Giles N Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 The 7800 can run the 2600 games. So perhaps the greatest difference would be graphics capability. Why not have some people doing graphics, and HACKs, go over the 2600 games running them as 7800 software, and use the better graphics-capabilities of the 7800? I´m not sure how any of the details work, but if he 7800 runs the programming on the hardware in fairly much the same manner as the 2600, perhaps it would be easy to insert the program as a 7800 thing, and then re-draw the graphics utilizing the stronger capacities of the 7800... Of course some people who like doing graphics would have to spend much time... ...but... ...and here is the question... ...could that easily have made 7800-titles (as to graphics) out of all the 2600-titles... Please let me know your thoughts, concerns,and whatever else drop into your mind reading this... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feralstorm Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) I don't know a lot about the 7800 from a programming standpoint, but my impression is that it's a very different beast than the 2600, despite sharing some hardware, and would largely require rewriting the game from the ground up (perhaps not the game logic or audio, but definitely the 'display kernel') My guess is the concept is about the same as claiming 'hacking' a 2600 game to run on an Apple 2, Commodore 64, or NES would be simple because they use the same base CPU. Edited August 3, 2019 by Feralstorm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 On 7/27/2019 at 7:17 PM, Giles N said: Why not have some people doing graphics, and HACKs, go over the 2600 games running them as 7800 software, and use the better graphics-capabilities of the 7800? I´m not sure how any of the details work, but if he 7800 runs the programming on the hardware in fairly much the same manner as the 2600, perhaps it would be easy to insert the program as a 7800 thing, and then re-draw the graphics utilizing the stronger capacities of the 7800... Hmmmm... a lot to it. I think you can take a 2600 game and hack it so it looks CLOSER to the 7800 version. We have seen this in Dig Dug and a few other games. But unless you change how the characters are set up, are you dealing with one frame of color or two? Are the characters one color overall, or can you assign each line a different color. Are the lines on the 2600 version the same pixel count as the 7800 version (probably not.). And the 7800 is just a different beast graphically as said already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giles N Posted August 4, 2019 Author Share Posted August 4, 2019 43 minutes ago, doctorclu said: Hmmmm... a lot to it. I think you can take a 2600 game and hack it so it looks CLOSER to the 7800 version. We have seen this in Dig Dug and a few other games. But unless you change how the characters are set up, are you dealing with one frame of color or two? Are the characters one color overall, or can you assign each line a different color. Are the lines on the 2600 version the same pixel count as the 7800 version (probably not.). And the 7800 is just a different beast graphically as said already. Ok, so it would have to be re-planned as well as re-drawn, and then reprogrammed? Could be interesting to know how the 7800 operated to be backward compatible with the 2600... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 7800 2600 The 7800 has more pins. So if all the pins are occupied it would play the game in 7800 mode. If only the pins that a 2600 game were occupied, then it would play the games in 2600 mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nukey Shay Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 But it's much deeper than soldering a 2600 game Rom onto a 7800 cartridge board and then expecting it to work Given that 2600 display kernels are intimately tied to their program code (often taking advantage of spare bits here and there that the VCS ignores)….it's going to take an extensive rewrite anyway. Or, one could just build a new 7800 game from scratch where the program code is not assuming to be bound to the VCS specs in the first place. Seems like the easier way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swami Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 On 8/3/2019 at 7:42 PM, Giles N said: Ok, so it would have to be re-planned as well as re-drawn, and then reprogrammed? Could be interesting to know how the 7800 operated to be backward compatible with the 2600... On 8/4/2019 at 10:29 PM, doctorclu said: 7800 2600 The 7800 has more pins. So if all the pins are occupied it would play the game in 7800 mode. If only the pins that a 2600 game were occupied, then it would play the games in 2600 mode. If I'm not mistaken, the 7800 actually contains a separate 2600 board, much like the Colecovision, Intellivision and 5200 had 2600 adapters that were basically 2600s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Mitch Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 No, it does not have a seperate board. Mitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Monkey Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 (edited) On 7/27/2019 at 8:17 PM, Giles N said: ... Please let me know your thoughts, concerns,and whatever else drop into your mind reading this... Sounds like hard work. Edited November 7, 2019 by Lost Monkey . 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swami Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Mitch said: No, it does not have a seperate board. Mitch Does it have separate 2600 and 7800 processing chips, kind of like two consoles on the same board, or have a just mistakenly generalized the method for the other three. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonGrafx-16 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 On 8/2/2019 at 10:32 PM, Feralstorm said: My guess is the concept is about the same as claiming 'hacking' a 2600 game to run on an Apple 2, Commodore 64, or NES would be simple because they use the same base CPU. They did pretty much with the first Atari Flashback. All of the 7800 and 2600 games ran on a NOAC (NES on a chip). I'm not sure how they did it. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Mitch Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 6 hours ago, Swami said: Does it have separate 2600 and 7800 processing chips, kind of like two consoles on the same board, or have a just mistakenly generalized the method for the other three. The BIOS detects whether a 2600 cart or 7800 cart is inserted and switches the system to the appropriate mode. For example; the TIA which is one of the main chips for 2600 mode is used only for audio in 7800 mode. Mitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feralstorm Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 On 11/7/2019 at 8:41 PM, DragonGrafx-16 said: They did pretty much with the first Atari Flashback. All of the 7800 and 2600 games ran on a NOAC (NES on a chip). I'm not sure how they did it. lol Basically, the FB1 games were just newly-made NES-hardware games made to look like 2600 and 7800 games (AKA ports). It's possible some of the original 6502 game code was reused/adapted, but based on how I remember the FB1 games playing, I doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giles N Posted November 16, 2019 Author Share Posted November 16, 2019 So... essentially, 2600 games - would have to be pretty much re-programmed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+darryl1970 Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 On 11/15/2019 at 7:57 PM, Giles N said: So... essentially, 2600 games - would have to be pretty much re-programmed? Correct. Both systems have completely different ways of creating background displays and sprites. They completely unlike each other. They only share bits and pieces. For example the 2600 display and sound are on one chip. The 7800 uses that chip for sound. The Maria graphics chip creates graphics in 7800 mode, and it is completely different from how the 2600 chip works. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinroh Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 (edited) I had considered this with Carrot Kingdom™, before, for seeing if I what I can re-use for a super charged 7800 port. I could re-use some of the code for some of the movement, physics, some of the sound handling, and put a prettier coat of paint over it, but it would require quite a bit of re-coding. Even with some of the similarities to the hardware. Edited June 1, 2020 by Jinroh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+bent_pin Posted June 16, 2023 Share Posted June 16, 2023 On 7/27/2019 at 8:17 PM, Giles N said: I´m not sure how any of the details work The 7800 has a two line frame buffer whereas the 2600 requires a flat out real-time race to place items at a specific time. Essentially every line that has to do with the display would have to be ground up redesigned. As they say in Pittsburgh, "You can't get there from here." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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