VinsCool Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 2 hours ago, Heaven/TQA said: And the music base… is it HARD synth or RMT? 1 hour ago, ivop said: AFAIK it's plain POKEY. 1 hour ago, emkay said: On the 1st listen 15kHz with some 1.79MHz instruments plus "filter" . Plain POKEY, RMT converted to LZSS. Using many of my own tuning tables and AUDCTL combinations to achieve these sounds Most of the sounds were indeed running at 15khz with high pass filter at different intervals between the channels, and also made use of the 'Reverse 16-bit' sounds for a few instruments to produce a 'Clarinet' sound, those were also combined to filtered tones for producing some really deep chords, mainly in the introduction sequence. It's all things a stock machine can produce if you have the dedication for it 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 7 minutes ago, VinsCool said: It's all things a stock machine can produce if you have the dedication for it In short: It's a great arrangement but nothing special in POKEY usage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinsCool Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Just now, emkay said: In short: It's a great arrangement but nothing special in POKEY usage. Precisely! It can be done on all machines, but you really need to know what you are doing. (I rarely know what I am doing LOL) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, VinsCool said: Precisely! It can be done on all machines, but you really need to know what you are doing. (I rarely know what I am doing LOL) Don't put yourself down. Particular the notation correction is worth doing a bow. Edited October 3, 2021 by emkay 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, emkay said: After PoP seems to be final. Why again starting this nonsense? I beg your pardon, what seems to be the problem ? Or should I say, what seems to be YOUR problem ? Edited October 3, 2021 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 5 minutes ago, Level42 said: I beg your pardon, what seems to be the problem ? Or should I say, what seems to be YOUR problem ? YOUR problem is not to learn from anything. How many threads must appear that make you understand that particular this type of game is no choice for the Atari? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level42 Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, emkay said: YOUR problem is not to learn from anything. How many threads must appear that make you understand that particular this type of game is no choice for the Atari? Oh is it now ? So good that we are such good friends that you fully know me inside out ! To wake you up: I am not reading every thread about games here and little do I know that “that particular type of game is no choice for the Atari”. I merely saw this game and liked it and thought it might be a nice suggestion for a next conversion. I’m not a programmer. I don’t know the A8 inside and out. All I see is a platform game with not too many/fast objects. A game not far from Miner, BBSB and Mr.Robot. Seems possible to me. But if it isn’t, you could have pointed that out in a slightly friendlier way, thank you very much. Edited October 3, 2021 by Level42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 15 hours ago, Wrathchild said: Will there be a skip-on-Shift or Select held down during boot to skip the dem-tro? nope but the cart versions should load fast enough... 3 hours ago, Peri Noid said: Will there also be a version for a cart, like in may? Sure! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 13 hours ago, Level42 said: Might I suggest a “simple” conversion of Night Knight ? It reminds me of Miner2049er, just not as good? 13 hours ago, Schnurrikowski said: Btw. Eye of the Beholder would be nice to have on Atari 8 bit It's a great game but it would be quite a downgrade from the PC version (I know about the C64 version). It's more interesting if a game can potentially be converted and be as faithful or improve over the source. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 10 hours ago, Schnurrikowski said: Rensoupp? Spelling error? nah, forgot that 'p' when I registered here On that subject, Nice of @VinsCool telling me it's "8-bit" and not "8-bits" after posting the video, first sentence has a spelling mistake, very slick ? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 6 hours ago, Marsupilami said: Hi, it will be difficult to wait to play such a jewel But compared to the hard and amazing work you've done, the waiting is nothing. Congratulations !? I watched the video (twice) and I have a small question for you @rensoup: has the upside down potion been added like in the 1989 version (level 9) ? B.T.W. I noticed two transparency minor effects in some places: - When the prince jump from a slab. - Sometimes the prince is behind the pillars and sometimes not. Thanks! I didn't do the upside down potion ?, I know Bitshifters did it for the BBC version but it was all software rendering hence quite a bit easier... Because of the PMGs and DLIs that would have been so much messier on the A8, and probably required too much memory just for the extra code! Yep, there are some priority issues, some I know can't be fixed easily (like PMGs in front of gates) but those you mentioned I'm not sure... there are some duplicate tiles in the original graphics, and I have a mask for each of them... I suppose I forgot to set the mask for some... but bugs like that don't make or break a game so I'll pass on those! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 5 hours ago, Heaven/TQA said: me as demo coder likes the intro. questions: the bitbender DYCPer… how? that is damned cool. And the music base… is it HARD synth or RMT? haha, The sine scroller, I honestly can't remember ?, I did that 2 years ago, I know I used an undocumented opcode for it, and it was a pain to get working... The original plan was to have it distort on X as well but couldn't figure out a way to do it. I am quite happy with the circle scroller though, first thing I ever did on the A8 too! Music is "Life after Death" by Makary, RMT 50hz (original was 200hz) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinsCool Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 50hz is all we need Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 4 hours ago, ivop said: The circle scroll, I know. I have made one back in the nineties, but it was never released. Basically, you clear the bytes where the circle will be displayed with an unrolled loop (lda #0, sta everything). Then there's an unrolled loop that does just lda mem, ora #mask, sta mem. For a circle of N pixels, times characters of 8 bits high (just an example), you need N*8 of these. Each mask represents one pixel. The ORA opcode will be modified to a harmless instruction, like ldx. Then, there's the scroll routine. Unrolled loop that moves the ORA/LDX opcodes to their next positions, and you scroll in eight new bits. Repeat for each frame. hmm... I don't think that's going to work with a 2600 pixels circle ? The key is to write all 8 pixels at once, I also used an undocumented opcode for that effect... 4 hours ago, ivop said: Now the wavy scroll. I think that's the same, but the circle is a sine wave going from right to left instead. Add some hardware scrolling, and it looks more wavy The sine scroll is a different technique, there is fine scroll but no coarse scroll because if you did that, the characters would look static (they would always be at the same vertical position) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 3, 2021 Author Share Posted October 3, 2021 2 hours ago, VinsCool said: Plain POKEY, RMT converted to LZSS. Using many of my own tuning tables and AUDCTL combinations to achieve these sounds I think @Heaven/TQA was asking about the demo tune by Makary, sorry ? I hope you guys noticed the new tuneset by VinsCool which has that cool oriental vibe, and even though it's plain Pokey, it doesn't sound like typical Pokey! 14 minutes ago, VinsCool said: 50hz is all we need Agreed!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinsCool Posted October 3, 2021 Share Posted October 3, 2021 Yeah realised my mistake, thought it was the game itself, but the same tools were used at the end Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 4, 2021 Share Posted October 4, 2021 2 hours ago, rensoup said: I hope you guys noticed the new tuneset by VinsCool which has that cool oriental vibe, and even though it's plain Pokey, it doesn't sound like typical Pokey! Yes. Many optimizing happened. And depending on the state of the available software, the result is very good. In the video I like that even the FX fit perfectly to the rest of the game package Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivop Posted October 4, 2021 Share Posted October 4, 2021 3 hours ago, rensoup said: hmm... I don't think that's going to work with a 2600 pixels circle ? The key is to write all 8 pixels at once, No, it won't, but it was just a basic recollection of how I think I did it 25 years ago. One can skip the clear loop (always start with lda #0), and apply multiple masks at once before storing to memory. Perhaps Probably you did even more advanced tricks 3 hours ago, rensoup said: I also used an undocumented opcode for that effect... Interesting. I wonder which one you used. And thanks for calling it undocumented instead of "illegal" (that's a pet peeve of mine) 3 hours ago, rensoup said: The sine scroll is a different technique, there is fine scroll but no coarse scroll because if you did that, the characters would look static (they would always be at the same vertical position) Do you mean it is character mode? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faicuai Posted October 4, 2021 Share Posted October 4, 2021 10 minutes ago, emkay said: Yes. Many optimizing happened. And depending on the state of the available software, the result is very good. In the video I like that even the FX fit perfectly to the rest of the game package BTW, congrats for the IMPRESSIVE sword's blade-to-blade sound (SFX Bank-2 IIRC)... Among the finest and most convincing I've ever heard coming out of the A8. When played back through the JBL Charge/3, not only they sound amazing, but rich in ultrasonic harmonics, too... ? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted October 4, 2021 Share Posted October 4, 2021 4 hours ago, Level42 said: I merely saw this game and liked it and thought it might be a nice suggestion for a next conversion. I’m not a programmer. I don’t know the A8 inside and out. All I see is a platform game with not too many/fast objects. A game not far from Miner, BBSB and Mr.Robot. Seems possible to me. What would you expect? The game is in no way directly usable. MSX has about 30 Sprites and the color mode is at 256x212 pixel. C64 also has the color High Res. option. Also, a lot platform games of that type exist already. And it actually IS the problem of the PMG limitation that "not too much " moving objects in High resolution and with a colored overlay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted October 4, 2021 Share Posted October 4, 2021 3 hours ago, ivop said: No, it won't, but it was just a basic recollection of how I think I did it 25 years ago. One can skip the clear loop (always start with lda #0), and apply multiple masks at once before storing to memory. Perhaps Probably you did even more advanced tricks Interesting. I wonder which one you used. And thanks for calling it undocumented instead of "illegal" (that's a pet peeve of mine) Do you mean it is character mode? i am not talking about the „dot scroller“ hence circle scroller but morr about the DYCP (delta y position character position). by char its simple fixed chars where you copy data into and scroll in opposite direction. i think it was called bitbender on ST or Amiga… yes I am talking about the sinus waved scroller by pixel collums esp. what is it 50 fps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetboot Jack Posted October 4, 2021 Share Posted October 4, 2021 Wow - congratulations, despite the noise you've won through @rensoup - a great piece of software! sTeVE 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tebe Posted October 4, 2021 Share Posted October 4, 2021 5 hours ago, Heaven/TQA said: i am not talking about the „dot scroller“ hence circle scroller but morr about the DYCP (delta y position character position). by char its simple fixed chars where you copy data into and scroll in opposite direction. i think it was called bitbender on ST or Amiga… yes I am talking about the sinus waved scroller by pixel collums esp. what is it 50 fps? like this ? dypp.obx 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted October 4, 2021 Share Posted October 4, 2021 3 hours ago, tebe said: like this ? dypp.obx 15.9 kB · 24 downloads yes… similar to this. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rensoup Posted October 4, 2021 Author Share Posted October 4, 2021 19 hours ago, ivop said: No, it won't, but it was just a basic recollection of how I think I did it 25 years ago. One can skip the clear loop (always start with lda #0), and apply multiple masks at once before storing to memory. Perhaps Probably you did even more advanced tricks I start with a horizontal scroll, represented internally with 1 byte per pixel, which allows me to do this for a 8 pixel screen byte: cpx HorizontalScroll+offset1 ror cpx HorizontalScroll+offset36 ror ... cpx HorizontalScroll+offset22 ror sta Screen0+pos The offsets are precomputed and because the scroll is slightly zoomed up (it's 256x6 when horizontal) I can replace cpx HorizontalScroll+offset36 ror cpx HorizontalScroll+offset36 ror with cpx HorizontalScroll+offset36 ; 4 cycles ror anc #$ff ; 2 cycles ror because sometimes the same scroll pixel is plotted twice consecutively. 19 hours ago, ivop said: Interesting. I wonder which one you used. And thanks for calling it undocumented instead of "illegal" (that's a pet peeve of mine) ANC, which does c = (#imm & A) & $80. and agreed about using undocumented ? 19 hours ago, ivop said: Do you mean it is character mode? no, I mean the font would look static and follow a sin curve without bouncing 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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