+DarkLord Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 Okay, been having some download problems at the DarkForce! BBS. Users have told me that it just doesn't work. I've had no problems myself, although this is local, with my Kubuntu Linux laptop, using Ztelnet. I'm wondering that since it's across the LAN, it's different than from the 'Net. Here are a couple of pics to show Ztelnet in action. As you can see, Ztelnet pops open a window and asks you where you want the file to go and keeps you notified about what's going on. This is zmodem, btw. Thanks all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ataricrypt Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 I wasn't sure what to look for (Mac) but ended up finding SyncTERM. Works perfect with your BBS and I'm downloading a few bits and pieces now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnPolka Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) I was one of the users who said it wasn't working. It's now working for me with Syncterm. Today, I noticed that it will not work if one does not login using telnet mode. The other day when I tried it, it did not work in telnet mode nor raw mode. So, I wonder if something else may have been the culprit the other day. At any rate, it's good to know that your BBS requires telnet mode for file transfers. -JP Edited January 10, 2020 by JohnPolka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted January 10, 2020 Author Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) Educate this 'ole SysOp a bit - what exactly is the difference between "raw" mode and "telnet" mode? Advantages/disadvantages? I'm sure I've read that in the Lantronix PDF but I'm drawing a blank at the moment. Thanks! PS Using ztelnet, TAZ, ANSITerm, FDT, etc, I don't remember any settings for this, must be a default. Edited January 10, 2020 by DarkLord Added content... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jokker Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 So I gave it a try with a few things with strangely mixed results... With a WiModem232 on a Mega STE using FZDT (Modem 1 port) raw mode - failed telnet mode - failed Also various speeds, with/without RTS/CTS, with HSMODEM and without, different protocols, all failed With NetRunner Beta 18 (Win32) - also failed?! This surprised me... Syncterm (Win32) - worked! Although I can't remember if it was raw or telnet, so I might try them again to see if one worked over the other Having different results with the Windows apps is odd to me but again it could be one mode over the other. I'm not 100% on the reasoning but raw vs telnet is just that certain telnet byte sequences have to be handled properly were as raw is just pure 8-bit data across the connection. I think the documentation for tcpser explains it much clearer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnPolka Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 15 hours ago, DarkLord said: Educate this 'ole SysOp a bit - what exactly is the difference between "raw" mode and "telnet" mode? Advantages/disadvantages? I'm sure I've read that in the Lantronix PDF but I'm drawing a blank at the moment. Thanks! PS Using ztelnet, TAZ, ANSITerm, FDT, etc, I don't remember any settings for this, must be a default. Telnet is a communication protocol that includes some rules such as an end of line sequence must be either a carriage return (ASCII 13) followed by a linefeed (ASCII 10) or a carriage return followed by a NUL character (ASCII 0). There are also escape sequences that begin with ASCII 255. You can read all about them in the telnet specification (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc854). Raw mode does not use any protocol. It's unfiltered communication, very much like a traditional dial-up modem connection. Sometimes the telnet protocol can get in the way of file transfers, especially if one end is configured for telnet and the other end is in raw mode. Telnet mode can really affect ATASCII mode on the Atari 8 bit. For example, a carriage return is typically used as a graphics character (A raised straight line) and an end-of-line character is a different mapping (ASCII 155). If one is viewing an ATASCII graphics file under telnet mode, they might see the raised straight line (ASCII 13) followed by a heart character (ASCII 0) since telnet dictates that a carriage return must be followed with a linefeed or a NUL. Sometimes ATASCII can really mess up a telnet connection if it includes cursor controls (which is common in an ATASCII movie). That's because the insert character is ASCII 255 (which precedes escape sequences in telnet). With regard to your BBS' file transfers...I wonder if file transfers would work for everyone if your BBS' Lantronix device were configured for raw mode. Which Lantronix device do you use? I wrote up a configuration for the Lantronix UDS-10 which includes raw mode. You can access it at the following link: https://atariage.com/forums/applications/core/interface/file/attachment.php?id=644789 -JP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted January 11, 2020 Author Share Posted January 11, 2020 Okay, I downloaded and glanced over that well-written instruction set. Thanks. One thing, at first glance it appears that the settings in that set are for using a UDS-10 to call > in < to a BBS. In my case, all my Lantronix UDS-10 settings are for > receiving < calls. I know that the settings I use on my UDS-10 with my STacy to call are different than the ones I use for the BBS. Or is it that those settings you gave are for both? Also, I have a router setup to pass telnet calls through to my UDS-10, so I have a permanent IP address. Don't think I can do dynamic with that, or am I missing something? Here are my current settings: darklord@darkforce:~$ telnet 192.168.1.104 9999 Trying 192.168.1.104... Connected to 192.168.1.104. Escape character is '^]'. *** Lantronix Universal Device Server *** Serial Number xxxxx MAC address xxxxx Software version V5.8.0.5 (060724) LTX Password :---- Press Enter for Setup Mode *** basic parameters Hardware: Ethernet Autodetect IP addr 192.168.1.104, gateway 192.168.1.1,netmask 255.255.255.0 Telnet config password set *** Security SNMP is enabled SNMP Community Name: public Telnet Setup is enabled TFTP Download is enabled Port 77FEh is enabled Web Server is enabled ECHO is disabled Enhanced Password is disabled *** Channel 1 Baudrate 19200, I/F Mode 4C, Flow 02 Port 00520 Connect Mode : 56 Auto increment source port disabled Remote IP Adr: --- none ---, Port 00000 Disconn Mode : C0 Disconn Time: 10:00 Flush Mode : 00 Terminal name: DarkForce! BBS *** Expert TCP Keepalive : 45s ARP cache timeout: 600s Monitor Mode @ bootup : enabled HTTP Port Number : 80 Change Setup: 0 Server 1 Channel 1 5 Expert 6 Security 7 Factory defaults 8 Exit without save 9 Save and exit Your choice ? 8 Thanks for any and all suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted January 11, 2020 Author Share Posted January 11, 2020 Quick question - just a random thought really, are most of the callers attempting downloads and having problems using 8bits? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnPolka Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, DarkLord said: Okay, I downloaded and glanced over that well-written instruction set. Thanks. One thing, at first glance it appears that the settings in that set are for using a UDS-10 to call > in < to a BBS. In my case, all my Lantronix UDS-10 settings are for > receiving < calls. I know that the settings I use on my UDS-10 with my STacy to call are different than the ones I use for the BBS. Yes, the "Connect Mode 56" setting in those instructions permit incoming and outgoing connections. See also "Connect Mode" in the Lantronix manual at the link below. The settings are listed in binary, so you need to convert the bits to hexadecimal when you enter them. Bit 6 controls whether to accept incoming connections. https://www.lantronix.com/wp-content/uploads/pdf/UDS10-UDS100_UG.pdf The Disconnect Mode (a.k.a. Disconn Mode) setting controls whether you use telnet mode or raw mode. Right now, you have it set to telnet mode. If you change it to 80 (or 81 if you also want to turn off the state LED during a connection), you'll use raw mode. -JP Edit: Added information on the Disconnect Mode. Edited January 11, 2020 by JohnPolka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted January 11, 2020 Author Share Posted January 11, 2020 Hmm, okay - most of this stuff I think I went over "back in the day" when I first switched to telnet from dial up but I hadn't gone over it in a long time since there hadn't been any (apparent) problems. Thanks for all the info. I do have the Lantronix manual and PDF for reference. So if I change from telnet mode to raw mode, will it cause problems with the software that uses telnet? Is there a setting that allows both modes simultaneously? Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jokker Posted January 11, 2020 Share Posted January 11, 2020 Yeah so I also messed with this and I set my disconnmode to 80 and now my wimodem232 works in raw mode. Syncterm works as well when raw mode is selected. NetRunner still didn't work at all. I don't think you can have both or a setting that does both unfortunately. I think everything still works just fine from a non-downloading point of view though. I guess you can advertise RAW mode for downloads or something? I was looking at the telnet RFC's to understand the terminal types and while you could set it to ANSI which has the binary mode (which I think it's the equivalent to RAW is it not?) then theoretically you can have "both" I would think. Although I wasn't able to get downloads to work with telnet modem and my terminal was set to ANSI which supports BINARY mode even when I had telnet translation enabled on my wimodem232. Maybe the UDS doesn't support it? Perhaps I'll play around with my other UDS and see if I can make it talk about it's supported options. Maybe there is a common ground or something. I guess you can clearly indicate what mode you are using when people go into your download section? I don't know what the prevailing method is on the net for things like NetFossil, Synchronet, or UDS. Just for the record my BBS UDS-10 is configured like this: *** Channel 1 Baudrate 38400, I/F Mode 4C, Flow 02 Port 04000 Connect Mode : 56 Auto increment source port disabled Remote IP Adr: --- none ---, Port 00000 Disconn Mode : 80 Disconn Time: 05:00 Flush Mode : 44 I should really up the baudrate though it can go a lot faster since it's on a PC with real 16550 UART's _Troy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted January 12, 2020 Author Share Posted January 12, 2020 Okay, just in the interest of experimentation (and if it ain't broke, I'm just not trying hard enough :), I set the disconnect mode to 80 and 81. DarkForce doesn't respond well to these settings. First off, the script I use to auto detect ANSI terminal callers doesn't work. Also, your login is now shown instead of being *'s. Further, once it gets to last screen after login, it acts like <return> is being hit 2-3 times in a row. Many screens won't let you input any keys, it just moves on. So....is there some other settings that are supposed to be changed when you use 80 or 81? Thanks all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jokker Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 Oh Darklord, you are a man after my own heart. What are you connecting with? Perhaps it doesn't support RAW mode at all and it expects proper telnet sequences? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnPolka Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 10 hours ago, DarkLord said: Okay, just in the interest of experimentation (and if it ain't broke, I'm just not trying hard enough :), I set the disconnect mode to 80 and 81. DarkForce doesn't respond well to these settings. First off, the script I use to auto detect ANSI terminal callers doesn't work. Also, your login is now shown instead of being *'s. Further, once it gets to last screen after login, it acts like <return> is being hit 2-3 times in a row. Many screens won't let you input any keys, it just moves on. So....is there some other settings that are supposed to be changed when you use 80 or 81? Thanks all. When you tested this, did you connect to the BBS using a term program in "telnet" mode or "raw" mode? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted January 13, 2020 Author Share Posted January 13, 2020 Ugh, still trying to figure that out - not sure how to make Ztelnet on Kubuntu do that. Downloaded PuTTY for Windows but couldn't seem to get it to connect at all. Gonna have to break down and RTFM's, methinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted January 16, 2020 Author Share Posted January 16, 2020 Okay, posted this on DarkForce, but I'll repeat it here for everyone. I've decided to stay with telnet mode for now. It works so I'm not going to make any drastic changes at this time. That's not to say that I'm giving up or that's the final verdict on the matter. I'm planning on trying again at a later date when I've got more time and have read up a bit on what's what. For now, when I set the UDS10 to 80 or 81 on disconnect, DarkForce's scripts, which are a huge part of its operation, don't work right. Just wanted to update everyone as to where we are. I've also updated the information screen that first appears when you go into the BBS's File Sig areas - it now shows menu item #5, which simply states that files must be downloaded in telnet mode. Thanks everyone for all the help and input - we'll try again at a later date. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuji-Man Posted January 31, 2020 Share Posted January 31, 2020 I built one of these with full serial connections. https://subethasoftware.com/2018/02/28/wire-up-your-own-rs-232-wifi-modem-for-under-10-using-esp8266-and-zimodem-firmware/ I've set 'ats46=3s48=1s50=1s52=1s54=1s56=1&w' and dial 'atddarkforce-bbs.dyndns.org:520'. I connect 90% of the time and get to the file section. I was told to use 'atd' (not atdt) from the guy who maintains Zimodem. Not sure why it would matter. I have tried TAZ and Flash 3.02 programs. Downloading fail regardless of protocol. Mostly timeouts, or Subpacket too long errors. I have a UDS-10, which downloads do work... But I'd like to the get ESP8266 to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted February 3, 2020 Author Share Posted February 3, 2020 I'm still experimenting around with this. So far: Ztelnet under Kubuntu Linux Syncterm with a Mac both work fine. As soon as my darned serial cable gets here for the Mega STe, I'll start playing around with Taz, FZDT, ANSITerm, ect on it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted March 4, 2020 Author Share Posted March 4, 2020 Okay, been playing around (again!) and have had some odd but interesting results. Setting the UDS-10 on the BBS to disconnect mode 00, 40, 80, or 81 results in extra letters on the callers screen, as well as doubled letters in places. The script file I use to detect incoming ANSI terminal emulation does not work correctly with these modes either, although that part has me completely baffled. Also, the major point, downloading doesn't work either - it still times out. Time out on the callers screen and BBS Express reports "too many retries". This is with Ztelnet under Kubuntu Linux, the shell under Windows 7, and TAZ on my Mega STe. Oh, the UDS-10 on the Mega STe was changed each time to match the disconnect mode on the BBS with the same results. Changing the BBS's UDS-10 back to disconnect mode C0 makes the ANSI script work again and the doubled and extra character problem go away. It also works for downloads with Ztelnet under Kubuntu Linux as well as a couple of other apps on the Mac and Win7 and Win10 that some people have previously reported (not the shell). The good news is that, I've figured out how to get TAZ to download successfully like this. When you pick zmodem and begin the download on the BBS screen, right click from TAZ's main menu to get the configuration menu. Pick Receive Files and then hit "E" for external and it will then download like a champ with no errors. I just downloaded about half a dozen files to my Mega STe with no problems at all like this. When I've got a little more time I'll try ANSITerm and FDT to see if there are ways to get them to work as well (if someone doesn't beat me to it). Thanks, just wanted to let everyone know that I hadn't forgotten about this issue and that we've made some small progress, at least. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted April 2, 2021 Author Share Posted April 2, 2021 Just wanted to update this a bit. I've used the following to successfully download with no problems: Ztelnet under Kubuntu SyncTerm under Windows TAZ with a Mega STe STalker with a Mega STe I've not got around to it yet but I still want to test NeoCom Freeze Dried Terminal ANSITerm Flash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted April 3, 2021 Author Share Posted April 3, 2021 Played around a bit with NeoCom this evening. Interesting looking software. I've got the shareware version, not sure what, if any limitations come with that. On my Mega STe I got it to connect just fine to my BBS but I've not figured out yet how to get it to download. I'll have to play around with that. It does have a full screen mode and a windowed mode. From the windowed mode it will work fine with the MUSICOMM desk accessory and play music. Really need to read the docs. It supports VT52 and ANSI but I never could get the colors or window to do what I wanted it to. Still, it did work and connect right out of the box, as they say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atari8guy Posted April 3, 2021 Share Posted April 3, 2021 (edited) 12 hours ago, DarkLord said: I've not got around to it yet but I still want to test NeoCom Freeze Dried Terminal ANSITerm Flash I'm no expert, so it's easily user error but I gave FDT and ANSITerm a go with no luck.... SyncTerm on PC worked though Edited April 3, 2021 by 8bitguy1 Update Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted April 3, 2021 Author Share Posted April 3, 2021 What did you try FDT and ANSITerm with? A UDS10? How were you trying to dial out with them? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tillek Posted April 3, 2021 Share Posted April 3, 2021 Wait... posting about ST BBSing in the ST forum? Is this even permitted? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atari8guy Posted April 3, 2021 Share Posted April 3, 2021 What did you try FDT and ANSITerm with? A UDS10? How were you trying to dial out with them? Thanks. I use a wimodem232. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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