NetUSBee USB basic setup help for storage please

[256 colors]

Using NETUSB04 software

Did i need to format USB key in a certain way first?

On the key at the moment i have USBTOOL.ACC  in the root of the USB key and FREEMINT and TOSMAGIC folders

I don't have any interest in mouse/keyboard/networking or partitions yet

 

At the moment with NetUSBee and USB key installed when i boot up the STE i have to install disk drive as C this shows up empty as cartridge

[6BQ5]

Hmmm! Troubleshooting!

 

Do you have all the drivers loaded in your floppy's AUTO folder in the right order?

 

Do the drivers locate and identify your USB based storage? You should see the name of the device pop-up during the scanning step. If not then the USB storage may not be compatible with the NetUSBee hardware and software. I had to try a few devices before I found one that worked. A 8GB SanDisk Cruzer Fit does not work on my system ... but, the 32GB version is just fine. Eventually I settled on a 16GB Kingston brand. The Cruzer was too small for me to grip.

 

I don't remember having to reformat the USB storage device at a low level (i.e. from FAT32 to FAT16 or exFAT). Once NetUSBee finds the storage device all I had to do was partition it. I used HDDriver from Uwe Seimet. Once the storage device is partitioned just reboot the machine. Let the drivers load in order from your AUTO folder. Add your icons for drives C to P.

 

Be sure to use a capital "C" - not a lowercase "c". A lowercase "c" is the cartridge port.

 

I don't load the USBTOOL.ACC. It's for hot-swapping the USB device and I don't do that as much as I thought I would.

 

I don't have any experience with FreeMiNT or TOS Magic.

[6BQ5]

Two links below for reference :

 

http://atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=33266

 

and ...

 

http://atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=34355

 

Just in case there are others here who may not know about Atari-Forum threads.

[256 colors]

The USB here is a 16GB Kingston DataTraveler G4 i have tried 8 other keys when i install them i get error drive does not exist

No matter what i do in the AUTO folder i cannot set files in this order  USB.PRG <device drivers> NETUSBEE.PRG without the file keep swapping dunno if that's the problem?

Before i go out and waste money does anybody know of actual USB key brand and type that works be specific please about the model also
    

Edited June 29, 2019 by 256 colors

[6BQ5]

I checked my Kingston unit and it is also a 16GB DataTraveler G4.

 

Here is how I ordered my drivers.

 

1) Rename your current AUTO folder on the floppy disk to something like AUTO.OLD.

2) Create a new AUTO folder on the floppy disk.

3) Open the AUTO.OLD folder in one window and open the freshly created AUTO folder in another window, side by side.

4) Copy the files from AUTO.OLD to AUTO one by one in the order they should execute.

    1st) USB.PRG

    2nd) STORAGE.PRG

    3rd) NETUSBEE.PRG

5) Delete your AUTO.OLD folder.

 

There are various programs that claim to sort and reorder files on a disk. I didn't have any success with them. Only wasted a lot of time with them.

 

If your file structure gets too big then you may need to add the Cookie Jar and Folder patches. You'll know because your machine will crash. Those patches need to be placed in the AUTO folder before any of the USB drives. Lots of trial and error for me to figure that one out.

 

I run two NetUSBee cartridges. One is on a USA STe with USA TOS 2.06 and the other is a UK STe with UK TOS 1.06. I use the same Kingston USB device in both.

 

I do not load or use USBTOOL.ACC.

 

NetUSBee is slow and clunky. The drivers consume a lot of memory. However, I think it is still the best solution (only solution?) if you have a "bad" DMA chip. It's better than a Megafile. Compatibility is an issue only for some games and demos. In that case, just run them from a floppy. I imagine if you have a GoTek or something similar then a floppy image is no big deal. Applications usually have no problems because they don't rely on tricks or leveraging bugs in the system to their advantage.

 

One note : initial boot-up will read the DESKTOP.INF / NEWDESK.INF from your floppy disk. When changing resolutions or saving *.INF files the machine will work on the newly mounted C drive. Be sure to keep your *.INF files synchronized between your USB device and floppy disk.

[256 colors]

1) Rename your current AUTO folder on the floppy disk to something like AUTO.OLD.

2) Create a new AUTO folder on the floppy disk.

3) Open the AUTO.OLD folder in one window and open the freshly created AUTO folder in another window, side by side.

4) Copy the files from AUTO.OLD to AUTO one by one in the order they should execute.

    1st) USB.PRG

    2nd) STORAGE.PRG

    3rd) NETUSBEE.PRG

5) Delete your AUTO.OLD folder.

 

Did not work?

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Well, this does not look as some advertisement for NetUsBee. OK, it's initial aim was not mass storage - work with Pen drives. I guess that problems with many of them are just because newer are designed for high speed, like USB 3 standard. While NetUsBee using some very old USB chip, and slow, of course. Success rate would be better with older Pen drives, I guess. Only that they are smaller capacity. Or maybe Sandisk ?

 

I wanted to write approx. same about AUTO folder as what 6BQ5 wrote ?

Considering driver SW: normal way is to have so called AUTOboot driver on media - and that should do all, without extra files in AUTO folder. In other words, whoever wrote this drivers did not it in proper Atari TOS/AHDI way.

Btw. IDE adapter is very good and cheap way (if owner can soldering), and very fast.  Even as today CF cards are not cheap and easy to find it may be good via IDE-SD adapter.

 

Something here does not look right: what about TOS/DOS compatibility ? You perform partitioning with Hddriver. What type of partitions ? Are they accessible on Windows, Linux, MAC ?

I ask because at AF was talk about need for program BigDOS - what is extension for accessing DOS type partitions under TOS.

 

 

[256 colors]

You guys are losing me a bit here i don't have any access too floppy disks or floppy drives on the PC here or the STE they don't exist

The only drives are the GoTek internal drive a external real floppy drive that's not connected and CUSB - USB Floppy emulator Drive when it's connected

Forget about partitions i can't even read USB stick or keys yet because of this stupid file order shit won't work

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Who said here that you need floppy disks at all for this ? Especially if you have that CUSB . I was talking about accessing your Atari USB stick (Pen drive) on PC - so you can transfer data in simple way.

Not sure that file order is your real problem.

I just want to know with what type of partitions this relative new driver works at all .

[256 colors]

No partitions on this USB key unless i need to make some?

The floppy disks and disks drives was directed at 6BQ5 as he mentioned them

Edited June 29, 2019 by 256 colors

[ParanoidLittleMan]

OK, maybe you don't have Hddriver, so can not perform partitioning with Atari.

Should try this for start:  Attach it to PC, and create just one FAT16 partition on it, not longer than 511 MB.

Actually, better is this:  1   31 MB partition as first, and one 511 MB as second.    After that, next step is to attach it to Atari and install AUTOboot driver - no, that's not going in AUTO folder.

But since this is on cartridge, I guess that no need for this, because ROM of it will activate driver after reset somehow. That would be STORAGE.PRG . 

But, if no STORAGE.PRG in AUTO, it will not work at all, so ....  you need to do all it on PC - huh ! 

So, after creating partitions with Windows .... wait - another nonsense - Windows will normally create only 1 partition, because it is removable drive ! Stupid restriction, and not Tramiel's fault ! Sorry, but can not stay serious ...      Instructions of driver are really messy - "For plain TOS, you
don't need a hard disk drive, you can use a floppy disk. " - What it means ? Works only from floppy in case of TOS ? How to make it work from Pen drive ?

Anyway, should try practically same what I recommended for my very old driver. " Partition drive on PC, use on ST and PC - easy file transfer "

http://atari.8bitchip.info/astams.php

 

Well, it would be good to clarify some elementary things: how to make it work without Hddriver, without floppy - or is it possible without floppy at all (HW emulators count here as it) .

What type of partitions work, what extra SW may be necessary ...

 

Partitioning under Windows: best would be to get some free partitioning tool - and there are such:  http://atari.8bitchip.info/multpremxp.html

Windows-es partitioner is not bad, but as said, there is 1 partition limitation . Unless you install special driver what overrides it.

 

 

[256 colors]

I give up with the  NetUSBee device everything i do nothing works just read file/programs from a USB key it should never be this hard FFS

If i spend any more time with this and it doesn't work i'm gonna take a hammer to this useless fucking peace of shit 

Edited June 29, 2019 by 256 colors

[NasaManf]

If it works that's good if not don't give up but take a break and try it again until you get it.

[6BQ5]

I'm attaching a photograph showing how the NetUSBee drives boot up on my US STe with TOS 2.06. Does your screen look similar to this? If you have the correct order in your AUTO folder and use your Kingston device then we should have similar (or even the same) screens. Notice where the drivers find the Kingston device, near the bottom of the screen. Can you confirm your screen looks similar?

 

If you cannot boot your drivers in order, or doubt they are booting in order, then you can run them one by one from your desktop. That process should work too. It's a little cumbersome but a good way to test each driver one by one.

 

Assuming the correct boot order and the Kingston is recognized then you need to partition the device. The STe cannot natively address or recognize partitions bigger than 512MB. I used HDDriver because it came with my Megafile. ParanoidLittleMan has a very nice program available as well. There may be others available online too. Win10 ought to be able to do this too. Using Win10 may be the easiest and a good time to verify FAT16 formatting. HDDriver can do this too but Win10 PC will be faster.

 

After partitioning and rebooting create your desktop icons. My desktop has icons "C" through "P", all capital letters. Lowercase "c" is the cartridge port. See my second attachment. I do not use BigDOS or any 3rd party program to extend partitions beyond 512 MB.

 

My Kingston has no R/W access restrictions on STe and Win10. Very easy way to transfer files. Just be sure to eject properly as always. Only "weird" thing is Win10 creates a hidden folder that appears as "SYSTEM~1" on the device. After deleting it Win10 will recreate it. I assume Windows must be storing some window viewing setting there.

 

Do the math and you'll see I have 14 partitions at 512 MB = 7 GB. Yes, 8 GB are simply lost here. However, the single 8 GB device I had didn't work with NetUSBee. *shrug* It is not so easy to find small USB devices anymore so be ready to waste half, if not more, of your available space. That's OK. USB flash storage is cheap. Less than $10.

 

After we get your USB storage device working then we'll work on getting you a USB mouse! That works too ... but I still prefer Atari mouse.

 

I do not have GoTek or other floppy emulator so I don't know all the 1's and 0's about them. I assume you create blank *.ST image file in a ST emulator like Hatari and then treat as regular floppy disk after mounting image in floppy emulator? Too bad there isn't some sort of native support in TOS for USB devices. Then all of this would be easy-peasy.

[256 colors]

I only have look at the NetUSBee i start foaming at the mouth boggling my eyes and grinding my teeth that's how much it's pissing me right off

 

I can't even get past this stage let alone boot anything at all it did not work for me

 

1) Rename your current AUTO folder on the floppy disk to something like AUTO.OLD.

2) Create a new AUTO folder on the floppy disk.

3) Open the AUTO.OLD folder in one window and open the freshly created AUTO folder in another window, side by side.

4) Copy the files from AUTO.OLD to AUTO one by one in the order they should execute.

    1st) USB.PRG

    2nd) STORAGE.PRG

    3rd) NETUSBEE.PRG

5) Delete your AUTO.OLD folder.

Edited June 29, 2019 by 256 colors

[6BQ5]

I wish I had more experience with the floppy emulators to say if your problem is there vs. with the NetUSBee device. Perhaps your problem with NetUSBee is coming from how the floppy emulator is handling files and ordered them in the *.ST file's FAT.

 

This is why I was saying you can bypass the whole AUTO folder for now. Just boot your 1040 STe normally and cleanly (no *.ACC files). Then "insert" a floppy image/disk with the drivers. Double click and run them one at a time in order from the desktop. That ought to work as well. If you can get the drivers to recognize the device then go ahead and run HDDriver (or whatever) to create your 512 MB partitions. After doing that we can go back to creating an AUTO folder.

 

Double-checking : which machine and TOS are you using? I thought you had a UK 1040 STe with UK TOS 1.62.

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Floppy emulator handles it exactly as real floppy disk in this case. Actualy, FDC chip and TOS filesystem are who do here relevant job.

In case of AUTO folder *.PRG files execute just in order in which they were copied there.

 

There may be some strange HW error, of course. Or it is just that for beginner it is too complicated. In any case it could be done much better . For instance they could publish floppy image files (ST or MSA) with all needed files properly put on it . Then it is easy to run from floppy emulator.

 

And important: are there some FAT16 partitions at all on that USB stick ? May be that there is only 1 FAT32 - and that will not work with TOS.

[256 colors]

Right i made some progress on the USB key i now have folders and files in this order

AUTO FOLDER and files inside in this order and they don't change any more

1st) USB.PRG

 2nd) STORAGE.PRG

 3rd) NETUSBEE.PRG

 FREEMINT FOLDER

 USBTOOL.ACC in root of key

 

Does the above look correct?

 

Thank flying fuck i had old win XP disc i had to install or a spare pc just to get this done

Windows 10 has been half the problem stopping me i'm now gonna boot up STE with the key and see what happens

 

Thank flying fuck i had old win XP disc i had to install or a spare pc just to get this done

Windows 10 has been half the problem stopping me i'm now gonna boot up STE with the key and see what happens

 

Edit:and still doesn't fucking work install the drive and its says drive does not exist i'm gonna format the key and try again what do i need FAT16 or FAT32 or something else before i put the new files and folders on?

 

Just so i'm not losing my mind should i be using NETUSB03.zip i ask this because NETUSBEE.PRG  is only place i see this file

All this time been using NETUSB04.zip because it had updated files but noticed no NETUSBEE.PRG  and seems to be replaced with NETUS000.PRG wtf is going on?

Edited June 29, 2019 by 256 colors

[6BQ5]

I am using the latest drivers from Atari-Forum which is (was?) NETUSB04.ZIP.

 

Let's try this. Attached to this message is a ZIP file containing a *.ST image file of my boot floppy. This floppy boots both my US TOS 2.06 and UK TOS 1.06 STe machines. The *.ST file is about 730kB and the ZIP is a teeny-tiny 95kB. Really surprised at that compression ratio!

 

I created the *.ST file using JAY MSA. See the attached image for my settings.

 

Try this floppy image and see how it goes.

NETUSBEE.zip

[256 colors]

Yep loads up fine in the Gotek i see all files but have not done thing with them what's next?

I see files and folders in the GEM desktop

Edited June 29, 2019 by 256 colors

[6BQ5]

With your STe powered down*, insert your Kingston USB device into NetUSBee and plug NetUSBee into your cartridge port. Boot your STe with that floppy image file. Let the drivers in the AUTO folder load in their order. As your system boots up pay attention to the scanning phase of the process. The drivers should recognize the Kingston USB device as shown in my previous JPG attachment.

 

If NetUSBee sees the Kingston device then the next step is to create drive partitions, from C to P. Double clicking on the desktop icons before creating partitions will give you errors.

 

(* I don’t think the cartridge port is a hot-swappable design.)

[256 colors]

Right the scanning  phase works fine and the drivers all load up then it boots into low res GEM desktop hard to work with

I see files in drive A AUTO/CLIPBRD/DOCS/50_60HZ PRG/DESKTOP INF/NEWDESK INF/USBTOOL ACC

I see Desk USB Utility 2 devices NetUSBee Root Hub and Kingston DataTraveler 3.0

I see empty folders: in this order

F USB 4

J USB 8

N USB 12

G USB 5

K USB 9

O USB 13

D USB 2

H USB 6

F USB 4

L USB 10

P USB 14

E USB 3

I USB 7

M USB 11

 

Now as far a making or knowing anything about  partitions on a ST or Windows i know nothing about them it's all new to me so if you don't mind you will have guide me in with baby step by steps (sorry)

 

This you might need to know Drive Select Swap Mod is via toggle switch at the back (for swapping between CUSB - USB Floppy emulator/ Internal GoTek drive as A/B and B/A)

At the moment toggle switch is set A position for the GoTek drive to act as drive A IF the toggle switch is set B position then the CUSB - USB Floppy emulator would act as drive A (i never can use both drives at once that's how it works)

Edited June 30, 2019 by 256 colors

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Sorry ahead 256 colors - this may look little rude what I will say. You want guide.

Here is first thing: little more care about terminology - "empty folders" - then you list what ? According to letters it is not folders but logical drives. In other word partitions.

And here must ask: how there are now 14 logical drives on that Kingston ? Assuming that they are it. Did you perform partitioning ?

Then, what is capacity of them ?  How to read it ? - Click on icon to select it, then File, Show Info .

And try to copy something there, check is it OK .

Instead step by step look this: http://atari.8bitchip.info/astbegfaq.html

 

[256 colors]

The drives do not exist when Click on icon to select it, then File, Show Info .

I have made no partitions yet wouldn't know how too

When i had a Atari STE back in 80's it was mainly used as a games machine i never got use it much for anything else because after month from new it got stolen

So in a way the Atari STE and everything else with it is a learning curve for me coz i never really got use to use it back in the day

Edited June 30, 2019 by 256 colors

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Ah, then it is just DESKTOP.INF what contains those icons ?

 

And here I must add that it was much simpler in past with hard disks. Not because with modern devices it must be complicated. You can do it right now very simple - because there is SW what allows it.  Normally, it goes as it was with early hard disk SW:  you run first program what formats hard disk (now this step is not necessary, and even is not possible), then user sets sizes and number of partitions, program creates them. Last step is installing autoboot driver. After that  reset - and you will have those partitions at hand - did not say at Desktop, because normally only C icon will appear under TOS 1.xx  .  All it can be done in 5-10 minutes. Formatting is what was slow and time consuming, but as said, it's past.

Nobody blames you because don't know well how to deal with this situation. There are many total Atari newbies here too. It is complicated with this drivers, indeed. And all this with partitions, filesystems, what part is handled with disk/adapter, what with OS, what with driver SW is really confusing.