can't reproduce a FlickerTerm screen. Harsh words for a $20 device I suppose, but then again, I just scored a 13" CRT TV for $20. It will work with this stuff so there ya go. I simply will not buy, nor endorse a convertor of any kind, that cannot reproduce a FlickerTerm screen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 (edited) Thanks for the confirmation. IMHO - a convertor is garbage and non-working if it can't reproduce a FlickerTerm screen. Harsh words for a $20 device I suppose, but then again, I just scored a 13" CRT TV for $20. It will work with this stuff so there ya go. I simply will not buy, nor endorse a convertor of any kind, that cannot reproduce a FlickerTerm screen. Where you the one that had me test Flickerterm with my Ambery S-video-to-VGA converter? I don't know if that's the one converter that works with it that you are referring too, but it does properly display on the ambery according to whom ever I did test it for and posted screen shots... Another thing I love about the Ambery converters is there is absolutely no perceivable lag, to me, between playing games through it compared to straight video into the TV, just a better picture since I use S-video through it instead of composite since my TV doesn't have S-video. I still can't recommend Ambery converters enough. Well worth the somewhere between $60-$100 I spent on them based on model, etc. I've got two, a RGB/YPbPr-to-VGA I've had for a dozen years and still use with Atari Jaguar and Sega Genesis, and the S-video-to-VGA I've had for 7 years, for my PAL Atari 1200XL & other video/s-video-only systems. I just want another video/S-video converter for my 800 in another room, but this time I want to go with a video/S-video-to-HDMI, but I want one that can successfully do PAL too, as I intend to use it with the PAL 1200XL and use the Ambery VGA one with the 800 on a CRT VGA monitor. But for $20 this cheapo one is looking impressive on Dr. V's machines with upgraded video. I'd still like to see it do PAL though...if PAL signals working right with this box can be confirmed, Then I will get one too and post screen shots of it on both my PAL 1200XL with Supervideo 2.1 (1200XL chroma boost edition) upgrade and from my Stock 800's S-video comparing this cheapo video-to-HDMI with the Ambery video-to-VGA. I have a new digital camera that can take sharper, clearer images than my phone cameras. Edited June 12, 2019 by Gunstar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 I have a 32" CRT Tv that's 1080p hdmi. It's in the back room and rarely even get's turned on anymore. Way too heavy to move by myself too. Cool. Yeah, I remember now that I had a rear-projection HDTV with RGB CRT's about 15 years ago, that I got used that had a DVI input. I used an HDMI-to-DVI adapter on it. I forgot about it because it only lasted about 6 months before it went bell-up. I also had a friend with 1080i 32" CRT, but it's best input was component RGB... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 (edited) I may go ahead and take the plunge anyway, considering the price, even if someone else that gets it doesn't have PAL to test it on. Just for comparison sake, maybe I'll be the guinea pig for PAL testing... I'll let y'all know what I decided tomorrow. Edited June 12, 2019 by Gunstar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Aren't the results these days amazing compared to where we began in the early 80's with color TV's? I started with a 9" Panasonic color TV that worked pretty well with my 800, then got a 12" Sony which was so much better. And then a bunch of monitors after that as technology improved! Quite a journey! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Where you the one that had me test Flickerterm with my Ambery S-video-to-VGA converter? I don't know if that's the one converter that works with it that you are referring too, but it does properly display on the ambery according to whom ever I did test it for and posted screen shots... Another thing I love about the Ambery converters is there is absolutely no perceivable lag, to me, between playing games through it compared to straight video into the TV, just a better picture since I use S-video through it instead of composite since my TV doesn't have S-video. I still can't recommend Ambery converters enough. Well worth the somewhere between $60-$100 I spent on them based on model, etc. I've got two, a RGB/YPbPr-to-VGA I've had for a dozen years and still use with Atari Jaguar and Sega Genesis, and the S-video-to-VGA I've had for 7 years, for my PAL Atari 1200XL & other video/s-video-only systems. I just want another video/S-video converter for my 800 in another room, but this time I want to go with a video/S-video-to-HDMI, but I want one that can successfully do PAL too, as I intend to use it with the PAL 1200XL and use the Ambery VGA one with the 800 on a CRT VGA monitor. But for $20 this cheapo one is looking impressive on Dr. V's machines with upgraded video. I'd still like to see it do PAL though...if PAL signals working right with this box can be confirmed, Then I will get one too and post screen shots of it on both my PAL 1200XL with Supervideo 2.1 (1200XL chroma boost edition) upgrade and from my Stock 800's S-video comparing this cheapo video-to-HDMI with the Ambery video-to-VGA. I have a new digital camera that can take sharper, clearer images than my phone cameras. Yeah - that was me. I had previously tested 2 VGA convertors when I was still using an LCD screen. I am lucky enough to now have my 8-bits hooked up to professional Sony PVMs. No substitute for a CRT for these old systems. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faicuai Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Here's the DVDO iScan HD/+ having breakfast with Flick-term (fed from the 800, with essentially stock video output): Talk about TOTAL control of almost every single key aspect of the source image, including the ability to successfully display Atari's image size at ANY arbitrary edge-offset, any aspect ratio, any frame-locking rate, per individual-input settings memory, remote-controlled, PAL or NTSC, and to ANY monitor. U,S, $90 on ebay (+ shipping, used). I actually got the HD and the HD/+ and I later found a mint VP-50pro on a sweet deal, which is a total overkill for this application). ONLY way to get better than this, and towards a COMPLETE, TOTAL CRT elimination package is moving onto the FRAMEISTER, which will deliver the very best 240p screenplay you can, and will bring the best that can be extracted out of the Atari's true video output. Cheers! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
256 colors Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 I'm getting best composite output so far on my unmodded PAL 800XL that probably wants a recap at some point and the S-VIDEO output looking at too Using RetroTink2X 3.2 pcb and very latest firmware theirs a few modes that work the best I've seen CVBS, Composite Retro mode for NTSC and PAL Composite Video mode Changes in the new firmware https://www.videogameperfection.com/forums/topic/retrotink-2x-new-firmware/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 Here's the DVDO iScan HD/+ having breakfast with Flick-term (fed from the 800, with essentially stock video output): 0BA327DF-4EA5-495D-A33B-CA3DA548BE91.jpeg EA02A1BF-1CDE-477E-B543-65409FD24C08.jpeg 38AD2473-249C-4A94-8E00-7D2B85C2E84C.jpeg Talk about TOTAL control of almost every single key aspect of the source image, including the ability to successfully display Atari's image size at ANY arbitrary edge-offset, any aspect ratio, any frame-locking rate, per individual-input settings memory, remote-controlled, PAL or NTSC, and to ANY monitor. U,S, $90 on ebay (+ shipping, used). I actually got the HD and the HD/+ and I later found a mint VP-50pro on a sweet deal, which is a total overkill for this application). ONLY way to get better than this, and towards a COMPLETE, TOTAL CRT elimination package is moving onto the FRAMEISTER, which will deliver the very best 240p screenplay you can, and will bring the best that can be extracted out of the Atari's true video output. Cheers! Well them there pictures ('scuse the grammar) sure makes me seriously consider one of these devices! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 Remember, this thread is about a $20 widget. You get what you pay for and all that, but if you have no other way to connect your old composite or S-video device to an HDMI port for casual use, it does the job. Like most of you, I have plenty of CRTs (three in my 8-Bit Attic alone, one more downstairs, and two in storage in the garage. We are not the real target audience for this thing. If I used my modern LEDs exclusively for retrogaming and -computing, sure I'd buy a Frameister or something, but fortuately that is not the case. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevymad Posted June 13, 2019 Author Share Posted June 13, 2019 Ya, i've got a couple CRT tv's and a real nice 42" lcd just for gaming. But none of them are handy, so my retro computers don't get used much. Now this device let's me cheaply hook up to my pc monitor where I spend most of my time anyway. I can set the Atari right in front of me at typing level, instead of up on a dresser or down on the floor. My 800xl will get much more use this way. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxpressed Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 I was wondering how the DVDO would do with the Flick-term test. I have the iScan Pro and the VP-20. I should hook them up and mess around with them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
256 colors Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 (edited) I wouldn't recommend a Frameister to anybody it's a massively over hyped product that's defunct and at £/$400 + without the accessories You get a pretty picture but with considerable latency delay too The reason i put the RetroTink2X 3.2 out their because it's a balanced price too performance product around £/$100 mark with considerable less latency I think for people who have a CRT display it's the best solution clearly providing the set isn't half knackered with old age yet If you can service and repair them that's a bonus most repair services won't touch them that's assuming they have the parts/tubes/in stock and service manual in print Edited June 13, 2019 by 256 colors 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6BQ5 Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 I’m always game for trying new converters. Last night I searched eBay and found a DVDO converter listed for sale and bought one of the available units. When it arrives I will compare it to my Framemeister. Two weekends ago I picked up a 42” Panasonic plasma TV that has three S-Video inputs from a local thrift store. The image shown by that TV has become my gold standard of sharpness and clarity. Framemeister output is a close second. I’ve tried various converter boxes from Amazon like the one mentioned here (and there and there and there). They are all distant third place runners when considering only image quality display. I don’t mean to say they are bad or awful. For $20-$30 they are great for giving you a usable image you wouldn’t hesitate to show your friends. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunstar Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 Well, I went ahead and bought one. I'll be back with pictures of it on my systems compared with my Ambery VGA converter. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faicuai Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 (edited) Im always game for trying new converters. Last night I searched eBay and found a DVDO converter listed for sale and bought one of the available units. When it arrives I will compare it to my Framemeister. Two weekends ago I picked up a 42 Panasonic plasma TV that has three S-Video inputs from a local thrift store. The image shown by that TV has become my gold standard of sharpness and clarity. Framemeister output is a close second. Ive tried various converter boxes from Amazon like the one mentioned here (and there and there and there). They are all distant third place runners when considering only image quality display. I dont mean to say they are bad or awful. For $20-$30 they are great for giving you a usable image you wouldnt hesitate to show your friends. Nice!!! ...There´s someone providing valid input about products that they can afford or they simply use!!! :-) Which model did you buy? In any case, here's an excellent primer on this subject (as well as a sound approach to effectively mitigate or eliminate legacy CRTs): https://youtu.be/lHoOKLWIMKU Good still pictures can be delivered in several ways... but when motion kicks in, lights go off for the vast majority of these "solutions"... Only THEN we can see who's who... Cheers! Edited June 13, 2019 by Faicuai 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faicuai Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 (edited) Nice!!! ...There´s someone providing valid input about products that they can afford or they simply use!!! :-) Which model did you buy? In any case, here's an excellent primer on this subject (as well as a sound approach to effectively mitigate or eliminate legacy CRTs): Good still pictures can be delivered in several ways... but when motion kicks in, lights go off for the vast majority of these "solutions"... Only THEN we can see who's who... Cheers! BTW, here's is My-Life-in-Gaming's main sound theme, from Matthew McCheskey: Talk about a totally underrated piece of sound work, with plenty of depth and a special retro-like notes... Whoa! Edited June 14, 2019 by Faicuai Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chad5200 Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 Where you the one that had me test Flickerterm with my Ambery S-video-to-VGA converter? I don't know if that's the one converter that works with it that you are referring too, but it does properly display on the ambery according to whom ever I did test it for and posted screen shots... Another thing I love about the Ambery converters is there is absolutely no perceivable lag, to me, between playing games through it compared to straight video into the TV, just a better picture since I use S-video through it instead of composite since my TV doesn't have S-video. I still can't recommend Ambery converters enough. Well worth the somewhere between $60-$100 I spent on them based on model, etc. I've got two, a RGB/YPbPr-to-VGA I've had for a dozen years and still use with Atari Jaguar and Sega Genesis, and the S-video-to-VGA I've had for 7 years, for my PAL Atari 1200XL & other video/s-video-only systems. I just want another video/S-video converter for my 800 in another room, but this time I want to go with a video/S-video-to-HDMI, but I want one that can successfully do PAL too, as I intend to use it with the PAL 1200XL and use the Ambery VGA one with the 800 on a CRT VGA monitor. But for $20 this cheapo one is looking impressive on Dr. V's machines with upgraded video. I'd still like to see it do PAL though...if PAL signals working right with this box can be confirmed, Then I will get one too and post screen shots of it on both my PAL 1200XL with Supervideo 2.1 (1200XL chroma boost edition) upgrade and from my Stock 800's S-video comparing this cheapo video-to-HDMI with the Ambery video-to-VGA. I have a new digital camera that can take sharper, clearer images than my phone cameras. Be careful with recommending Ambery... they discontinued the good converter and replaced it with one that doesn't work with the 8-bits. https://atariage.com/forums/topic/279294-ambery-s-video-to-hdmi-converter-scaler/page-2?do=findComment&comment=4269493 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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