tschak909 Posted January 26, 2020 Author Share Posted January 26, 2020 I walk away from the http-fetch test, deep fried; burnt to a crisp. While CIO is very well abstracted, the individual DOSes are NOT. Not only do you have to deal with filename processing differences, there are differences in how devicespecs are parsed, and how some DOSes add wildcards silently. or even like DOS 2, which just passes the last GET RECORD buffer, whole, to my handler, which includes both the source and destination filenames, separated by commas. but hey, AT LEAST I CAN DO BINARY LOADS FROM HTTP! Fucking hell, Who needs a drink? 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 26, 2020 Author Share Posted January 26, 2020 Meanwhile, Jeff Piepmeier has successfully demonstrated working #Atari 820 printer emulation! 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuji-Man Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 Is there an updated schematic for the ESP32? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 27, 2020 Author Share Posted January 27, 2020 2 hours ago, Fuji-Man said: Is there an updated schematic for the ESP32? paging @mozzwald Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozzwald Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 3 hours ago, Fuji-Man said: Is there an updated schematic for the ESP32? Just the google doc with pinout (posted throughout this thread), no schematic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 27, 2020 Author Share Posted January 27, 2020 Ok, so there is now a UDP test in esp32/tests/udp. There is a tictactoe.atr which contains a BASIC game to use the API presented in this sketch, of which there is also a copy in the data/ directory of this sketch. It needs some serious debugging, if anyone wants to pitch in. I am going to set up a sister project for tcp, which will have a TCP CIO driver. -Thom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiver Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 Being able to load a program using network via http is great. Though it has me curious if http would be the best protocol for this. Upon comparing protocols it would seem that gopher would be a better fit for the content being delivered to Atari's and other systems of similar resources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 27, 2020 Author Share Posted January 27, 2020 I do not agree, but if someone wants to do that. Typical use on the Atari would be currently to expose a disk image via TNFS (easy to set up). I was trying to show some potential uses of the N: device, as this is still being fleshed out. It was literally an implementation of HTTP GET a la curl -X GET. -Thom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manterola Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 (edited) But the potential to browse select and boot an image or xex from, for example, pigwa, sounds very appealing to me (or from any other directory browseable website). It might be one very popular feature. Another idea: One the biggest reasons to have a sio2bt device right now for me is ability to test games or images posted in this forum as I am reading the posts: click the attachment, fire sio2bt app, and then select the latest file from the download folder and finally boot my Atari computer. So it might be extraordinary to somehow select an image or xex from atariage forum and boot or run the executable. Edited January 27, 2020 by manterola 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 27, 2020 Author Share Posted January 27, 2020 Yup. very doable, and if it's ATR, it can be fetched and booted straight away. One of the challenges to deal with is that URL's can be VERY LONG. see _ANYTHING ON PIGWA_ I tried to deal with this, by adding a command to specify a URL prefix, but maybe something more elegant needs to be done. Copying files, is another weird matter, because while CIO is nice and abstracted, the various DUP's...........aren't. Every single DUP is broken in very unique ways, and none of the software engineers who wrote this stuff ever thought some crazy nutjob would be USING THEIR SOFTWARE, much less HOOKING IT UP TO AN INTERGALACTIC DATA NETWORK 40 years later... -Thom 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DjayBee Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 1 hour ago, manterola said: But the potential to browse select and boot an image or xex from, for example, pigwa, sounds very appealing to me (or from any other directory browseable website). I believe that the fun in this idea vanishes, as soon as you really try to browse through the list from the Atari - memorywise and perfomancewise. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 27, 2020 Author Share Posted January 27, 2020 meh, just make a way to send that link efficiently to the fujinet. something worth researching. -Thom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 1 hour ago, DjayBee said: I believe that the fun in this idea vanishes, as soon as you really try to browse through the list from the Atari - memorywise and perfomancewise. I agree. Some things are just way easier to do on a modern computer. I guess being able to do this on your A8 is an accomplishment, and would have been uber cool back in the 90's but in my opinion not worth the trouble from a text based entry method now days. Better to concentrate on things that really make sense. For instance, why would I browse the internet on my A8 vs. my Linux box with it's high resolution screen and very fast processor. However text based email, chat, IM, networked gaming, and a wireless SIO2PC ability would make sense, but not much more beyond that is really practical on our A8's. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 27, 2020 Author Share Posted January 27, 2020 (edited) @mytek I beg to differ. What i'm trying to show with this project is that there is a whole bunch of untapped potential, not just for what the Atari can do itself, but that the Atari and modern devices can bridge together to make the internet experience on the Atari that much better. (1) I have successfully done TLS connections, this means HTTPS, this means SSH, will be directly possible. (2) we have the TWO (count em) interrupt lines that almost no peripherals use, we will be able to not only efficiently react to incoming data, but also do crazy things like be able to pop up an instant message display. (3) SIO2BT bridging was demonstrated by @TheMontezuma, so #FujiNet can act as a transciever for existing SIO2BT installations (4) Since we have SSL/TLS, we can easily fetch and deal with data from modern web APIs to make client programs (5) Click on links on PC or mobile device to have them mount and boot with the Atari. (6) New games using either TCP or UDP comms and so on... This is to say NOTHING of the fact that @Curt Vendel's 7800 XM add-on, has an SIO port. Edited January 27, 2020 by tschak909 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiver Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 @mytek While any form of graphical web browsing would be impractical using a text based protocol such as gopher would fit the A8 platform like a glove. Really this is in the power class of computer something like gopher was made for. Is browsing, even using gopher, easier and more comfortable in a modern system? Certainly. Is it a pain switching between two systems to check an online reference? A bit. Would it be easier to check the reference and work on the same system? It would, even if it's a bit uncomfortable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DjayBee Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 1 hour ago, tschak909 said: (1) I have successfully done TLS connections, this means HTTPS, this means SSH, will be directly possible. This is both cool and useful, just like being able to mount a disk image using HTTP(S). I only said that browsing huge collections this way might be cool but is not useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 28, 2020 Author Share Posted January 28, 2020 It's important that people be able to use what we make, so we will engineer something that makes sense. At the same time, I want to open people's minds to try and think of off the wall stuff to do. -Thom 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manterola Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 What about the atari generating a qr code or similar? We scan the code with the smartphone so a tcp connection can be created to: option A, transfer the url, or option B, transfer the binary itself. Food for thought... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted January 28, 2020 Author Share Posted January 28, 2020 meanwhile, @16kRAM's #FujiNet installation takes shape. -Thom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+mytek Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 5 hours ago, tschak909 said: @mytek I beg to differ. What i'm trying to show with this project is that there is a whole bunch of untapped potential, not just for what the Atari can do itself, but that the Atari and modern devices can bridge together to make the internet experience on the Atari that much better. That's ok . And I look forward to seeing what comes out of this project. And even though we do not necessarily agree on all counts, I'm not here to rain on anyone's parade. What I stated was just my own personal opinion on what I think this project would be useful for, based on my present knowledge of such, which can of course change as I learn and experience more about this project first hand. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt Vendel Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 6 hours ago, mytek said: I agree. Some things are just way easier to do on a modern computer. I guess being able to do this on your A8 is an accomplishment, and would have been uber cool back in the 90's but in my opinion not worth the trouble from a text based entry method now days. Better to concentrate on things that really make sense. For instance, why would I browse the internet on my A8 vs. my Linux box with it's high resolution screen and very fast processor. However text based email, chat, IM, networked gaming, and a wireless SIO2PC ability would make sense, but not much more beyond that is really practical on our A8's. I was actually having this very discussion with Thom... having something akina to a Fujinet version of Google, but yes, like Gopher for finding and going to various servers. We'd have to establish a FujiDNS type server system and have a Foogle type search engine of sorts... It would DEFINITELTY be great to have email, chat/IM which should'n't be an issue, we all had those going back to the Compuserve and even into the AOL days, so those don't require any graphics and as for webpages and such, ATASCII could do the trick... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMontezuma Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 (edited) 12 hours ago, manterola said: One the biggest reasons to have a sio2bt device right now for me is ability to test games or images posted in this forum as I am reading the posts: click the attachment, fire sio2bt app, and then select the latest file from the download folder and finally boot my Atari computer. @manterola grab the multilator-rev2.ino and flash it on the ESP32. Long press (> 1 sec) the BOOT button and the ESP32 will turn into SIO2BT (it will behave like HC-06 modules configured for 57600). Another long press and the #Fujinet is back, so you can have best of both worlds with the same hardware. I really like that @tschak909 "boldly goes where no one has gone before" #Fujinet is a fascinating project and the world needs all these new features Edited January 28, 2020 by TheMontezuma 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 13 hours ago, Quiver said: @mytek While any form of graphical web browsing would be impractical using a text based protocol such as gopher would fit the A8 platform like a glove. Really this is in the power class of computer something like gopher was made for. Is browsing, even using gopher, easier and more comfortable in a modern system? Certainly. Is it a pain switching between two systems to check an online reference? A bit. Would it be easier to check the reference and work on the same system? It would, even if it's a bit uncomfortable. Maybe someone can try and port Lynx to Atari. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrathchild Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 Or hook Contiki to it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozzwald Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 54 minutes ago, Frankie said: Maybe someone can try and port Lynx to Atari. If we get ssh running you could put this on a server and browse the web with this tty/console based browser. It has ansi like rendering of graphics https://www.brow.sh/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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