_The Doctor__ Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 just try it, without the splitter... most people find gratifying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 25 minutes ago, xxl said: in the video (post 1041) I showed you loading from cart faster than POKEY 00, but if you absolutely need a lower speed, please, in this video, xBIOS loads data at 3 different speeds during one continuous transmission ? --- I'm waiting for you to explain to me how to make POKEY 00 transmissions at home Good stuff - I apologize for misunderstanding the available load speeds XBIOS provides. I was under the impression that it was locked to 19,200. Seeing that it is not, I can withdraw my initial question. For the pokey 0 divisor, all I can offer is that I use APE with a USB device. I set the divisor to 0 on APE and any machine I use which has U1MB (for the PBI device to load a hi-speed SIO driver) will just chirp away. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) avg, sio2sd, fujinet... what's your poison? sounds good to me, nice video showing other boot speeds from your tool Edited February 16, 2021 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Stephen said: For the pokey 0 divisor, all I can offer is that I use APE with a USB device. I set the divisor to 0 on APE and any machine I use which has U1MB (for the PBI device to load a hi-speed SIO driver) will just chirp away. at speed 00 it does not work. here I read that I need to replace the ROM and solder some diodes - is it true? http://sio2sd.gucio.pl/wiki/HighSpeed_en Edited February 16, 2021 by xxl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivop Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) Yeah, PBI drivers were a documented standard since 1984, but hardly used. Let alone a PBI driver for a SIO device. The first one I can remember is @flashjazzcat incorporating @HiassofT's HISIO in the U1MB firmware. Reaching div0 with an upgraded 1050 straight to the computer is not possible AFAIK. With SIO2SD/SDrive/etc... it's hit or miss. I have only one 800XL that works without hiccups with one partiular SDrive MAX. The rest won't go beyond div2 without cutting the caps. Maybe that one 800XL has caps that have gone bad? Edited February 16, 2021 by ivop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, ivop said: Yeah, PBI drivers were a documented standard since 1984, but hardly used. Let alone a PBI driver for a SIO device. The first one I can remember is @flashjazzcat incorporating @HiassofT's HISIO in the U1MB firmware. Reaching div0 with an upgraded 1050 straight to the computer is not possible AFAIK. With SIO2SD/SDrive/etc... it's hit or miss. I have only one 800XL that works without hiccups with one partiular SDrive MAX. The rest won't go beyond div2 without cutting the caps. Maybe that one 800XL has caps that have gone bad? that is, the whole story in acceleration that you are telling me about is a lottery ... requires additional hardware and computer modifications - it is much wiser to choose proven and 100% working solutions. Therefore, I propose to save this game on card. --- like this but with autostart Edited February 16, 2021 by xxl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivop Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) Yeah, div6 and lower is a lottery indeed. But that doesn't mean a disk version could not be made. Everybody loads it at their preferred and working speed Obviously, a cartridge would be better, and faster Edited February 16, 2021 by ivop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faicuai Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, xxl said: that is, the whole story in acceleration that you are telling me about is a lottery ... requires additional hardware and computer modifications - it is much wiser to choose proven and 100% working solutions. Therefore, I propose to save this game on card. --- like this but with autostart But that is the exact same thing with an external cart (you MUST have a third-party piece of HW, anyway). That is plug-and-play and trouble-free? Yes, of course.... Part of the original Atari? NOT, for sure. The point is that either one way or another, some sort of HW expansion is required, and it is MUCH better to use these fine-developments and SW adaptions as solid examples of WHY it is worth having a basic set of expansions and tools to push the equipment beyond puny 64K / 128K boundaries... Even SDX (on 1MB config.) pretty much TRANSFORMS your very same basic HW ! The longer we hold the line on stock HW, the worse for the user and developer community, in general. It is inescapable. We simply can't handcuff our creative-potential because of Atari's own past FAILURES to capitalize on its own architecture and improvements. Atari did not learn, fast enough, that SW development and goals (user side) eventually lead HW development (the vendor side). We do not need, at all, to repeat the exact same mistake, especially if we want all this not to completely vaporize once we are all gone. Edited February 16, 2021 by Faicuai 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 46 minutes ago, ivop said: Yeah, div6 and lower is a lottery indeed. Divisor 0 works consistently using Hias' driver and a geniune FTDI SIO2PC USB adapter on every single machine I have tested. You might have to snip some caps on the SIO data lines on some machines first, but sometimes not. Of course, anything not supported by XBIOS is bound to be written off by XXL as non-standard, difficult to accomplish, generally inconvenient. I use divisor 0 100 per cent of the time without transmission errors and have gotten used to it. Bare minimum daily driver configuration at this point, along with a PBI HDD. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 20 minutes ago, Faicuai said: But that is the exact same thing with an external cart (you MUST have a third-party piece of HW, anyway). no, inserting a cartridge is not the same as modifying a computer. How beautiful we differ in views ? 14 minutes ago, flashjazzcat said: Divisor 0 works consistently using Hias' driver and a geniune FTDI SIO2PC USB adapter on every single machine I have tested. so you also need a PC for this ... great solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 30 minutes ago, flashjazzcat said: Of course, anything not supported by XBIOS is bound to be written off by XXL as non-standard, difficult to accomplish, generally inconvenient. a typical method of people without knowledge or arguments to attack a person and not his views ? Popular modifications are becoming standard for you ... for me nothing that has been modified is no longer standard ? here two worlds collide - the world of atari and the world of mods ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tschak909 Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 FWIW: I use divisor 0 with my FujiNet, constantly. I also have a U1MB with HSIO enabled. -Thom 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 4 minutes ago, tschak909 said: FWIW: I use divisor 0 with my FujiNet, constantly. I also have a U1MB with HSIO enabled. -Thom so it requires rom replacement for this to work. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) no it fr*cking doesn't, it can use a driver what don't you get? and since you view carts as ok, you can use a cartridge to provide the the driver actually... I had hias driver on cart and the real sio devices that were capable worked... so by your definition that old set up is okay yes? sio power injection or removal isn't a new concept either... either... I leave it to powers that be to dig all that stuff up again... I mean it's not as if cartridges aren't basically cut down bus device theses days anyway... Edited February 16, 2021 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 5 minutes ago, _The Doctor__ said: no it fr*cking doesn't, it can use a driver what don't you get? great, where can i download this program to check if it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) omfg check out hias site. check out AA. He even made a HD maxflash cart to do it too. Why do we have to spoon feed all of this stuff to you, you make us do the work all the time, now it's time for you to do the work we already stated SpartaDOS provides pclink... and APE from AtariMax has supplied this with his software for ages... the only issue is you don't want to see it and don't want to find it. Video and testimonials mean nothing evidently... I just don't get the whole ostrich with it's head in the sand routine Edited February 16, 2021 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faicuai Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) 57 minutes ago, xxl said: no, inserting a cartridge is not the same as modifying a computer. How beautiful we differ in views ? so you also need a PC for this ... great solution. You are correct (if it refers to performing minor or deeper surgery for soldering, etc.) as I've already acknowledged on my original post. You could also think of high SIO-speed as a system-ROM soft-load (on 16K region underneath OEM rom), and that is very easy to accomplish with existing HW facilities on all XL/XE installed base. However, it would also restrict the SW developer from using that RAM, which could be indeed precious. As for an external cartridge, yes, it is absolutely plug and play (no issues with that since I own a $100 Ultimate/SD cart), but... external, nonetheless. And does not come with the host machine, which means it needs to be purchased. And, if it needs to be purchased, we may already look for the best possible upgrade and bang-for-the-buck, so we can run as much stuff and as flexibly as we can, and never open the machine again. This is where the regular user out-there gets lost and eventually settles for... the original, zero-upgrade config. which keeps him firmly stuck in the past. I would agree with you as well, that bringing upgrades into the picture FORCEABLY brings the concept of which STANDARDS will govern the upgrades (e.g. what / which HW registers to use even for carts, low-level storage specs., firmware and low-level integration with HW, etc.) but there is a really large upside for everyone on that avenue. NOT original HW, but still worth a shot. Edited February 16, 2021 by Faicuai Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 50 minutes ago, _The Doctor__ said: omfg check out hias site. check out AA. He even made a HD maxflash cart to do it too. Why do we have to spoon feed all of this stuff to you, you make us do the work all the time, now it's time for you to do the work we already stated SpartaDOS provides pclink... and APE from AtariMax has supplied this with his software for ages... the only issue is you don't want to see it and don't want to find it. Video and testimonials mean nothing evidently... I just don't get the whole ostrich with it's head in the sand routine thanks. This is how it works on an unmodified computer: did not work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) hmm works fine for the rest of us, can't imagine why stuff isn't working for you who can start a thread and help XXL troubleshoot his issues? as another POP thread is being sidetracked and possibly ruined by silly stuff. Edited February 16, 2021 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 43 minutes ago, Faicuai said: You could also think of high SIO-speed as a system-ROM soft-load (on 16K region underneath OEM rom), and that is very easy to accomplish with existing HW facilities on all XL/XE installed base. However, it would also restrict the SW developer from using that RAM, which could be indeed precious. How to load OS for Atari 800? My friend (an American who wrote Atari programs many years ago) has such a computer and does not want to change it and for him it is the only real Atari. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 (edited) use a ram board that adds os under rom... research that, they were available... please stop making issues that don't exist, cram it in an unused buffer area also but I am sure you'll say he wants to use tape deck at same time... you see we know the game here... use a newell ram-rod board... that was also wide spread... and on and on it goes.. these are all slot cards and the like... but I bet there is some issue will be taken with these as well, your friend will no doubt have original 16k 800 without a screw driver and a CTIA board in it. Edited February 16, 2021 by _The Doctor__ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxl Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 do not be nervous, the conclusion is that I proved to you that the solution you proposed is unreliable. It may work for you, but it does not work for me, while the standard ATR + CART will work 100% for everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 2 minutes ago, xxl said: do not be nervous, the conclusion is that I proved to you that the solution you proposed is unreliable. It may work for you, but it does not work for me, while the standard ATR + CART will work 100% for everyone. Everyone? Including U1MB users that were previously booby trapped? How sweet of you to keep such an open heart to all of us Atari users out there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 seems my 800 with CTIA does divisor zero, there were NEVER any SIO caps in it from factory... but, I guess you think somehow memory cards and cards with GTIA are not permitted mine came with thumb tabs... so I didn't need a screwdriver 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 Just now, _The Doctor__ said: seems my 800 with CTIA does divisor zero, there were NEVER any SIO caps in it from factory... but, I guess you think somehow memory cards and cards with GTIA are not permitted mine came with thumb tabs... so I didn't need a screwdriver What ever shall we do about those poor users who only use cassettes because that was the thing to do back then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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