Incognito - Now's your chance!

[Jeffrey Worley]

8 hours ago, adam242 said:

There is nothing more elegant than Candle's suggestion of the modification of the light pipe. Did that on my (one of seven) 800s. It's subtle, integrated and 'looks the part'. Screw you, 'perfectionists/ preservationists'. You know who you are.

Easy there tiger.  Don't lump me in with those Martians, I'm just too lazy to do the lightpipe, and several of the machines are going to probable Martians, so that's a serious consideration.

 

Jeff

[flashjazzcat]

8 hours ago, slx said:

To each his own. I‘ll take the same way but no need to be rude about it. 

I think to 'rudeness' precedent was set a long time ago in this thread:

 

 

Perhaps I need to make a follow-up video in which the machine has a proximity sensor fitted which allows the waving of one's hand in the vicinity of the computer to perform an ATR swap.

[Jeffrey Worley]

2 minutes ago, flashjazzcat said:

I think to 'rudeness' precedent was set a long time ago in this thread:

 

 

Perhaps I need to make a follow-up video in which the machine has a proximity sensor fitted which allows the waving of one's hand in the vicinity of the computer to perform an ATR swap.

I'd actually contemplated this breifly and discarded the idea as too difficult or too sensitive, too many unknowns.  I'm really glad someone took it up.  That is really cool, the proximity switch.

 

Jeff

/s

 

[flashjazzcat]

LOL.

[TGB1718]

10 hours ago, spspspsp said:

I tried something different for my ATR switch.

 

I installed an AT42QT1070 capacitive sensor board on my power PCB. The green wire in the photo leads to pin 3 of the ATR switch header on the Incognito (which, confusingly, is referred to as the "first" pin elsewhere in this thread). The white wire currently just leads outside of the case, and to swap disks I just move my hand next to the wire. The red/black wires are hooked up to 5V and GND on the power PCB.

 

I have plans to connect the white wire to copper tape that I have attached to a surface inside the A800 case. Then, to swap disks, I just touch the outside of the case corresponding to where the tape is. I have already tested that the board can detect my hand through the plastic. Easy.

 

Also, there is a green LED that lights up when the sensor is triggered. I can see that LED through the gaps around the keyboard/power key, etc. That provides some subtle visual confirmation that things are working.

 

 

Nice solution, I was thinking along the lines of a reed switch inside the case, but obviously you would need a small magnet to

operate it and with the possibility of 'real' floppy disks being use too, probably not the best idea ☠️

[Faicuai]

On 11/14/2019 at 10:08 AM, flashjazzcat said:

 

(...) Some of you will already be aware that I have tuned out some of the most billowing gas-bags on the forum (although quoted content remains an unwelcome reminder of their existence), but since even a stopped clock is right twice a day (...).

...What happens when simply being unable to handle the difference between qualifying a CONCEPT / IDEA, vs. qualifying PEOPLE... And then crying because of the "rough" talk-back...

 

?

 

 

 

[Faicuai]

10 hours ago, spspspsp said:

I tried something different for my ATR switch.

 

I installed an AT42QT1070 capacitive sensor board on my power PCB. The green wire in the photo leads to pin 3 of the ATR switch header on the Incognito (which, confusingly, is referred to as the "first" pin elsewhere in this thread). The white wire currently just leads outside of the case, and to swap disks I just move my hand next to the wire. The red/black wires are hooked up to 5V and GND on the power PCB.

 

I have plans to connect the white wire to copper tape that I have attached to a surface inside the A800 case. Then, to swap disks, I just touch the outside of the case corresponding to where the tape is. I have already tested that the board can detect my hand through the plastic. Easy.

 

Also, there is a green LED that lights up when the sensor is triggered. I can see that LED through the gaps around the keyboard/power key, etc. That provides some subtle visual confirmation that things are working.

 

 

VERY nice  (and original) (!!!)

 

And, unless missing other details, it also seems free of trace-cuts, PCB drilling, etc.

 

Gotta love the craftmanship of that work! Nice to see folks working with attention to detail!

 

 

 

Edited November 26, 2019 by Faicuai

[Jeffrey Worley]

31 minutes ago, TGB1718 said:

 

Nice solution, I was thinking along the lines of a reed switch inside the case, but obviously you would need a small magnet to

operate it and with the possibility of 'real' floppy disks being use too, probably not the best idea ☠️

You've really got your work cut out for you to damage a floppy with a permanent magnet.  Even if you mean to do it, it probably won't affect the disk.  The flux at the head is way higher than just about any environmental factor you can think of under which the machine is expected to operate.  Magnetic media is good stuff.

 

Jeff

[toddtmw]

Just now, Jeffrey Worley said:

You've really got your work cut out for you to damage a floppy with a permanent magnet.  Even if you mean to do it, it probably won't affect the disk.  The flux at the head is way higher than just about any environmental factor you can think of under which the machine is expected to operate.  Magnetic media is good stuff.

 

Jeff

You mean the urban legend about the kid who put the floppy with his term paper on it in the refrigerator with a magnet and lost everything is not true?

[Jeffrey Worley]

3 hours ago, toddtmw said:

You mean the urban legend about the kid who put the floppy with his term paper on it in the refrigerator with a magnet and lost everything is not true?

I'd guess it not to be true.  It is hard to get a disk to stick to the refrigerator with any standard reefer magnet.  But even powerful modern rare-earth magnets aren't enough.

 

And Mikey did not blow up from eating pop rocks and drinking coca cola.  ?

[Tempest]

Got a question for everyone.  Does anyone else have a problem where the Incognito BIOS setup screen from the FJC firmware is VERY bright?  Games, BASIC, and DOS all look fine, but the setup screen is super bright to the point where I had it start causing interference on one of my other monitors (the sides of the image were wavy and bent where the bright white text was).  It's not a brightness issue with my monitor either, as everything else looks good and even on the setup screen the black is dark, but the text is super bright.  I used one of the alternate colors and that seems to help, but I can still see some minor interference in the image if I look closely.  I was just curious if this means I need to do some sort of video mod on my 800 or if the setup screen just uses the brightest possible luminance for some reason and I shouldn't worry about it?  I know some people replace the R189 resistor, but when I looked at it the value was already 150 Ohms which I think is what the recommended value is.

 

BTW this is on a decent quality Sony CRT, not an LCD or flat screen TV.

[flashjazzcat]

1 hour ago, Tempest said:

Does anyone else have a problem where the Incognito BIOS setup screen from the FJC firmware is VERY bright?

Luma is overdriven on the 800. Replace R189 (75 Ohm) with 200-220 Ohm resistor.

[Tempest]

24 minutes ago, flashjazzcat said:

Luma is overdriven on the 800. Replace R189 (75 Ohm) with 200-220 Ohm resistor.

It has an 150 Ohm resistor in it right now not 75.  You think I should still swap in a 200-220 Ohm though?

[flashjazzcat]

Just now, Tempest said:

It has an 150 Ohm resistor in it right now not 75.  You think I should still swap in a 200-220 Ohm though?

I am not sure. If your monitor reacts adversely to luma $0F with a properly attenuated signal, there is something awry with it regardless of whether it looks OK with 'everything else'.

[Tempest]

I suppose it couldn't hurt to try a 200 ohm resistor. 

[adam242]

12 hours ago, Jeffrey Worley said:

Easy there tiger.  Don't lump me in with those Martians, I'm just too lazy to do the lightpipe, and several of the machines are going to probable Martians, so that's a serious consideration.

 

Jeff

 

Apologies. I sometimes lose my filter after a couple of drinks and start spouting (what I believe to be) unassailable truths. At any rate, my comment was not directed at you.

 

I DO believe Candle's original design to be elegant and truly inspired. If done properly, it does not alter the outward appearance of the machine in any way. Who cares about an unseen hole in the power board?

[+DrVenkman]

7 minutes ago, adam242 said:

I DO believe Candle's original design to be elegant and truly inspired. If done properly, it does not alter the outward appearance of the machine in any way. Who cares about an unseen hole in the power board?

[+slx]

On 11/26/2019 at 5:52 AM, spspspsp said:

I tried something different for my ATR switch.

 

I installed an AT42QT1070 capacitive sensor board on my power PCB.

 

Very elegant solution! Thanks for sharing. Can this also be used for switches that need to be in a certain state during power-up or reset, e.g. to switch between OSes? Or is it just good for momentary switching?

[cbelcher]

On 11/25/2019 at 11:52 PM, spspspsp said:

I tried something different for my ATR switch.

 

I installed an AT42QT1070 capacitive sensor board on my power PCB. The green wire in the photo leads to pin 3 of the ATR switch header on the Incognito (which, confusingly, is referred to as the "first" pin elsewhere in this thread). The white wire currently just leads outside of the case, and to swap disks I just move my hand next to the wire. The red/black wires are hooked up to 5V and GND on the power PCB.

 

I have plans to connect the white wire to copper tape that I have attached to a surface inside the A800 case. Then, to swap disks, I just touch the outside of the case corresponding to where the tape is. I have already tested that the board can detect my hand through the plastic. Easy.

 

Also, there is a green LED that lights up when the sensor is triggered. I can see that LED through the gaps around the keyboard/power key, etc. That provides some subtle visual confirmation that things are working.

 

What is the power supply to the capacitive IC?  Is it 3.3v from the Incognito?  Where did you pick it off?  I'm afraid of the capacitive IC output switching between GND and 5v if the 800 power supply is used - flashjazzcat talked about how sensitive the Incognito is to 5v with his own LED / ATR switch mod.

 

Thanks!

 

 

[spspspsp]

7 hours ago, slx said:

Very elegant solution! Thanks for sharing. Can this also be used for switches that need to be in a certain state during power-up or reset, e.g. to switch between OSes? Or is it just good for momentary switching?

Not with this driver. This is a momentary toggle that drives the output low (to GND). For a latching switch you could use an AT42QT1012, but without looking at the datasheet I don't know if that would survive a reset/being powered off.

[spspspsp]

1 hour ago, cbelcher said:

What is the power supply to the capacitive IC?  Is it 3.3v from the Incognito?  Where did you pick it off?  I'm afraid of the capacitive IC output switching between GND and 5v if the 800 power supply is used - flashjazzcat talked about how sensitive the Incognito is to 5v with his own LED / ATR switch mod.

It takes +5V DC directly from the power board (voltage values are printed on the silkscreen on the bottom of the PCB). It can actually take anywhere from 1.8V to 5.5V DC, which is pretty convenient. The output is disconnected when the switch is not toggled, and when toggled, is driven low. Installed correctly it shouldn't cause any issues.

Edited November 27, 2019 by spspspsp

[spspspsp]

22 hours ago, Jeffrey Worley said:

You've really got your work cut out for you to damage a floppy with a permanent magnet. 

Place a laptop on a floppy, with the (non-SSD) hard disk directly over the floppy, and do stuff on the computer. I've done it.

 

This also causes really interesting, and long-lasting, field patterns to appear in phone LCD screens (old ones, at least).

[Faicuai]

On 11/26/2019 at 9:06 AM, Jeffrey Worley said:

Easy there tiger.  Don't lump me in with those Martians, I'm just too lazy to do the lightpipe, and several of the machines are going to probable Martians, so that's a serious consideration.

 

Jeff

 

Martians (e,g, "from Mars", not from "Venus") are the only business in town!

 

The only ones that will NEVER complain about asset-appreciation, and will not self-inflict upon them asset-depreciation. In other words, the only ones capable of driving up the value for those us who already have the equipment they are looking for!

 

Make sure your HW shows with proven origin and condition, tidy and with top-notch inside-work, so you get top dollar$$ for it!

 

Otherwise... plenty of yellowed / irrelevant crumbles out there, already.

Edited November 27, 2019 by Faicuai

[adam242]

10 hours ago, Faicuai said:

 

Martians (e,g, "from Mars", not from "Venus") are the only business in town!

 

The only ones that will NEVER complain about asset-appreciation, and will not self-inflict upon them asset-depreciation. In other words, the only ones capable of driving up the value for those us who already have the equipment they are looking for!

 

Make sure your HW shows with proven origin and condition, tidy and with top-notch inside-work, so you get top dollar$$ for it!

 

Otherwise... plenty of yellowed / irrelevant crumbles out there, already.

Asset blah blah blah.... you're missing the point. Very few of us here are concerned about the market value of our Ataris. We'll probably take them to our graves. I'll enjoy mine until it's time to throw it in the ground with me.

[+DrVenkman]

6 hours ago, adam242 said:

Very few of us here are concerned about the market value of our Ataris.

Further, “market value” is key. When we all start to (further) die off, this stuff all reverts to the status of “worthless crap taking up space” that it was in the 90’s and into the mid-Aughts. We are the only generation with an emotional attachment to it, and nostalgia is the biggest value driver in vintage computing. Sure, for Apple I’s and early SBC’s, rarity is the driver and always will be, but for mass-market consumer devices built by the millions, they have never been super rare. While rarity is certainly increasing, the population of people who give a shit is certainly decreasing. 

 

So it’s your (mine, our) machine. Do what you want to it. Life’s too short for someone to tell you how to have fun.