gobo Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Hey there! Was looking to get back into the ST. Just bought a 1mb STm on ebay. From what I understand, unlike the 8-bits, it's still hard to connect to modern displays. I was looking around on Amazon and came across this device. Could you hook it up to an ST with a ST2VGA cable and then to a modern display using a VGA to HDMI cable/converter. Know it's not cheap but was wondering if you guys think it would even work. https://www.amazon.com/AllAboutAdapters-15Khz-RGsB-Converter-Scaler/dp/B074GC2K2F Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzac Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 It’s way cheaper to get a NEC multisync display they go for around 20/30€ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larrylaffer Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 First of all you need an ST to VGA cable. Then a monitor like @anzac described that can receive 15kHz vertical sync. Alternatively you need something like a scan doubler which will take your 15kHz signal from the ST and make it 30kHz. Then you can connect your ST (or any other retro computer with thre right cable) to any size monitor pretty much (and some people will argue why doing that ?). Another option is ti get an ST to SCART and do something similar. Be aware that the ST series has color and monochrome modes, so your cables need to be chosen accordingly. Finally there are other gizmos that claim to work for all modes/ resolutions but personally I didn't have much luck with these... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+SoulBuster Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 This is what I use along with a monitor that supports 15Khz. https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/store2/#0107 Looks like he is currently out, but in the pinned "links" thread at the top of this forum, there are other vendors that have similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larrylaffer Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 1 minute ago, SoulBuster said: This is what I use along with a monitor that supports 15Khz. https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/store2/#0107 Interestingly this is "the gizmo that never worked for me" ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzac Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 I have two ST2VGA adapters (not the UBE) and they display fine all resolutions with the NEC LCDs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParanoidLittleMan Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 1 hour ago, gobo said: ... From what I understand, unlike the 8-bits, it's still hard to connect to modern displays ... Not true. Practically all home computers from that era, so 1980-1993 were designed to work with regular televisions from that time. Some even did not have video output, just RF (antenna conn.) Sinclair Spectrum for instance. C64 had only composite, but not RGB output. So, they had PAL or NTSC video signal in forms: RF, Composite PAL or NTSC and RGB . Atari STM is what had all it. And plus for those times high-res at ergonomically 71 Hz - monochrome mode, what needed special monitor, for professionals mostly. You can not connect C64 or Amiga 500 to some VGA monitor. Exception may be mentioned multisync monitors, but they are not easy to find, and need special cable. And only for RGB mode, so no C64, sorry ? Possible solutions in 2020: using old, fat CRT TV, best if has RGB input - less and less likely, since they extinct, to say so. Using some old, fat CRT monitor - like Atari's one - same as above ... Using mentioned multisync monitor. There are threads around (in this forum too) which deal with it, lists of usable ones for ST ... That may cost not much depending on luck. Using some so called scan converter. There is many of it in offer, and quality, prices differ a lot. Good ones aren't cheap, and may cost as much as new TV: Using some new(er) flat screen TV with Scart input. I know that they are not available in US, but here in Eu are, and prices are in range of 100-150 Eu for smaller ones, and who needs large Atari monitor ? All need to do is proper cable, where hardest part is to find Atari 13 pin video connector. Of course can order Atari ST - Scart cable. What may be with added switch for monochrome mode. But not all TVs can work at 71 Hz - like mine Philips. I don't see it as big flaw, since I barely need it, and I can use my newer monitor for it with simple cable. Actually, getting new TV is ideal for those who need monitor or another monitor for their modern computer - and can get it for price of some converter. Then using with oldie or newie, watch TV, recorded stuff in all possible formats, and even can record TV programs (USB connector). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParanoidLittleMan Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 13 minutes ago, anzac said: I have two ST2VGA adapters (not the UBE) and they display fine all resolutions with the NEC LCDs Hmmm ... I'm not sure that 'adapter' is right name. And you said NEC LCDs - which ones ? If multisync, there is no any conversion needed, done. Then is basically same as linked UBE (what is out of stock at moment, as I see). Just properly connected lines, mode switch, + regulators for volume and video levels (certainly useful and needed in many cases) . Mentioned "autodetection of resolution (in software). " - I don't think that it is much useful, but affects price. Simple switch on adapter can serve, and people do not change video mode so often that it will exhaust them ? What I want to say, is that such 'adapter' is really easy to make, from cheap components. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzac Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 2 hours ago, ParanoidLittleMan said: Hmmm ... I'm not sure that 'adapter' is right name. And you said NEC LCDs - which ones ? If multisync, there is no any conversion needed, done. Then is basically same as linked UBE (what is out of stock at moment, as I see). Just properly connected lines, mode switch, + regulators for volume and video levels (certainly useful and needed in many cases) . Mentioned "autodetection of resolution (in software). " - I don't think that it is much useful, but affects price. Simple switch on adapter can serve, and people do not change video mode so often that it will exhaust them ? What I want to say, is that such 'adapter' is really easy to make, from cheap components. I have two NEC 1990LX or NX, they're pretty cheap... the "adapters" and described as such that I opted are these: https://centuriontech.eu/product/st2vga-black/ i found they were good enough for my needs without the extra cost of the UBEs. ive bought more things from centurion and the guy is awesome, I could not recommend more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParanoidLittleMan Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 Yeah, that's exactly what I talked about. There is switch, and it works so, that connects R, G, B, lines from computer to monitor R,G,B in color mode, and connects monochrome out to all 3 in mono mode (to get white) , + connects mono sensor to GND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goochman Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 About 10 years ago someone was selling a converter box to handle ST color rez through VGA. It doesnt handle mono (prob could be wasnt setup that way). Anyhow the item you linked you most likely would work except for 1 small problem - sound. The VGA signal doesnt carry sound so any monitor cable connection you get needs to have some RCA jacks to connect to an external speaker. I box I have for does this. Mono is much simplier from what I gather. I have a simple VGA adaptor with inline RCA jacks to handle mono - seems the color modes are a bit more tricky. I recently had my MEga 2 hooked up to my 42" LCD TV and Mono mode looks nice - Med ok - low res, holy cow everything is so big! Happy to take pictures of what I got if there is interest. Id love to find an HDMI solution which covers all 3 modes with sound to the TV but dont think that exists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+SoulBuster Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 This device has an audio jack for sound. That big black wheel is for volume. "3.5mm A/V connector with volume control" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParanoidLittleMan Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 2 hours ago, Goochman said: ... you get needs to have some RCA jacks to connect to an external speaker. - Med ok - low res, holy cow everything is so big! .... Id love to find an HDMI solution which covers all 3 modes with sound to the TV but dont think that exists. RCA is not mandatory for external speaker. You can use whatever connector you want on cable. Of course that is big - 320x200 px on 1920x1080 res monitor - that's 6x bigger pixel size at Atari. Adding analog audio to HDMI converter would increase price. And: are now some monitors with internal speakers equipped only with HDMI, without analog audio in ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzac Posted January 30, 2020 Share Posted January 30, 2020 3 hours ago, Goochman said: Id love to find an HDMI solution which covers all 3 modes with sound to the TV but dont think that exists. https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/How-to-hook-up-retro-consoles-to-High-Definition-TVs-via-HDMI i use a framemeister with my Jag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jefffulton Posted February 4, 2020 Share Posted February 4, 2020 There are a couple options along with what has been stated above. 1. That box you have in the link is good for non STE NTSC machines. You just need a 9 pin DIN to VGA cable that Best Electronics sells. 2. I have purchased an tried a simple option from Cool Novelties that will do ST Monitor out to Composite (RCA). It works will too and is cheap : https://www.ebay.com/itm/ATARI-ST-QUALITY-GOLD-RCA-PHONO-TV-AUDIO-VIDEO-CABLE-OFC-2M-/390232521592 - but the quality is a step down from the VGA option #1, BUT it is $125+ cheaper. Med resolution is just ok, but for games it looks and and play great. 3. Also from Cool Novelties you can get a RGB to SCART Cable, and then a SCART to HDMI box. This works well with my STE and is the best and cleanest solution, but you take your chances with the SCART to HDMI box not working properly. Here is the one i just purchased for my brother and it hooks a PAL STE up to HDMI very well:https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01N06Q9WH/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 #2 is the most simple, easiest thing to try first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobo Posted February 4, 2020 Author Share Posted February 4, 2020 On 1/29/2020 at 3:25 PM, anzac said: I have two NEC 1990LX or NX, they're pretty cheap... the "adapters" and described as such that I opted are these: https://centuriontech.eu/product/st2vga-black/ i found they were good enough for my needs without the extra cost of the UBEs. ive bought more things from centurion and the guy is awesome, I could not recommend more Weird. I typed up a reply a few days ago but it's not here. Must not have hit submit! There seems to be more options than I originally thought. If I understand though, if I buy a "ST2VGA Black" and use it with any of the monitors or TVs on lists like the one at Best Electronics Here: http://www.best-electronics-ca.com/monadapt.htm ...then I can use all three ST modes on those panels that cover the 15khz to 70khz range. I can't use the SCART solutions because I live in the USA. The device I mentioned in the first post might work also albeit expensively. I like the small size of the ST2VGA Black and that it has a button to switch between color and mono. I wish there was also something similar that would plug into the Floppy Drive port for SD cards. I want to keep things compact. Back in the day I had an STF then STE then Falcon030 but I always like the original STm's sleek form factor the best. Now I've finally got one with 1mb one that looks great. Once I get it connected to a screen I'll know if it actually works !! :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzac Posted February 4, 2020 Share Posted February 4, 2020 17 minutes ago, gobo said: Weird. I typed up a reply a few days ago but it's not here. Must not have hit submit! There seems to be more options than I originally thought. If I understand though, if I buy a "ST2VGA Black" and use it with any of the monitors or TVs on lists like the one at Best Electronics Here: http://www.best-electronics-ca.com/monadapt.htm ...then I can use all three ST modes on those panels that cover the 15khz to 70khz range. I can't use the SCART solutions because I live in the USA. The device I mentioned in the first post might work also albeit expensively. I like the small size of the ST2VGA Black and that it has a button to switch between color and mono. I wish there was also something similar that would plug into the Floppy Drive port for SD cards. I want to keep things compact. Back in the day I had an STF then STE then Falcon030 but I always like the original STm's sleek form factor the best. Now I've finally got one with 1mb one that looks great. Once I get it connected to a screen I'll know if it actually works !! Couple of points, there are SD card solutions like the Ultrasatan and Cosmosex and if you don't know yet if the machine works, just buy a <5$ ST to VGA mono only cable and test it with any standard VGA capable monitor. Any PC monitor will work as long as it has a VGA port. It will only display hi resolution mono but you'll know for sure before investing more serious money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jefffulton Posted February 4, 2020 Share Posted February 4, 2020 15 hours ago, gobo said: Weird. I typed up a reply a few days ago but it's not here. Must not have hit submit! There seems to be more options than I originally thought. If I understand though, if I buy a "ST2VGA Black" and use it with any of the monitors or TVs on lists like the one at Best Electronics Here: http://www.best-electronics-ca.com/monadapt.htm ...then I can use all three ST modes on those panels that cover the 15khz to 70khz range. I can't use the SCART solutions because I live in the USA. The device I mentioned in the first post might work also albeit expensively. I like the small size of the ST2VGA Black and that it has a button to switch between color and mono. I wish there was also something similar that would plug into the Floppy Drive port for SD cards. I want to keep things compact. Back in the day I had an STF then STE then Falcon030 but I always like the original STm's sleek form factor the best. Now I've finally got one with 1mb one that looks great. Once I get it connected to a screen I'll know if it actually works !! I use SCART as a pass through here the USA. The output from the ST RGB to a SCART to HDMI box should work fine, but I am using a PAL STE, so I can't guarantee the signal will will 100% compatible. With my USA STFM I use the The Box you have listed at the top. It will work with all three resolutions if you get the Best Electronic ST RGB to VGA cable to plug into it though. RGB to RCA Composite solution is small and cheap, but I don't think it will output high res B/W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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