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CollectorVision Phoenix Release Thread

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On 12/23/2020 at 1:46 PM, digress said:

There are more phoenix games with or coleco enhanced f18a games coming: I'm not sure what one will be finished first but probably the hex game.

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beLjzIoDPeE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZW5erbDjzI&t=0s
https://youtu.be/-uGBhiLZYQw?t=286

 

 

I like the look of Hex and Barbarian but there's a couple of things I don't like and not being a programmer, I have no idea if the finished product would still have these.  Firstly I thought the scrolling was still jerky and I thought the F18a mode would give smooth scrolling.  Also, I hate it when a character is inside a black rectangle and when said character is in front of a background feature, the black rectangle completely obscures it.  Just hate that so much.  Hope it's just a case of needing more polish.

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34 minutes ago, insertclevernamehere said:

I like the look of Hex and Barbarian but there's a couple of things I don't like and not being a programmer, I have no idea if the finished product would still have these.  Firstly I thought the scrolling was still jerky and I thought the F18a mode would give smooth scrolling.  Also, I hate it when a character is inside a black rectangle and when said character is in front of a background feature, the black rectangle completely obscures it.  Just hate that so much.  Hope it's just a case of needing more polish.

yeah lack of polish so far. The box is annoying and might have to remove the element. It works better on the all black bg.

 

Smooth scroll is implemented but not in that video of it. MOre to come but i don't want to hikack this thread so over here. I love feedback

 

 

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Phoenix production Update:
The Phoenix PCBs are in the process of being produced and we should be on track to ship out at the end of March.
The issue that delayed production was due to sporadic control with the Roller controller. This turned out to have nothing to do with the board itself and instead was caused by the power to the roller controller. Even though it was getting the "proper" voltage, there was no common ground connection between the Phoenix and the roller controller, which caused noise in the signals and the position to jump around. The way to solve this is to use the Phoenix to power the roller controller.
We are working on an expansion port adapter that will address some issues:
-On Rev1 Phoenix's there would be an HDMI passthrough to resolve the HDMI power backfeed issue
-There would be some dipswitches to set the default scanline, sprite limit, and encoder disable. The encoder disable switch would be set so that custom controllers do not cause games to lock up or have other issues by disabling the controller port Pin 7 and Pin 9 inputs
-Roller controller Power port- This would provide a port that the power connector for the Roller controller could plug into so no external power would be needed.
This adapter is still just in the Proof of Concept Phase but something we are looking to release at a later date.
20201207_155459.thumb.jpg.940564fd270e18e20ec53da166d7467d.jpg20201207_155509.thumb.jpg.958e7f011357fc5a21ed55cbe0de68d9.jpg
 
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Wasn't the CV core also being rewritten to address some issues with some TVs as well?  I think it had something to do with a timing issue. And I thought the hope was to have it done this past fall.

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11 hours ago, Bmack36 said:

On Rev1 Phoenix's there would be an HDMI passthrough to resolve the HDMI power backfeed issue

Are you saying you will be offering a passthrough component to everyone who purchased a Rev1 Phoenix (like me)? I have to admit this problem is a little annoying on my Phoenix, because it messes up the system when I switch carts, and I have to press the reset button every time for the game to boot properly.

 

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17 hours ago, Bmack36 said:
We are working on an expansion port adapter that will address some issues:
-There would be some dipswitches to set the default scanline, sprite limit, and encoder disable. The encoder disable switch would be set so that custom controllers do not cause games to lock up or have other issues by disabling the controller port Pin 7 and Pin 9 inputs
 
 

Might a small ferrite bead inline on pins 7 and 9 possibly solve the problem caused by noise on these lines?  It's been discussed about a large ferrite bead on the entirety of a controllers cable, but I was wondering if a much more discrete, and internal, solution might be possible.  Using something like this perhaps : https://content.kemet.com/datasheets/KEM_LF0070_BEAD-L.pdf

 

One could cut, or desolder the internal legs of a controller port's pins 7 and 9 and solder one of these through hole ferrite beads inline.  Or would the attenuation that these provide be inadequate?  Thoughts?

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17 hours ago, Bmack36 said:
Phoenix production Update:
The Phoenix PCBs are in the process of being produced and we should be on track to ship out at the end of March.
The issue that delayed production was due to sporadic control with the Roller controller. This turned out to have nothing to do with the board itself and instead was caused by the power to the roller controller. Even though it was getting the "proper" voltage, there was no common ground connection between the Phoenix and the roller controller, which caused noise in the signals and the position to jump around. The way to solve this is to use the Phoenix to power the roller controller.
We are working on an expansion port adapter that will address some issues:
-On Rev1 Phoenix's there would be an HDMI passthrough to resolve the HDMI power backfeed issue
-There would be some dipswitches to set the default scanline, sprite limit, and encoder disable. The encoder disable switch would be set so that custom controllers do not cause games to lock up or have other issues by disabling the controller port Pin 7 and Pin 9 inputs
-Roller controller Power port- This would provide a port that the power connector for the Roller controller could plug into so no external power would be needed.
This adapter is still just in the Proof of Concept Phase but something we are looking to release at a later date.
20201207_155459.thumb.jpg.940564fd270e18e20ec53da166d7467d.jpg20201207_155509.thumb.jpg.958e7f011357fc5a21ed55cbe0de68d9.jpg
 

So, to be clear, are these developments going to be built into the 2nd batch units and then offered as a peripheral for the first batch units? Also, do any of the developments address the picture/sound compatibility issues with some modern TVs?

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11 minutes ago, Ikrananka said:

Might a small ferrite bead inline on pins 7 and 9 possibly solve the problem caused by noise on these lines?  It's been discussed about a large ferrite bead on the entirety of a controllers cable, but I was wondering if a much more discrete, and internal, solution might be possible.  Using something like this perhaps : https://content.kemet.com/datasheets/KEM_LF0070_BEAD-L.pdf

 

One could cut, or desolder the internal legs of a controller port's pins 7 and 9 and solder one of these through hole ferrite beads inline.  Or would the attenuation that these provide be inadequate?  Thoughts?

I tried multiple ferrite beads at the beginning and end of the controller cords for the roller controller and it had no effect on the glitching. 

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22 minutes ago, Swami said:

So, to be clear, are these developments going to be built into the 2nd batch units and then offered as a peripheral for the first batch units? Also, do any of the developments address the picture/sound compatibility issues with some modern TVs?

None of these address the picture/sound compatibility as per a post Brian put on Facebook, they are still working on the solution for that and it will be a update for the cores

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28 minutes ago, Swami said:

I tried multiple ferrite beads at the beginning and end of the controller cords for the roller controller and it had no effect on the glitching. 

Well that's very disappointing to hear.

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1 hour ago, Ikrananka said:

Well that's very disappointing to hear.

The "noise" isn't an issue with filtering. The issue is the potential difference and change between the ground of the power to the roller controller and the ground of the Phoenix. If you connect the ground of the roller controller to a ground on the Phoenix the issue goes away. This also resolves if you power the roller controller from the Phoenix as the grounds will already be at the same potential. 

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1 hour ago, Swami said:

So, to be clear, are these developments going to be built into the 2nd batch units and then offered as a peripheral for the first batch units? Also, do any of the developments address the picture/sound compatibility issues with some modern TVs?

The expansion module would be applicable for both units with the exception that the 2nd batch Phoenix boards wouldn't need the HDMI passthrough (you could just use the HDMI plug on the back of the phoenix.

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20 hours ago, Bmack36 said:

The "noise" isn't an issue with filtering. The issue is the potential difference and change between the ground of the power to the roller controller and the ground of the Phoenix. If you connect the ground of the roller controller to a ground on the Phoenix the issue goes away. This also resolves if you power the roller controller from the Phoenix as the grounds will already be at the same potential. 

I was referring to the issues experienced when using one of the older standard CV hand controller that include wires that are connected to pins 7 and 9.

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On 1/15/2021 at 8:46 AM, nick3092 said:

Wasn't the CV core also being rewritten to address some issues with some TVs as well?  I think it had something to do with a timing issue. And I thought the hope was to have it done this past fall.

Yes that project is still ongoing. The hope was to have it done, but it is not there yet. It will be released as soon as it is ready.

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10 hours ago, Ikrananka said:

I was referring to the issues experienced when using one of the older standard CV hand controller that include wires that are connected to pins 7 and 9.

I don't know about standard controllers with 9 wires. I don't know if I have any of those. I could try it with a Super Action Controller. I kind of doubt it will help. Do you have any ferrite clamps?

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Well, happy to hear to update.  Got that crazy japanese SNES controller all ready to go when this arrives and I can finally start collecting carts for the Coleco.

 

Thanks for the continued efforts!

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Quick question.  I'm looking for a video capture solution for the Phoenix so was firstly wondering if anyone has any recommendations?

 

Is the 480p output from the Phoenix 720x480 @ 60Hz?

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Hi Ikrananka.

 

If I understand it correct is it:

 

"640x480 is a VGA format with 307.200 pixels against ColecoVisions 49.152 pixels, which is 6 times higher resolution."

 

;-)

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32 minutes ago, ten-four said:

Hi Ikrananka.

 

If I understand it correct is it:

 

"640x480 is a VGA format with 307.200 pixels against ColecoVisions 49.152 pixels, which is 6 times higher resolution."

 

;-)

But, I suspect that the Phoenix outputs the more standard HDMI 480p which is 720x480.  I just need that confirmed before I select a capture device.

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47 minutes ago, Ikrananka said:

But, I suspect that the Phoenix outputs the more standard HDMI 480p which is 720x480.  I just need that confirmed before I select a capture device.

The CV core is currently only outputting 640x480 with a 25MHz pixel clock (which is why there is the tv compatibility issue and will resolved with the firmware update). The atari2600 core is 720x480 with 27MHz which has better compatability. 

 

I use the avermedia live gamer portable 2 plus and it has worked well. Someone on the Collectorvision Phoenix Facebook group found a cheap one that worked as well.

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20 hours ago, Bmack36 said:

The CV core is currently only outputting 640x480 with a 25MHz pixel clock (which is why there is the tv compatibility issue and will resolved with the firmware update). The atari2600 core is 720x480 with 27MHz which has better compatability. 

 

I use the avermedia live gamer portable 2 plus and it has worked well. Someone on the Collectorvision Phoenix Facebook group found a cheap one that worked as well.

Thanks Brian.  Good to know that the Avermedia device works as it's on my shortlist.  That should mean the others I'm looking at will also work with the Phoenix.  While I've also looked at cheaper ones I wasn't happy that they tend to only capture/output in MJPEG format.

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Just got my Phoenix out for the first time in a bit, updated, and am playing Dead Tomb. Really fun so far, and deeper than most games you can play so far on the Phoenix (a lot of my favorite games aren't deep, that's not a complaint about simpler games). Also interesting to have a game for this console specifically. I'm glad to see more stuff coming. I'll get any games and hardware that come out for it!

 

Btw, and I don't need trade secrets or anything, but in general, what's Dead Tomb taking advantage of in the Phoenix? Using the CV core to run it, or something proprietary? Would it be possible to port this to a real one, even with the SGM? What happens if I put it in my Colecovision? Lol just wondering if I'll get a warning, blank screen, or a dead cart...

 

I also have Dead Tomb ordered for the NES but got this one first!

 

Edit: Well am enjoying it but not that far in and no idea what to do next. Classic gaming for real, no walkthroughs! I got a translator and a rock and been lost a while, missing something stupid lol. I'll keep at it!

Edited by Hastor
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Ok now I have a nail, but stuck again lol. Slowly but surely, I hope! Sorry for the double post, just missed the edit window.

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On 11/4/2019 at 1:51 PM, jblenkle said:

Got my Phoenix today. Some problems...mostly with the 2600 core. I started to read through the messages to see if I could find any other references to what I'm experiencing, but I will list them here.

 

1. Why, at least for me, does the 2600 menu seem squished? Also, and perhaps related, why when I start a game is the image stretched across my TV. The ColecoVision games appear in the correct resolution.

 

Haven't used the Phoenix in awhile, but I pulled it out tonight to update the cores and system and try a few games. I was hoping some of the 2600 problems I had mentioned back in Nov. 2019 would have been fixed, but I am still experiencing the squished menu on the 2600 core and the game not displaying at the correct resolution or screen ratio (stretched across the screen). Is this ever going to be addressed? Or was it and I missed the memo? Is there a fix for this? I suspect if I hook it up to my old (4:3) tube TV it will probably look normal, but I usually play on my widescreen 32" (16:9) TV. The CV core of the Phoenix displays everything perfectly.

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9 hours ago, Hastor said:

Btw, and I don't need trade secrets or anything, but in general, what's Dead Tomb taking advantage of in the Phoenix? Using the CV core to run it, or something proprietary? Would it be possible to port this to a real one, even with the SGM? What happens if I put it in my Colecovision? Lol just wondering if I'll get a warning, blank screen, or a dead cart...

It's just using the CV core and F18A.  The physical cart will not play properly in a real CV with F18A (SGM not required), it just displays a black screen.  You will not get a dead cart!!!!

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