The review of A-Z of Atari ST Games Volume 3 book RetroLaird is trying to delete!

[+CyranoJ]

It's a fair call that if you are friends with Kieren people will be uncomfortable around you.

 

Look at what he's posted and done. Look at how he manipulates people. Can anyone be 100% sure anything personal or confidential they said wouldn't get back to him?

 

If you wonder why people would distance themselved from his known friends, just re-read this thread. 

 

Collateral damage is a thing.

 

There are only a handful of people orbiting Kieren I 100% do not and will not ever trust, and you, Felice are certainly NOT one of those, so be assured D-Bug/Reboot holds no ill towards you.

[Lost Dragon]

24 minutes ago, agradeneu said:

Are you kidding? You cannot make those allegations without any proof to ANYONE. 

No, I'm far from kidding.

 

For someone who lists Social Media skills on their C.V to pick the most stereotypical image from within the game and thinks that's the one i want to use to illustrate the game to my readership,is pretty dire.

 

The publication is on sale via Amazon and Amazon have been made aware, it's that simple.

 

The bloody proof is there on the page for anyone who downloads a sample.

 

I want the book pulled and the image replaced,  not glorified.

 

It's bad enough seeing racism in my local town with 2 stereotypical racist characters riding the town bell,without seeing it in Retro publications.

 

It's not exactly the sort of claim i am going to make up about the guy, with so much else surrounding him.

 

Likes of Cat Despira can bang the attacks on creative thinkers drum till the proverbial livestock return home, but it was a poor choice indeed of imagery and i will be damned if i will promote it further.

 

It's obviously fine to those who reviewed the book and gave it top marks,  but for myself it's a throwback to an era in the UK i would rather forget.

 

That's my final say on the matter.

Edited February 25, 2020 by Lost Dragon

[agradeneu]

1 minute ago, Lost Dragon said:

No, I'm far from kidding.

 

For someone who lists Social Media skills on their C.V to pick the most stereotypical image from within the game and thinks that's the one i want to use to illustrate the game to my readership,is pretty dire.

 

The publication is on sale via Amazon and Amazon have been made aware, it's that simple.

 

The bloody proof is there on the page for anyone who downloads a sample.

 

I want the book pulled and the image replaced,  not glorified.

 

It's bad enough seeing racism in my local town with 2 stereotypical racist characters riding the town bell,without seeing it in Retro publications.

 

It's not exactly the sort of claim i am going to make up about the guy, with so much else surrounding him.

 

That's my final say on the matter.

   Seriously, get over it and move on. You will end up looking much worse than the person you are trying to defeat. 

[Felice_Atari]

1 hour ago, neo_rg said:

Hi Felice, long time no chat... On the subject of kieren, loads of people have been for want of a better word...

Manipulated by Kieren to meet his needs, as 'friends' to back him up when he gets into 'trouble'. Or as enablers,

he'll want you around because you can do things for him.  I myself and I'm sure the other members of Reboot

have no ill will against you 'just' because you've talked to Kieren. You've been duped along with quite a few people.

The weird thing is, I don't personally feel I was manipulated by or duped by Kieren. Maybe it is just me, but I got the impression that he kind of 'accepted' me as being slightly higher than him, bearing in mind my own personal involvement with the Atari side and also with the wider demoscene community. I never had any problem with him personally and do admit that at Play Blackpool last year I bought him a beer and we talked just about general gaming-related stuffs then.

 

 

Various people from my past who I am no longer associated with (fortunately) had tried to manipulate or dupe me, noone from the retrogaming scene or the demoscene is included within that. Not even Kieren or StarshipUK can I add to that; as I say. The people I'm largely talking about are those teachers who bullied and abused me when I was at school; also the management team at a well-known supermarket in the town I was born where I worked at for a while, but maybe this is getting a bit TL;DR.

 

Anyways, @neo_rg I have always respected you and all other members of Reboot & D-Bug, hope all is well with everyone in the groups, look forward to more new releases soon

 

[Austin]

15 hours ago, tomasparks said:

*starts eating popcorn*

You're going to need a lot more popcorn.

[Landstalker]

10 hours ago, Felice_Atari said:

The weird thing is, I don't personally feel I was manipulated by or duped by Kieren. Maybe it is just me, but I got the impression that he kind of 'accepted' me as being slightly higher than him, bearing in mind my own personal involvement with the Atari side and also with the wider demoscene community. I never had any problem with him personally and do admit that at Play Blackpool last year I bought him a beer and we talked just about general gaming-related stuffs then.

 

 

Various people from my past who I am no longer associated with (fortunately) had tried to manipulate or dupe me, noone from the retrogaming scene or the demoscene is included within that. Not even Kieren or StarshipUK can I add to that; as I say. The people I'm largely talking about are those teachers who bullied and abused me when I was at school; also the management team at a well-known supermarket in the town I was born where I worked at for a while, but maybe this is getting a bit TL;DR.

 

Anyways, @neo_rg I have always respected you and all other members of Reboot & D-Bug, hope all is well with everyone in the groups, look forward to more new releases soon

 

Playing Devil's Advocate here.
You say you got the impression that he "kind of accepted" you.
So, not really. Some acceptance eh?
Anyway, I'm not here to argue semantics.
You aren't among the legions of those who have suffered bitterly at the hands of Mr Hawken. That almost certainly explains your tone which is considerably less acerbic than most. You seem to be stunned and/or surprised at the situation and rightly so. You are well rid of him, you are obviously a part of the vast majority who see this community as something positive and worth maintaining rather than a tiny minority (Kieren) who, like rats, parasites and cancers gnaw away at the threads that hold it together and attempt to destroy for no good reason.
But I will go on record once again and say that it still surprises me, to a degree that gets smaller with each post, that NO-ONE has stepped forward and supported this man.
He claims to have people behind him, who trust and respect him and who have been vocal against the torrent of abuse he feels has come his way from some group of conspirators set on his ruination.
So where are they?
With the one random and exceptionally tenuous exception of some johnny-come-lately blogger who no-one seems to have heard of prior to this, who has made wild and spurious comments based solely on the untruths of the man himself which haven't endeared or solidified their qualifications as a journalist in anyone's eyes, there is not one single soul prepared to step forward and put us all in our places with their version of events.
Instead we have to make do with the fifteen page blatherings of someone obviously desperately unhinged, filled with baseless counterclaims, avoidance of all accusations, obviously photoshopped documents and this is somehow supposed to slap us all down and refute all claims against a man who has no grasp on reality and has engaged in some of the lowest forms of behaviour possible against those he knows are fragile, perilously close to self-harm and/or on the mental health spectrum as he himself claims to be.
Surely, there is someone out there who is one of the supporters of the illegally returned YouTube channel, a follower of Kieren's amateurish videos which are invariably filled with other people's material, or just a "life-long friend" if such exists?
Why do you not have the courage of your own convictions to step forward and regale us with the good that Kieren has done for yourself, the community or the world of publication?
Do these supporters fear being tarred with the same brush and losing any credibility they may have by revealing their associations with this pariah?
Are they ashamed to admit their connections?
Do these connections actually exist?
The few (single figures) that have "contacted" him via his FB page are not from the UK scene, which is unsurprising as I doubt there are many here that have not heard of his antics, suffered from them or known someone affected by same.
If, you are a supporter, friend or colleague of this man, grow a pair, step up and tell us why we're wrong.
We are not above being at fault unlike him, we are more than prepared to eat crow and admit our errors.
It's been fifteen years of this litany of woe, three weeks or more of this post growing exponentially, along with various FB posts, tweets, YT videos etc. and to date no-one other than the "man" (and I use that term as loosely as humanly possible) himself who has spoken out (guffaw) against the detractors.
This, more than anything speaks volumes.
He has no grounds for his attacks over a decade and a half and he has no supporters, allegiances or friends in this industry.
If he were the journalist he claims to be, he could do far better than the half-arsed PDF that brought nothing to the table except great hilarity for anyone prepared to wade through the jabberings of a deranged mind.
If he were a true journalist he would have hard evidence to counter attack all claims against him, to prove irrefutably that his critics were not just incorrect, but that they were the ones set on the ruination of a good and honest man, and that they were the cancer at the heart of the community.
Yet this seems beyond his meagre skills.
You don't need to be Sherlock Holmes to reason why this is.
Kieren does not have a leg to stand on (not a disparaging comment regarding his "need" for a walking stick). 
He has no evidence against his "attackers"; his pathetic schoolboy "he said, she said" arguments are risible at best and prove nothing except his lack of journalistic integrity and/or ability, his failure as a social media "expert" and that his stance in the community such as it was, is over.
No amount of time can ameliorate the situation that has arisen from his misdeeds. He claims he will not apologise to the community "because he has done nothing wrong".
No amount of apologies can repair the damage done.
Regardless of compassion in others, they should never reach out to this man as he will never change his ways. He is damaged somehow and will not adjust or amend his approach to the community. 
But we could at least tie a nice little bow on the entire fiasco if there were some kind words from those who know him infinitely better than us.
The floor is yours....

 

[Retrobob]

12 hours ago, agradeneu said:

   Seriously, get over it and move on. You will end up looking much worse than the person you are trying to defeat. 

If you're not going to post proof, or at least explain further then you're not really making a case.

Edited February 26, 2020 by Retrobob

[Welshworrier]

14 hours ago, Felice_Atari said:

The weird thing is, I don't personally feel I was manipulated by or duped by Kieren. Maybe it is just me, but I got the impression that he kind of 'accepted' me as being slightly higher than him, bearing in mind my own personal involvement with the Atari side and also with the wider demoscene community.

 

Um... I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the key to manipulation is to ensure the person who is being manipulated doesn't realise, perhaps by making them think they are seen as superior to the manipulator.

 

I'd never be able to fool you as I am just a mere speck of dust in the armpit of history ..etc.

[DeadPixels]

Was it definitively confirmed that Rogue Trooper was a sock puppet account? If so, it seems he's already using his woolen allies to prop up the re-launched YT account's comment section.

[Lost Dragon]

1 hour ago, DeadPixels said:

Was it definitively confirmed that Rogue Trooper was a sock puppet account? If so, it seems he's already using his woolen allies to prop up the re-launched YT account's comment section.

It's his alright. 

 

It's him trying to be clever.

 

Rogue Trooper was my old user name on RVG forum and Kieren rage quit it,taking his content with him,after the vote to decide if the site should keep the interview i gifted them after I quit (Les Player ATARI UK RIP) should remain, decided it should stay.

 

It was mentioned in the 15 page statement of his.

 

 

It's not actually a new account.

 

Just as Forza 77 became Jane

 

Beast666 became Rogue Trooper. 

 

 

 

Edited February 26, 2020 by Lost Dragon

[GigerPunk]

1 hour ago, Lost Dragon said:

It's his alright. 

 

It's him trying to be clever.

 

Rogue Trooper was my old user name on RVG forum and Kieren rage quit it,taking his content with him,after the vote to decide if the site should keep the interview i gifted them after I quit (Les Player ATARI UK RIP) should remain, decided it should stay.

 

It was mentioned in the 15 page statement of his.

 

 

It's not actually a new account.

 

Just as Forza 77 became Jane

 

Beast666 became Rogue Trooper. 

 

 

 

Fwiw, I just remembered Kieren DM'd me on Twitter at the end of 2018 about "an absolute asshat stalker" he had. Now, since he's blocked me (not sure when but I suspect after I put Horace on my twitter avatar in solidarity with Octy/RetroPrincess) I can't see those DM's. At least, not on Twitter itself anymore, but what he DM'd me is still perfectly visible in my inbox....

 

Wish I could remember what I'd said, or who the people he said had shown him emails but there we go. Don't know if it's any help, but I thought it was interesting seeing names he considered stalkers (or said was *one* stalker, at least) in 2018, don't know if these accounts were still real people or sockpuppets at that point.

[Paul Wood]

BUT HIS EMAILS etc

[Welshworrier]

Meanwhile, in the snake pit of despair known colloquially as JS3, reality turned left, hitched a ride to what-the-fudge-ville, then tried using a distortion field.

 

So this is his current "safe place"

 

 

 

[Landstalker]

9 hours ago, Welshworrier said:

Meanwhile, in the snake pit of despair known colloquially as JS3, reality turned left, hitched a ride to what-the-fudge-ville, then tried using a distortion field.

 

So this is his current "safe place"

 

 

 

I see the grammar is as amazing as always. "Jeffrey removed from his role".

 

[Welshworrier]

We the admin...

 

All evidence proving the opposite has disappeared from the group, like Roberths recent post about how he hasn't actually been posting for months in the , Im going to close the group in 2 weeks drama queen thread.

 

When you've lost 2 mods, banned people for being spies, convinced yourself there is a conspiracy against you, have no posts above "please buy my game" and "that's wrong, they know nothing", perhaps the problem isn't external.... Just saying.

 

Hey he's even just deleted a post by the other admin that criticised him.

 

[+CyranoJ]

1 hour ago, Welshworrier said:

Hey he's even just deleted a post by the other admin that criticised him.

What other admin? in 3....2....1....

 

He can't say he wasn't warned about Kieren a long, long time ago.  Just like all the others... "Ain't done nuffin to me!"

[StarshipUK]

On 2/25/2020 at 7:25 PM, Felice_Atari said:

The only thing I have done in relation to this thread is to alert Jason Butwell to StarshipUK's potentially defamatory post, saying that Jason was an evil guy. Jason is not and has never been a problem personally or otherwise to me.

 

On the subject of Kieren though, on the other hand, I'm not so sure how to proceed ....

 

I expect there are many people who have not had a problem with him, but there are others who have. I am not the only person to mention him, as there as been several mentions on the facebook threads too, including one of Chris Wilkins posts.

[Welshworrier]

Oh and for those banned on Facebook from seeing his personal account, you can still see the page. Worth reading for such things as the services he offers and the likes he gives people who agree with him that 'O' caused the trouble for Horace.

 

[Guest]

The problem is, of course, that Kizza is the kind of guy who could start a fight in an empty room. He doesn't need other people to blow up he does it himself. He's fighting invisible aggressors and in the process creating real unrest and real enemies in the process. I've said it before and again, he's a fool to himself. Someone on YT said he thought KH was suffering from Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Now I had never actually gone and read the symptoms of NPD before. I

If you do a lot of things seem to make a lot of sense. It isn't ASD he has, it's NPD.

[LED_Storm]

1 hour ago, ∞ Vince ∞ said:

The problem is, of course, that Kizza is the kind of guy who could start a fight in an empty room. He doesn't need other people to blow up he does it himself. He's fighting invisible aggressors and in the process creating real unrest and real enemies in the process. I've said it before and again, he's a fool to himself. Someone on YT said he thought KH was suffering from Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Now I had never actually gone and read the symptoms of NPD before. I

If you do a lot of things seem to make a lot of sense. It isn't ASD he has, it's NPD.

It's absolutely NPD. As I posted in my first post here. I have experience of this, but I wish I didn't. 

 

He won't change, he won't even be able to admit to himself what he's done. The fact that this has being going on nearly 15 years, and it would appear he hasn't changed his behaviour in any way is telling. It will take someone very close to him to physically drag him towards help. Been there, done that.

 

On the other hand, if it isn't NPD, then he's possibly conscious and unapologetic of what he's doing, in which case, we're entering a whole different level of psychopathy. I hope it's NPD rather than the alternative...

 

What he *shouldn't* be doing though is using his alleged autism as an excuse for his behaviour. That is indefensible.

[tomasparks]

1 hour ago, ∞ Vince ∞ said:

Someone on YT said he thought KH was suffering from Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Now I had never actually gone and read the symptoms of NPD before. I

If you do a lot of things seem to make a lot of sense. It isn't ASD he has, it's NPD.

Narcissistic personality disorder seams to fit with what I've read about KH

Quote

Narcissistic personality disorder — one of several types of personality disorders — is a mental condition in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance, a deep need for excessive attention and admiration, troubled relationships, and a lack of empathy for others. But behind this mask of extreme confidence lies a fragile self-esteem that's vulnerable to the slightest criticism.

 

A narcissistic personality disorder causes problems in many areas of life, such as relationships, work, school or financial affairs. People with narcissistic personality disorder may be generally unhappy and disappointed when they're not given the special favors or admiration they believe they deserve. They may find their relationships unfulfilling, and others may not enjoy being around them.

Treatment for narcissistic personality disorder centers around talk therapy (psychotherapy).

 

Symptoms

Signs and symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder and the severity of symptoms vary. People with the disorder can:

• Have an exaggerated sense of self-importance
• Have a sense of entitlement and require constant, excessive admiration
• Expect to be recognized as superior even without achievements that warrant it
• Exaggerate achievements and talents
• Be preoccupied with fantasies about success, power, brilliance, beauty or the perfect mate
• Believe they are superior and can only associate with equally special people
• Monopolize conversations and belittle or look down on people they perceive as inferior
• Expect special favors and unquestioning compliance with their expectations
• Take advantage of others to get what they want
• Have an inability or unwillingness to recognize the needs and feelings of others
• Be envious of others and believe others envy them
• Behave in an arrogant or haughty manner, coming across as conceited, boastful and pretentious
• Insist on having the best of everything — for instance, the best car or office

At the same time, people with narcissistic personality disorder have trouble handling anything they perceive as criticism, and they can:

• Become impatient or angry when they don't receive special treatment
• Have significant interpersonal problems and easily feel slighted
• React with rage or contempt and try to belittle the other person to make themselves appear superior
• Have difficulty regulating emotions and behavior
• Experience major problems dealing with stress and adapting to change
• Feel depressed and moody because they fall short of perfection
• Have secret feelings of insecurity, shame, vulnerability and humiliation

 

[Octav1us]

I appreciate this is as anecdotal as this Martin Robertson fella's claim about how I acted on Twitter (I assume?) is, but I mean during Horacegate I was genuinely in one of the worst places I've been in my life and was rarely if ever online. I never once attacked or blocked anyone (unless they were telling me to kill myself), and this can all be seen in my Twitter history. 

 

Kieren's claim my video where I was giving supporters an update that it was took in multiple shots is insane. Yes, I have acting experience. No I cannot cry on cue. I'll be honest, unlike Kieren I am not a good actor. Thus I resorted to being a charicature on a YouTube channel.

 

That video was one shot, cut down from 15 minutes, then further cut down by my boyfriend, because it was mostly me blubbing and wiping away snot. I'm going to go ahead and call that he reckons I bought onions and chopped them in my hotel room. Cos ya know, I just REALLY wanted to feel suicidal at my best mate's wedding.

 

It stands to reason that the people who would align themselves with Kieren would be just as full of shit as the above screenshotted commenter, someone who saw my early videos where I was pissing about for a laugh and apparently thought "ooo, there's a larger female conspiracy here". It's a shame that a lot of people decide that is reason to believe the dross of people like this.

 

I do still wish him the best. But I do have all the conversations proving him to be a two-faced snake, and indeed the entire DMs between myself and the person he so vehemently defends (despite telling me during Horacegate he was entirely against his actions). 

 

Stop lying, Kieren. And stop humouring the people you know are lying for you. It WILL come back to bite you.

 

Again, please get help. You deserve happiness. You won't find it on what you apparently consider to be a school playground.

 

 

 

[Octav1us]

Sorry - I should just add that up until his bizzare manifesto, he was more than happy to have me listed as someone he had "worked with" on his Patreon page, and I believe his LinkedIn profile.

 

Yet the entire time, he was calling me a worthless slut in private.

 

This thread has been enlightening. I had no idea about any of his previous activities prior to my accqaintance with him. I wish I had. 

 

I only had rumours to go by. And the Steve Davis snooker thing, which was so bizzare I did not believe it. 

 

This man's attack against me was purely misogynistic, because that is all he had. And as such, I do not for a second beleive a sentance of what he wrote about others in his statement.

 

He told me that he had been kicked off forums because they were nasty. They made me not want to come onto places like this.

 

Now I know that was tosh. And the connections I have made on the back of this have been great, so many lovely people.

 

We have already won. ❤️

[RetroPrincess]

Preach.

interestingly I was passed a conversation between K and another person yesterday talking about exactly what he thinks of me (back during the Horace thing).

Its disgusting and frankly offensive on so many levels. I’ve never seen anything like it written about me as a person before and my automatic reaction was to think I must have done these things for him to say it.

then I remembered who we are talking about here and realised that it’s manipulative. Calling me an “attention seeker” who “constantly moans about being poor” and “throws things back in people’s faces”’ is remarkably unfair. And that’s the tip of the iceberg of what you wrote.

 

Yes I’m technically disabled. I’ve got multiple medical problems. I’m autistic. I talk about those things because I’m involved as a charity ambassador and it’s nice for people to think that they aren’t the only ones living with extreme pain. I’m very real online. Anyone who has met me will tell you that I’m a bit more shy in real life but I’m absolutely the same. There’s no split.

I don’t lie or cheat and I certainly don’t do the things you like to accuse me of. 

 

Funnily enough K liked to refer to himself as an autism advocate yet I see no evidence of any advocacy. Like...ambassador work and fundraising for example. The fact that Andrews and K STILL peddle the lie that I refused to donate to charity is deeply offensive and they know it. I save everything. Believe me. I have every single DM, every email, every message. 

 

Oh and having arthritis and being in pain? Yeah well join the pain club. I’ve been up since 2am woot woot.

 

I’m poor? Yeah we have one income. We use my business (sewing licensed plush characters and animal portrait work) to top up where we can. It’s tight. We don’t do much but we are happy. Sometimes I get frustrated and have a moan online because I’d love to do some stuff that I can’t or provide things for my family that I can’t. I don’t release an effing 15 page manifesto of complaints though.

 

Fact is that I threw nothing back in anyone’s face. I asked for a piece of paper. I didn’t call anyone “a liar”.In fact everyone lost their s**t because of your pernicious and spiteful lies. To this day you still have a preoccupation with mine and Sarah’s friendship. I don’t know if that’s jealousy or simple malice but we do talk and we do share information. You seem to think we are pretty dim. Says a lot more about you than us.

 

We are moving on. We are setting up successful things in our lives. And you are still peddling a tricycle round and round a dirt path attempting the same s**t in a different suit. 

 

While i I don’t believe in diagnosing and querying people’s medical history (I get enough of that myself, I’ve seen your opinions on mine) I do think you need to find some help. For the sake of yourself and your family. I have already said that my forgiveness is based on my faith and not excusing your actions...and I was trolled for that (by you) but it still stands because it absolves me of having to care any more. 

 

I wish you peace. Goodness knows you need to find it

[+Sauron]

5 hours ago, Octav1us said:

We have already won. ❤️

Indeed we have, but at the same time it's best to remain vigilant so that no one else has to go through the things that we did with him. That doesn't mean focusing on the pain he caused, but on having a stronger bond between the members of each community so that no one can come through and tear them apart again. There are plenty of positives coming about due to everything coming out in the open, and I'd love to see those positives continue.