CPUWIZ Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 Like the stock market, know when to buy. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+GoldenWheels Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 I just wish it could happen to a BAD game...why can't Jinks have Pokey in it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 On 12/2/2019 at 5:19 AM, GoldenWheels said: I just wish it could happen to a BAD game...why can't Jinks have Pokey in it? I murdered a lot more of those, than BB, before I designed my own boards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+GoldenWheels Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 33 minutes ago, CPUWIZ said: I murdered a lot more of those, than BB, before I designed my own boards. Didn't you say at one point you use to use Summer Games too? I've been blaming you for years Wiz that I can't find a boxed/sealed copy! XD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mimo Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 I've got several twin pokey boards in my Atari computers. Pokey versions of several 7800 games and 4 copies of ballblazer nib Sue me 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 4 hours ago, GoldenWheels said: Didn't you say at one point you use to use Summer Games too? I've been blaming you for years Wiz that I can't find a boxed/sealed copy! XD And Winter Games. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 Summer & Winter made for GREAT Sirius & Plutos donors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+GoldenWheels Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 I do play both of those more than I would ever play Summer Games. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sixersfan105 Posted December 4, 2019 Author Share Posted December 4, 2019 Glad to see that the vast majority of us don't have a problem with using Ballblazer carts for donors for several remarkable 7800 homebrew games. While @dmaxwell is entitled to his opinion, it sounds like he's more of a hoarder than a collector. And I'm only half kidding when I say that. Wouldn't a collector have one copy of the game and be happy with it? There's no need for thousands of Ballblazers to be sitting on pallets in warehouses or for carts to be piling up in the corner of someone's basement, is there? I have three to five Ballblazers on hand, but not to preserve, to have for when I want to turn them into awesome POKEY-based homebrew games! Long live homebrew and long live the 7800! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SearsRoebuck Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 I still think in the long run, it would be good to have a more permanent solution than a finite number of donor carts. I know of an arcade repair guy who has hundreds of pokeys taken from Ballblazers that he uses for various Atari PCBs; someone making a few custom carts won't be a big blip in the long run, but I don't think this is sustainable forever. I just had no clue how many had actually been destroyed, maybe my experience with the repair man has made me paranoid. I have no intention of keeping these forever, and it is the only game I have more than one copy of. I only collect games that I will actually play, so my collection is rather small (about 300 games across all systems from 2600 to the Switch) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+slx Posted December 8, 2019 Share Posted December 8, 2019 Isn‘t there any way to install one POKEY inside the 7800 and use it with every cart that needs it (short of an XM)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted December 8, 2019 Share Posted December 8, 2019 8 hours ago, slx said: Isn‘t there any way to install one POKEY inside the 7800 and use it with every cart that needs it (short of an XM)? Sure there is, but for most people, that is impossible to install. I created a pass-through board, a few years ago, but without being able to get cart connectors, it is also mostly useless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawn Posted December 8, 2019 Share Posted December 8, 2019 6 hours ago, CPUWIZ said: Sure there is, but for most people, that is impossible to install. I created a pass-through board, a few years ago, but without being able to get cart connectors, it is also mostly useless. You could get cart connectors if you really wanted to ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 On 12/5/2019 at 11:37 PM, dmaxwell said: I still think in the long run, it would be good to have a more permanent solution than a finite number of donor carts. I know of an arcade repair guy who has hundreds of pokeys taken from Ballblazers that he uses for various Atari PCBs; someone making a few custom carts won't be a big blip in the long run, but I don't think this is sustainable forever. I just had no clue how many had actually been destroyed, maybe my experience with the repair man has made me paranoid. I have no intention of keeping these forever, and it is the only game I have more than one copy of. I only collect games that I will actually play, so my collection is rather small (about 300 games across all systems from 2600 to the Switch) One of my local nerd-pals is @shupac - he has created a couple different FPGA POKEY implementations specifically for arcade board replacement and repair. It just so happens that his most recent version, POKEYOne, is - in quantity - an affordable AND AVAILABLE solution for @Albert to use in 7800 homebrews on the store. I also have one in my 1088XLD beta machine serving as the second (stereo) POKEY. Audio quality is indistinguishable to my ear and the Audacity waveforms were impossible to tell apart from genuine POKEY tracks. There might be some specific musical tricks and types of sounds where differences would be more pronounced but in playing dozens of stereo A8 demoscene tacks I never found one. For now, on a one-for-one basis the prices aren't quite cheap enough to buy POKEYOne or other FPGA versions when real POKEYs are still out there at the same cost or less. But vintage chips go up in price year by year while FPGA cores get cheaper. The crossover point is almost upon us, and when that happens, we'll be glad there are smart hardware guys like my friend and his colleagues who will be able to supply us with usable substitutes. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SearsRoebuck Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 9 hours ago, DrVenkman said: One of my local nerd-pals is @shupac - he has created a couple different FPGA POKEY implementations specifically for arcade board replacement and repair. It just so happens that his most recent version, POKEYOne, is - in quantity - an affordable AND AVAILABLE solution for @Albert to use in 7800 homebrews on the store. I also have one in my 1088XLD beta machine serving as the second (stereo) POKEY. Audio quality is indistinguishable to my ear and the Audacity waveforms were impossible to tell apart from genuine POKEY tracks. There might be some specific musical tricks and types of sounds where differences would be more pronounced but in playing dozens of stereo A8 demoscene tacks I never found one. For now, on a one-for-one basis the prices aren't quite cheap enough to buy POKEYOne or other FPGA versions when real POKEYs are still out there at the same cost or less. But vintage chips go up in price year by year while FPGA cores get cheaper. The crossover point is almost upon us, and when that happens, we'll be glad there are smart hardware guys like my friend and his colleagues who will be able to supply us with usable substitutes. Yeah I actually first heard about this because the repairman I mentioned in my post managed to get one (but only one) of these and used it to repair a Millipede PCB - so I got a little excited thinking we had a great solution - until I saw the price. Obviously in the long run, it will go down as you say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinks Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 The price at 40 is not bad. For a new ready to install chip. Ballsblazers is more than that unless your time is worth 50 cents plus could screw up the chip extracting an old antique. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
777ismyname Posted December 15, 2019 Share Posted December 15, 2019 Years ago I bought >200 Ballblazer and Commando carts and sold the POKEYs out of them. My biggest regret was not waiting several years to do so. I kept 8 or 10 of them, but they are stuck in storage somewhere or another. I have a few loose ones, one of which is going to am AtariAge member that has helped me out, for a Christmas present and another one is going in a 600XL that I'm rebuilding. I wish one of the guys making the FPGA POKEY replacements would try to get a large enough order together so as to be able to cost reduce them several bucks. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrVenkman Posted December 15, 2019 Share Posted December 15, 2019 7 hours ago, 777ismyname said: I wish one of the guys making the FPGA POKEY replacements would try to get a large enough order together so as to be able to cost reduce them several bucks. I’m sure they wish they had the money to put out an order for a big enough quantity to do that too! For purposes of 7800 homebrews, one of the biggest expenses is getting them designed for a final DIP-40 form factor so they can be plugged into existing PCB board designs. A new PCB design with the POKEY core FPGA integrated via surface-mount tech right to the board, and flash-able static memory to emulate the ROM space for the game code, would be substantially cheaper than current solutions. Fortunately, I know at least one person has such a design in work. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
777ismyname Posted December 15, 2019 Share Posted December 15, 2019 4 hours ago, DrVenkman said: I’m sure they wish they had the money to put out an order for a big enough quantity to do that too! For purposes of 7800 homebrews, one of the biggest expenses is getting them designed for a final DIP-40 form factor so they can be plugged into existing PCB board designs. A new PCB design with the POKEY core FPGA integrated via surface-mount tech right to the board, and flash-able static memory to emulate the ROM space for the game code, would be substantially cheaper than current solutions. Fortunately, I know at least one person has such a design in work. I forgot to stick the word “preorder” in there somewhere I would preorder and pay for a couple just to help them out, even though I’ve got quite a few real POKEYs lying around. The possibilities for the FPGA versions to simulate dual POKEYs and a SID, simultaneously, is very intriguing to me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+slx Posted December 15, 2019 Share Posted December 15, 2019 On 12/8/2019 at 4:00 PM, CPUWIZ said: Sure there is, but for most people, that is impossible to install. I created a pass-through board, a few years ago, but without being able to get cart connectors, it is also mostly useless. What's the challenge in installing it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted December 15, 2019 Share Posted December 15, 2019 Most 7800's don't have the CPU socketed, so removing the CPU is the real challenge for most people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 Follow up, here are 3 of my six machines, without clothes on. Not a single one has the CPU socketed. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynxpro Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 On 12/15/2019 at 3:11 PM, CPUWIZ said: Most 7800's don't have the CPU socketed, so removing the CPU is the real challenge for most people. Yet another reason why the 7800 was cheaper to manufacture than the 5200... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted December 28, 2019 Share Posted December 28, 2019 On 12/8/2019 at 1:36 PM, Shawn said: You could get cart connectors if you really wanted to ? Break into Curt's house? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+slx Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 On 12/16/2019 at 12:11 AM, CPUWIZ said: Most 7800's don't have the CPU socketed, so removing the CPU is the real challenge for most people. For those who dare to unsolder their CPU, is there a schematic or even board design somewhere on how to connect the POKEY? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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