candle Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 This is very preliminary, and not everything works as it should, but it does do something... board is connected through standard vbxe breakout board for atari xe series that was soldered in as low as it was possible on CPU board, and then ribbon cable with male and female connectors was fed through the cutout in expansion bay plastic cover just under aluminium casting as for clock, you need to remove Q103 and connec a wire from VBXE 3.5mhz clock out signal to pin D of CPU board connector D6xx signal is present on pin P of SLOT3 expansion connector and all the other signal are provided by Incognito PBI connector for CSYNC, output from LUMA signal (R189) was used and this concludes current state of the installation do not treat this as a definitive guide, as just some things do work, but maybe some of you would like to try to install it anyways 7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 That's the only excuse I need to find a use for the weird green VBXE I have here which doesn't work when a SIDE2 is plugged into the host machine. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted September 3, 2019 Share Posted September 3, 2019 I don’t see my demos on the screen but I guess they won’t work as it’s an 48k model Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 3, 2019 Share Posted September 3, 2019 There's a megabyte in there. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted September 3, 2019 Author Share Posted September 3, 2019 none of the demos work so far i've managed to make 1200xl example working, but this is it i need to spend some time on this to investigate this futher, and i was hoping someone would make such attempt too to compare results Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 3, 2019 Share Posted September 3, 2019 23 minutes ago, candle said: i was hoping someone would make such attempt too to compare results Time allowing, I can try. I remember asking you about sourcing the EXTSEL or CASINH signal in the past... was I over-complicating things and missing the obvious here as usual? Complete list of less-obvious connections would greatly facilitate me having a go at this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faicuai Posted September 3, 2019 Share Posted September 3, 2019 On 9/2/2019 at 2:26 PM, candle said: This is very preliminary, and not everything works as it should, but it does do something... board is connected through standard vbxe breakout board for atari xe series that was soldered in as low as it was possible on CPU board, and then ribbon cable with male and female connectors was fed through the cutout in expansion bay plastic cover just under aluminium casting as for clock, you need to remove Q103 and connec a wire from VBXE 3.5mhz clock out signal to pin D of CPU board connector D6xx signal is present on pin P of SLOT3 expansion connector and all the other signal are provided by Incognito PBI connector for CSYNC, output from LUMA signal (R189) was used and this concludes current state of the installation do not treat this as a definitive guide, as just some things do work, but maybe some of you would like to try to install it anyways HUGE progress without a doubt... ...but I also don't have any doubt that design and development of "VB-800" is definitely required... one that will plug ribbon in ANTIC socket of CPU-board, then connect with FULL-size board plugged into SLOT-3 of expansion bay (hosting twin and switchable PAL/NTSCs ANTICs there), leveraging the large and generous board-size (for enabling much more functionality than standard VBXE/XL) and complete required signal-samping from its own Slot-3, plus neighbor Incognito in Slot-0, plus anything else from the nearest sampling points, and try to keep it as simple as Incognito install, if possible. Can't see any problems requiring Incognito for VB-800, becase most of VBXE/XL titles have been developed precisely on that (XL/XE) environment... so Incognito will be mandatory (this pull-through sales, for sure). A special bundle price may be in order, as well... I think it's about time.... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted September 4, 2019 Author Share Posted September 4, 2019 there is no economical reason to make another pcb just for 800, but there might be reason for a carrier board that would allow easy installation in slot 3 please remember you need to have stock of components to make production run, and then you'll end up having a stock of assembled boards that may sit for a while in the storage before they find any buyers having companies as lotharek is nice, because you can buy what you need when you need it, but on the other side of things there is owfull pile of money frozen 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 On 9/2/2019 at 7:26 PM, candle said: as for clock, you need to remove Q103 and connec a wire from VBXE 3.5mhz clock out signal to pin D of CPU board connector Would this not be pin D of the CPU board connector? Tried D - nothing. Continuity suggested pin C; tried that and the machine powers up off the VBXE clock signal. Just need to make PBI connections and hook up a DIN13 jack... only thing that may bring things to a halt is if neither of these green VBXEs work correctly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted September 4, 2019 Author Share Posted September 4, 2019 i've tested one from Sloopy and one prototype from Lotharek, both behaved silimary, but a bit diffrent albeit of working just as expected in "normal" computer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 6 minutes ago, candle said: but a bit diffrent albeit of working just as expected in "normal" computer I'll be interested to know what this different behaviour is... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faicuai Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 6 hours ago, candle said: there is no economical reason to make another pcb just for 800, but there might be reason for a carrier board that would allow easy installation in slot 3 please remember you need to have stock of components to make production run, and then you'll end up having a stock of assembled boards that may sit for a while in the storage before they find any buyers having companies as lotharek is nice, because you can buy what you need when you need it, but on the other side of things there is owfull pile of money frozen Trying to take advantage of already ordered parts (and built) VBXEs (maybe on Lotharek's stock?) and find a way to flush them out by selling them to 800-users makes total sense, if cash has been already sunk on inventory. And if that is the path chosen, then it will be. However, a special product ("VB-800") for a special platform (the 800, which offers TONS of space for expansion) lends itself to a build-to-order approach. In other words, in a case like this, you will NOT buy parts in advance, materials, make prior commitments to manufacturers, etc. Instead, you will COLLECT all necessary cash up-front, during a specific period of time (published here), then proceed to order and build "VB-800", and then ship (also within an estimated shipping time-frame, published up-front, and within certain logical boundaries). In this way, you will seek the support from those users out-there that really value the product (and the platform, as well). Worst case scenario, if a minimum critical-mass is not achieved to ensure the implied cost-structure (e.g. minimal # of buyers) , then either refund every buyer, or simply increase sell-price to enable production to a smaller audience. This would be perfectly acceptable for a special product (maybe not so for an ordinary one, though), as long as these principles are stated up-front. We will all know exactly the rules of the process. You current reputation as a solid and talented HW developer will be the best credentials to back up such approach, so you guys are free to engineer and build the right product, for the right platform. Either way, let's see how far can we get with the existing product. Bring it on! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 It works: Since this machine already has the Super Color CPU Card (with excellent s-video output), difference in picture quality is hardly noticeable, but it's a fun hack nevertheless. If this were to be a permanent fixture, I think I'd make room for a DIN13 mounted to the PCB at the very rear of the power board (as per my 400 s-video mods). Easiest way to avoid bulk on the CPU board seems to me to be to solder other end of ribbon cable to the back side of the ANTIC socket. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted September 4, 2019 Author Share Posted September 4, 2019 did you test anything vbxe specific? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 Just now, candle said: did you test anything vbxe specific? Not yet... the ribbon cable connection is so flimsy I can barely keep colours stable at the moment. Later this evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 Had a quick try: core not detected. VBXE could be faulty, although AVR light does make an appearance. Tried the other green VBXE and it's totally dead. Got one spare Lotharek board (pre-allocated for another machine), but since it's an XL version and soldered to the bloody ANTIC adapter, it won't fit with current cable lengths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted September 4, 2019 Author Share Posted September 4, 2019 if you want, you can send those green ones to my place i should be able to fix them vbxe core not detected - it could be - the same story here, despite of some examples working i'll remove vbxe detection from HL or robbo and give it a try - i would suspect it works just fine, although i can't use core manager at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 2 hours ago, candle said: i've tested one from Sloopy and one prototype from Lotharek, both behaved silimary, but a bit diffrent albeit of working just as expected in "normal" computer Wow - someone actually got a VBXE from sloopy? Colour me amazed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted September 4, 2019 Author Share Posted September 4, 2019 it was as bad as this? I didn't know i've received mine before troubles started i guess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 28 minutes ago, candle said: if you want, you can send those green ones to my place i should be able to fix them vbxe core not detected - it could be - the same story here, despite of some examples working Thank you: I may take you up on that. In any case, the only example I tried so far was Lamers Old School Demo. FC.COM detected the device (via AVR, obviously) OK. 15 minutes ago, Stephen said: Wow - someone actually got a VBXE from sloopy? Colour me amazed. Had three here, none of which were originally intended for me (I was UK conduit for delivery), but most buyers lost interest by the time they arrived. One board I actually paid 50 GBP for only to discover later on that it was faulty. Two remain: one got destroyed with a hammer in frustration last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 Managed to fit the Lotharek VBXE: same result, so FX core problems lie on the 800 side of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 (edited) @candle: can you get S_VBXE.SYS to install? It doesn't work for me with either a known good or Sloopy VBXE. Edited September 4, 2019 by flashjazzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted September 4, 2019 Author Share Posted September 4, 2019 please update your incognito's cpld i found one bug that got unnoticed since it only manifest if you actually connect something to that PBI connector main.jed 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 4 minutes ago, candle said: please update your incognito's cpld i found one bug that got unnoticed since it only manifest if you actually connect something to that PBI connector main.jed 122.64 kB · 2 downloads I can never keep which is the latest straight. I really have to start renaming stuff instead of just downloading it... this is all the latest plus a pbi fix then? icpldpbi.jed is what I'll call it then... is there a definitive revisions text some place... could be useful to determine if an update is needed or not or let us test for whatever revision in possibly on a machine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candle Posted September 4, 2019 Author Share Posted September 4, 2019 please treat it as experimental one final will be released separatly with apriopriate filename revision takes some space inside cpld logic, space i propably don't have, but will try to make this happend as it would be usefull 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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